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MasterFischer
Profile Joined August 2009
Denmark836 Posts
July 23 2010 10:28 GMT
#8221
CRAZY game between TLO and Tester..

Best 2nd round I have seen i think...

I love TvP
WHO is this who speaks to me as though I needed his advice?
FrogOfWar
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany1406 Posts
July 23 2010 10:41 GMT
#8222
On July 23 2010 19:00 Baarn wrote:
The price of living in a different time zone unfortunately, i guess, so you gotta deal with spoilers.
I guess he could combine them in one big file, like gomtv does with some of the matches, but you gotta ask day9.


Actually no, it is fine as it is in the OP - always showing three games even if only two have been played makes it spoiler-free. The trouble is the big delay before these links are updated.
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9407 Posts
July 23 2010 10:46 GMT
#8223
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.

+ Show Spoiler +
Game 2 was definately the best game i've seen in phase 2. Both players macro was lacking though, but it was entairtaning as hell. And you kind of knew that TLO would win when it got into late game, as he is so strong in these type of games where he can harass and then get BCs. In game 3 I was pretty much expecting Tester to get VR, as they are strong as hell, and IMO a bit overpowered right now. Tester didn't even hide his starport, but there is almost no need for it as VR are so strong. I mean a VR can easily own like 6-7 marines. And unless you micro the viking extremely well, which TLO failed to do, the game is over.
mongojazZ
Profile Joined July 2010
Germany43 Posts
July 23 2010 10:53 GMT
#8224
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.

+ Show Spoiler +
Game 2 was definately the best game i've seen in phase 2. Both players macro was lacking though, but it was entairtaning as hell. And you kind of knew that TLO would win when it got into late game, as he is so strong in these type of games where he can harass and then get BCs. In game 3 I was pretty much expecting Tester to get VR, as they are strong as hell, and IMO a bit overpowered right now. Tester didn't even hide his starport, but there is almost no need for it as VR are so strong. I mean a VR can easily own like 6-7 marines. And unless you micro the viking extremely well, which TLO failed to do, the game is over.


+ Show Spoiler +
The downfall of TLO was that Tester was able to charge his Void Ray up just before engaging the Viking. I guess his harass with that one hellion took too much focus away from getting a Viking out as soon as possible - he could've intercepted the Void Ray. I think TLO lost that game due to the lack of scouting, which is a pity, because game 3 was kind of anticlimactic after that very intense game 2.

Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has.
Necrosjef
Profile Joined March 2010
United Kingdom530 Posts
July 23 2010 11:25 GMT
#8225
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.


I was hoping for Tester to win 2-0. The 2nd game was entertaining however at one point I was practically screaming at Tester through time and space to begin spamming mass voidrays. He seemed to get his immortal templar army up and then didn't really do anything except try and deal with harassment whilst TLO build 10+ battlecruisers. By that time Tester had nothing to defend against them. Was a shame.

3rd game was pretty bad with TLO losing to the cheese, kinda expected him to be able to deal with the voidray but he simply put too much faith into that hellion harass, Tester obviously expected it and knew TLO wouldn't have much anti air units and was able to exploit that.

Looking forward to seeing IdrA play, I would be disappointed if IdrA didn't go through I would like to see one Zerg player in the semi-finals.
Europe Server Diamond Player: ID=Necrosjef Code=957
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9407 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-23 11:46:44
July 23 2010 11:44 GMT
#8226
On July 23 2010 19:53 mongojazZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.

+ Show Spoiler +
Game 2 was definately the best game i've seen in phase 2. Both players macro was lacking though, but it was entairtaning as hell. And you kind of knew that TLO would win when it got into late game, as he is so strong in these type of games where he can harass and then get BCs. In game 3 I was pretty much expecting Tester to get VR, as they are strong as hell, and IMO a bit overpowered right now. Tester didn't even hide his starport, but there is almost no need for it as VR are so strong. I mean a VR can easily own like 6-7 marines. And unless you micro the viking extremely well, which TLO failed to do, the game is over.


