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Sup TL,
We all know reaper in the early WoL era was very overpowered against zerg with the 5 rax reaper rush strategy.The reason reaper was extremely powerful because it could take down buildings and the queen range was only 3 at the time.
Now in Hots, reaper have a normal otherwise miniscule damage against building, making them only viable in picking off workers and light units. In the interest of promoting more variety of early game play options in TvX matches, I think the factory requirement of the nitro pack should be eliminated so reapers become a better early option.
I feel the reaper is becoming the forgotten unit, especially because it can't be used anywhere but the early game. It should at least be a good early game unit, but not OP. The new ranged queen and MC should be able to handle the reaper if handled properly.
Thanks for reading.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
Agree, they're already coming later with barracks after supply, and zergs got 5-range queens.
Eh, those old awesome times, when I've tried to defend my drones and slowlings from spedreapers, it was fun as zerg during wol beta 
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You are aware that reapers already received a buff in HOTS right? Reapers can see up cliffs and have their own personalized medivacs. I don't know how youve been using the reaper but three rax reaper builds are extremely powerful in in TvZ and TvT. If you made the nitro pack upgrade a default upgrade, reapers would be imba.
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Don't forget that Roaches only had 3 range too.
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On November 08 2012 07:59 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:
You are aware that reapers already received a buff in HOTS right? Reapers can see up cliffs and have their own personalized medivacs. I don't know how youve been using the reaper but three rax reaper builds are extremely powerful in in TvZ and TvT. If you made the nitro pack upgrade a default upgrade, reapers would be imba.
I think he's just asking for it to be bumped up to Rax instead of Factory.
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On November 08 2012 07:59 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:
You are aware that reapers already received a buff in HOTS right? Reapers can see up cliffs and have their own personalized medivacs. I don't know how youve been using the reaper but three rax reaper builds are extremely powerful in in TvZ and TvT. If you made the nitro pack upgrade a default upgrade, reapers would be imba.
I think there is a good point to be made about putting nitro back to techlab only tech, and this could be balanced easily with a buildtime mod for the upg (increased 20ish sec) if need be.
The original nerf was done before buffs recieved to the natural counters to reapers, and without the anti-building attack the reaper threat is significantly less powerful (no more oops no more pylon effect, or sorry about your spire/roachwarren/pool etc...). The OP makes a good point and i wish somone would test it  .
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wow, this sounds interesting, totally didn't consider that...
would this ruin 2v2 again though?
I think i would rather have nitro pack be at the barracks, and them not have healing. Honestly, doesn't self healing feel really weird on that sort of terran unit? it feels forced... there should be a way for reaper drops to work or reapers to be used later in the game too (i was sure they could figure out a way to make them work lategame vs mass zealot, because even though they are gas expensive and take long to build, terran already has a large gas bank and reapers are 1 supply, but now they have battle hellions for that role)
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At first glance it doesn't seem like a bad idea. I can't think of anything where it could be abused.
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I win like 90% of my TvT games with 3 Rax Reaper Expand into Bio. It's truth that Reaper is only good early game, but not so sure about an earlier speed upgrade. Healing when out of combat is like really good, since not matter how much damage you deal to your opponent(T), it's like free damage, and not to mention Reapers own Marines.
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If you were to bring the nitro pack back to barracks, maybe it could be nerfed a bit to compensate for the other new reaper benefits. A nerf could be like added time for research or cost bump to 100/100.
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I'd say hell yes, but this would pretty much guarantee everyone going reaper openings most of the time in TvT.
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On November 08 2012 07:06 sona wrote:
Sup TL,
We all know reaper in the early WoL era was very overpowered against zerg with the 5 rax reaper rush strategy.The reason reaper was extremely powerful because it could take down buildings and the queen range was only 3 at the time.
Now in Hots, reaper have a normal otherwise miniscule damage against building, making them only viable in picking off workers and light units. In the interest of promoting more variety of early game play options in TvX matches, I think the factory requirement of the nitro pack should be eliminated so reapers become a better early option.
I feel the reaper is becoming the forgotten unit, especially because it can't be used anywhere but the early game. It should at least be a good early game unit, but not OP. The new ranged queen and MC should be able to handle the reaper if handled properly.
Thanks for reading.
Totally agree. If they are early game, then why make them only usable in the mid game? Its ridiculous. Reapers need that upgrade or they get killed immediately.
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Totally agree as well. By giving terran more early game options, it solidifies the argument that they don't need a new unit (or at least quiets the whimpers). Reworking the reaper into a good opening option instead of a slight build order deviation is a good move.
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On November 08 2012 11:11 Inquisitor1323 wrote:
I'd say hell yes, but this would pretty much guarantee everyone going reaper openings most of the time in TvT.
If you scout it in time, could always go bunker + marines until tank/marauder comes out. If the opponent does make reapers, they are force to do damage or else they will fall behind.
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I suppose the point was to do a mass reaper marine medivac mid game play.
But frankly the cost of such as army is too high.
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I'd probably want to wait a little before bumping Nitro pack back to rax. Reapers have already recieved a few buffs in HotS. We should probably wait and see how it turns out, how much reapers are used a few months into HotS. If reapers are neglected then like they are now your change can be reconsidered. Besides, you want reapers to be used in the midgame right? If so, Nitro pack are fine on factory imo.
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Roach range 4 actually fixed every problem Reapers made except the Speed Upgrade. It is to strong to be available with Tech lab only. Sure they could make it 100/100 and increase the research time. But at the end it would be weaker then getting your factory out asap. (you would have no factory obviously, just the upgrade)
Speed Reaper in the early game couldn't be stopped though, especially with self heal. Queen and slow Roach wouldn't matter same as lings (who can help defending against Reapers on creep, if Reapers had speed they could not). So Imo the Speed Upgrade is at the perfect spot.
Not that I worry that Blizzard doesn't know about the issues that early speed gives, they realized it after their overhasty fixes to the Reaper in WoL.
Also Speed Upgrade is the doom of mass chargelots in the lategame. Reapers are just better marines in TvP, except from their production time.
Would be fun though if the speed upgrade would come hand in hand with a build time reduction. On the other hand it takes alot of skill to slowly replace your Marines with Reapers in the lategame.
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Bringin back Niitro pack would need the reaper to loose all its hots buffs which are already ridiculous. Best option is to remove it completely
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Reapers are already strong enough as it is again especially in TvT and possibly in TvZ.
Nitro pack should just be removed and possible be replaced with something that gives the reapers a lategame (like a HP buff or some other cool feature but NOT a buff to harassment like speed).
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On November 08 2012 13:11 sona wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 11:11 Inquisitor1323 wrote:
I'd say hell yes, but this would pretty much guarantee everyone going reaper openings most of the time in TvT. If you scout it in time, could always go bunker + marines until tank/marauder comes out. If the opponent does make reapers, they are force to do damage or else they will fall behind.
The thing is, it's so easy to deal damage with reapers now that they virtually always pay for themselves. Plus, a bunker has to be in a fixed position which means that you'll always be vulnerable to reaper attacks somewhere. Currently, the best way to counter reaper is just to scout and build a fast marauder, but even that doesnt always work. That being said, I think this change would be good and makes sense.
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