+ Show Spoiler +
The downfall of TLO was that Tester was able to charge his Void Ray up just before engaging the Viking. I guess his harass with that one hellion took too much focus away from getting a Viking out as soon as possible - he could've intercepted the Void Ray. I think TLO lost that game due to the lack of scouting, which is a pity, because game 3 was kind of anticlimactic after that very intense game 2.



+ Show Spoiler +
TLO scouted as much as anybody did in that game. As soon as the scvc left Testers base he started building a starport. And soon after TLO began his harass, and then becan building a viking asap. There was pretty much nothing else he could done giving he would open that way. However you could critize him for trying that opening giving the starting positions. But really how can you as terran do anything against the void ray except for some sick viking micro, or having 7+ marines?

How could he have intercepted the void ray? I think he almost got the viking out as soon as possible in that game. IMO blizzard should increase the build time of the VR after fazing has been discovered as 1) Startport can he impossilbe to scout as terran. 2) Marines are barely cost effective against VR+ definately not build time effective against CB VRs unless you have lots of barracks/reactors.
mongojazZ
Profile Joined July 2010
Germany43 Posts
July 23 2010 12:21 GMT
#8227
On July 23 2010 20:44 Hider wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 19:53 mongojazZ wrote:
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.

+ Show Spoiler +
Game 2 was definately the best game i've seen in phase 2. Both players macro was lacking though, but it was entairtaning as hell. And you kind of knew that TLO would win when it got into late game, as he is so strong in these type of games where he can harass and then get BCs. In game 3 I was pretty much expecting Tester to get VR, as they are strong as hell, and IMO a bit overpowered right now. Tester didn't even hide his starport, but there is almost no need for it as VR are so strong. I mean a VR can easily own like 6-7 marines. And unless you micro the viking extremely well, which TLO failed to do, the game is over.


+ Show Spoiler +
The downfall of TLO was that Tester was able to charge his Void Ray up just before engaging the Viking. I guess his harass with that one hellion took too much focus away from getting a Viking out as soon as possible - he could've intercepted the Void Ray. I think TLO lost that game due to the lack of scouting, which is a pity, because game 3 was kind of anticlimactic after that very intense game 2.



+ Show Spoiler +
TLO scouted as much as anybody did in that game. As soon as the scvc left Testers base he started building a starport. And soon after TLO began his harass, and then becan building a viking asap. There was pretty much nothing else he could done giving he would open that way. However you could critize him for trying that opening giving the starting positions. But really how can you as terran do anything against the void ray except for some sick viking micro, or having 7+ marines?

How could he have intercepted the void ray? I think he almost got the viking out as soon as possible in that game. IMO blizzard should increase the build time of the VR after fazing has been discovered as 1) Startport can he impossilbe to scout as terran. 2) Marines are barely cost effective against VR+ definately not build time effective against CB VRs unless you have lots of barracks/reactors.


+ Show Spoiler +
In retrospective, it's always easier to say things, yet TLO could've sacrificed that SCV to either know what's going on or to delay the Stargate (since Tester probably wouldn't have started to build it until the SCV was either dead or out of sight). Concerning the Viking, it doesn't get build right the second the starport is finished for TLO, and it truly is a matter of seconds whether he's able to repel the Void Ray attack or not. But I agree with you that it's very hard to counter VRs when spawning so close to each other - I've had my share of problems with it as well.
Nothing is more fairly distributed than common sense: no one thinks he needs more of it than he already has.
BillyMole
Profile Joined March 2010
United States118 Posts
July 23 2010 12:40 GMT
#8228
On July 23 2010 18:43 Necrosjef wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 18:05 Bommes wrote:
On July 23 2010 17:34 Necrosjef wrote:
So funny how imba Terran is qxc vs Dimaga 2-0 very easy even though Dimaga is miles better.


qxc's micro was miles ahead and his strategies completely outplayed Dimaga. So please tell me why you think Dimaga is miles better.
I think TvZ favors Terran atm, but you are just ignorant and don't respect qxc's really good play. If a Zerg is miles better, he will still win against Terran. From my point of view Dimaga just wasn't that good in these 2 games.


Pretty ignorant from you if you don't know that Dimaga is a better player than qxc. No offense to qxc but he hasn't won anything to my knowledge where as Dimaga has won ZOTAC a bunch of times and he was in the final of the SC2 world cup, and beat a lot of top Koreans to get there.


Dimaga's good, yes, but that does not mean he played well in those games. He exercised extremely poor strategic decision making in both games, and the sad thing is, he could have easily won. His first half-dozen mutalisks forced the Thors to come out, yet he continued to mass mutalisks in both games and, predictably, got rolled. Had he stopped at a half dozen mutalisks and quickly switched to a roach/hydra mix, he would have steamrolled the hellion/marine/thor composition qxc had when he attacked, since there was not a tank in sight. Even low-level players know you do not keep massing mutalisks when your opponent has thors.

Additionally, his fast-gold on Metal was a nice, aggressive move, but he totally failed to exploit it. He needlessly ate hellion harass multiple times on the gold drone line, and he could have very easily avoided that with three more well-placed spine crawlers. He chose to only build one, and qxc punished him for it.

Dimaga is not the only good player to be playing poorly in this tournament, either. WhiteRa is very good, yet every single game he seems to be either trying to cheese, or going forge FE. Seems to me he forgot all the other strategies.
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9407 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-23 12:42:18
July 23 2010 12:41 GMT
#8229
On July 23 2010 21:21 mongojazZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 20:44 Hider wrote:
On July 23 2010 19:53 mongojazZ wrote:
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.

+ Show Spoiler +
Game 2 was definately the best game i've seen in phase 2. Both players macro was lacking though, but it was entairtaning as hell. And you kind of knew that TLO would win when it got into late game, as he is so strong in these type of games where he can harass and then get BCs. In game 3 I was pretty much expecting Tester to get VR, as they are strong as hell, and IMO a bit overpowered right now. Tester didn't even hide his starport, but there is almost no need for it as VR are so strong. I mean a VR can easily own like 6-7 marines. And unless you micro the viking extremely well, which TLO failed to do, the game is over.


+ Show Spoiler +
The downfall of TLO was that Tester was able to charge his Void Ray up just before engaging the Viking. I guess his harass with that one hellion took too much focus away from getting a Viking out as soon as possible - he could've intercepted the Void Ray. I think TLO lost that game due to the lack of scouting, which is a pity, because game 3 was kind of anticlimactic after that very intense game 2.



+ Show Spoiler +
TLO scouted as much as anybody did in that game. As soon as the scvc left Testers base he started building a starport. And soon after TLO began his harass, and then becan building a viking asap. There was pretty much nothing else he could done giving he would open that way. However you could critize him for trying that opening giving the starting positions. But really how can you as terran do anything against the void ray except for some sick viking micro, or having 7+ marines?

How could he have intercepted the void ray? I think he almost got the viking out as soon as possible in that game. IMO blizzard should increase the build time of the VR after fazing has been discovered as 1) Startport can he impossilbe to scout as terran. 2) Marines are barely cost effective against VR+ definately not build time effective against CB VRs unless you have lots of barracks/reactors.


+ Show Spoiler +
In retrospective, it's always easier to say things, yet TLO could've sacrificed that SCV to either know what's going on or to delay the Stargate (since Tester probably wouldn't have started to build it until the SCV was either dead or out of sight). Concerning the Viking, it doesn't get build right the second the starport is finished for TLO, and it truly is a matter of seconds whether he's able to repel the Void Ray attack or not. But I agree with you that it's very hard to counter VRs when spawning so close to each other - I've had my share of problems with it as well.


+ Show Spoiler +

Well I didn't think TLO waited more than 5 sec to build the viking, and this is kind of the problem with the VR right now. Because you have to play incredible well to defend it. While the protoss player just have to charge up the VR and then eventually shift click marines. Any gold player can learn this, and imagine how strong this kind of play is gonna be against terran players with apm of less than 100? He will have almost no chance of definding this. THis is why I feel the VR is kind of overpowered, because the terran has to scout alot (not easy as Tester actually could have placed the startport at any place of his map, and then the terran player would never have spotted it without a hellion).

When every protoss player begin going VR against terran (at least at maps with short flight distances), Terran players are going to start out by massing marines with early stim. This is my predicition, because Terrant can really afford to get tanks out early game right now without being 100% sure of the p player going 4gate or 3gate/robo. You could even imagine the protoss players doing a lot of fake builds. Like building a robo bay or 2 gate when the terrans scans, and then immediately cancel them and get a starport. So well unless Blizzard nerfs the VR (like increasing building time), I imagine Terrans having a lot of difficulties with protoss in the future. Not just because the the protoss player will build VRs, but also because of the threat of the VR. If the protoss player decides to hide to gateways in a 4gate all in, the terran player has no chance of knowing what the p player does, and if he do the 1/1/1 build he will have to get at least 1 early vikings out combined with constant marine production, and this mean that he will have lots of trouble dealing with the protoss rush.

Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9407 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-23 12:54:47
July 23 2010 12:54 GMT
#8230
On July 23 2010 21:40 BillyMole wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 18:43 Necrosjef wrote:
On July 23 2010 18:05 Bommes wrote:
On July 23 2010 17:34 Necrosjef wrote:
So funny how imba Terran is qxc vs Dimaga 2-0 very easy even though Dimaga is miles better.


qxc's micro was miles ahead and his strategies completely outplayed Dimaga. So please tell me why you think Dimaga is miles better.
I think TvZ favors Terran atm, but you are just ignorant and don't respect qxc's really good play. If a Zerg is miles better, he will still win against Terran. From my point of view Dimaga just wasn't that good in these 2 games.


Pretty ignorant from you if you don't know that Dimaga is a better player than qxc. No offense to qxc but he hasn't won anything to my knowledge where as Dimaga has won ZOTAC a bunch of times and he was in the final of the SC2 world cup, and beat a lot of top Koreans to get there.


Dimaga's good, yes, but that does not mean he played well in those games. He exercised extremely poor strategic decision making in both games, and the sad thing is, he could have easily won. His first half-dozen mutalisks forced the Thors to come out, yet he continued to mass mutalisks in both games and, predictably, got rolled. Had he stopped at a half dozen mutalisks and quickly switched to a roach/hydra mix, he would have steamrolled the hellion/marine/thor composition qxc had when he attacked, since there was not a tank in sight. Even low-level players know you do not keep massing mutalisks when your opponent has thors.

Additionally, his fast-gold on Metal was a nice, aggressive move, but he totally failed to exploit it. He needlessly ate hellion harass multiple times on the gold drone line, and he could have very easily avoided that with three more well-placed spine crawlers. He chose to only build one, and qxc punished him for it.

Dimaga is not the only good player to be playing poorly in this tournament, either. WhiteRa is very good, yet every single game he seems to be either trying to cheese, or going forge FE. Seems to me he forgot all the other strategies.


+ Show Spoiler +
I completely agree with you here. Dimaga played surprisingly bad. And I cant understand why players like Idra/Artosis expect him to continue to dominate. His play style has so far through the beta been extremely cheesy, and more and more players will learn how to counter that. And if he really is a better player than QXC, why didn't he choose to play long macro games, instead of risky all-in builds? In game1 against QXC, QXC even did the build that Dimagas was supposed to counter. Lings+ roach should in theory > hellions +2-3 marines. However 1 scouting scvc saw the roaches, and QXC put down a bunker, and then Dimaga wasn't even close to be able to break the line... IMO what a poor strategy. 1 scouting scvc and the strat didn't work?

Ok he had a follow. Expand and then mass muta. But this was easily countered by getting a few thors out, yet Dimaga kept producing mutas? Why not get transition qucikly into roach/hydra? IMO only thing that could make Dimaga win the game were for some kind of metagame reasons, in which QXC would expect Dimaga to transtition into roach/hydra and therefore stop building thors and instead get tanks. However there are a lot of assumptions in this one. And IMO the best player should take the more "safe game approach" instead of allin cheasy, high variance approach. I know ZvT is a bit imbalanced right now, but still...

In game 2, I throught he played pretty bad as well. Why not just a copule more spine crawlers instead of losing all those lings. Sure its better losing lings than drones, but it just did not seem like very good execution by Dimaga.
simples
Profile Joined April 2010
United Kingdom54 Posts
July 23 2010 12:57 GMT
#8231
TLO didn't lose because void rays are imba. Call me biased, but in all three games Tester was playing better, even in the second game where that one mistake probably cost him the game. Even then TLO had a big advantage at the beginning and then it became so close intill late game. Mech is the thing that is imba not void rays, that require micro.

P.S. Anyway, TLO is playing IdrA next so that would be a easy win as Terran mech is so imba against Zerg.
OptimoPeach
Profile Joined July 2009
United States137 Posts
July 23 2010 13:17 GMT
#8232
On July 23 2010 21:57 simples wrote:
P.S. Anyway, TLO is playing IdrA next so that would be a easy win as Terran mech is so imba against Zerg.

Yeah because TLO had a bunch of easy wins against Idra in the Altitude TLI Invitional, right? And I think those games were even before that last mech nerf
kilaen
Profile Joined July 2010
United States10 Posts
July 23 2010 13:56 GMT
#8233
Epic match between TLO and tester last night. Wow, looking forward to re-watching it today.
Conventer
Profile Joined May 2010
Poland72 Posts
July 23 2010 15:04 GMT
#8234
Hmm i think after i have seen TLO i think i will use more nukes as i used when i started
Graven
Profile Joined June 2010
United States314 Posts
July 23 2010 15:20 GMT
#8235
On July 23 2010 20:25 Necrosjef wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 23 2010 19:46 Hider wrote:
I've never found my self rooting so my much for one person in a game as when TLO played Tester. Pretty weird as I usually root for the player that isn't the fan's favourite. However I just love everything about TLOs playstyle. Its so great for this game.


I was hoping for Tester to win 2-0. The 2nd game was entertaining however at one point I was practically screaming at Tester through time and space to begin spamming mass voidrays. He seemed to get his immortal templar army up and then didn't really do anything except try and deal with harassment whilst TLO build 10+ battlecruisers. By that time Tester had nothing to defend against them. Was a shame.

3rd game was pretty bad with TLO losing to the cheese, kinda expected him to be able to deal with the voidray but he simply put too much faith into that hellion harass, Tester obviously expected it and knew TLO wouldn't have much anti air units and was able to exploit that.

Looking forward to seeing IdrA play, I would be disappointed if IdrA didn't go through I would like to see one Zerg player in the semi-finals.


QFT.

I was cringing the entire second half of game 2 because Tester didn't move to counter anything TLO was doing.

As for the next matchup, I'm excited and annoyed at the same time...I really wanted to see TLO and Idra make the semis...I'm not sure either can beat Tester in a series anyway though, so maybe it doesn't matter...a Korean finals seems like the most logical outcome.
Rider
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands127 Posts
July 23 2010 15:29 GMT
#8236
Got my new shirt in the mail, thought this thread would be an appropriate place to put it

[image loading]
My grandpa could've proxied better. And not only does he have arthritis, he's also dead.
Jubuntu
Profile Joined July 2009
United States15 Posts
July 23 2010 17:44 GMT
#8237
Rwar trying to catch up on everything that Day 9 has added recently but my bandwidth connection seems to be too slow blip.tv now... Anyone know if there is way to set the stream to a lower quality like 360 or 480?
Kindred
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada396 Posts
July 23 2010 17:48 GMT
#8238
"In faith, in war, nothing is sacred"
I fuckin hate this commercial omg
Two 2.93GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon “Westmere” (12 cores) + 32GB RAM + Four 512GB Solid-State Drives + Two ATI Radeon HD 5770 1GB + Two Apple LED Cinema Display (27" flat panel) + Quad-channel 4Gb Fibre Channel PCI Express card
Typhon
Profile Joined July 2009
United States387 Posts
July 23 2010 18:29 GMT
#8239
On July 24 2010 00:29 Rider wrote:
Got my new shirt in the mail, thought this thread would be an appropriate place to put it

[image loading]


Let us divine.... let us divine... Oh, that's a HUGE blunder. But its the *most normal* thing in the world.
Chesner
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Iceland817 Posts
July 23 2010 18:32 GMT
#8240
On July 24 2010 02:48 Kindred wrote:
"In faith, in war, nothing is sacred"
I fuckin hate this commercial omg


The NFL one annoys me more ><
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