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In the original starcraft, as we all know cerebrates were used by the overmind to control broods.
Even in brood war when kerrigan came to power, the player acted as a cerebrate used on kerrigan's behalf.
In wings of liberty, we don't see kerrigan use any of the cerebrates. Nor in heart of the swarm. While there probably is a legitimate explanation of it, i just feel so empty with the campaign...
One of the biggest elements of the original was using a dark templar to destroy a cerebrate, and it really makes me sad that in Sc2 this element has completely disappeared. My question to all of you TLers, is do all of you also miss the cerebrates?
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The Cerebrates are all dead, they had a symbiotic relationship with the Overmind and couldn't survive after Kerrigan killed the second Overmind in BW, Chris Metzen has confirmed this. Asking if we miss them is entirely irrelevant. That's like asking if we missed Captain Kurk in Star Trek: Next Gen.
I will be the first person to say the WoL campaign plot did not remotely live up to the plot in SC and SC: BW, but that whole idea would actually make for a comprehensive discussion thread, where as this thread topic does not.
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Is it bad that I was already forming my retort to what TheToast wrote when I read his quote, instantly recognizing the line from the final episode of Firefly and decided I no longer wanted to argue with him for the sheer level of his awesomeness?
(Look, theres so little new content in Single Player forum.. I don't mind someone actually making a new thread. And for the record I didn't know Chris Metzen said so, I was assuming there were still cerebrates as "I have freed you from the overmind" et cetera beginning of brood war implied that you were all good and fine without the overmind.)
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On June 07 2011 09:10 Probe1 wrote:
Is it bad that I was already forming my retort to what TheToast wrote when I read his quote, instantly recognizing the line from the final episode of Firefly and decided I no longer wanted to argue with him for the sheer level of his awesomeness?
(Look, theres so little new content in Single Player forum.. I don't mind someone actually making a new thread. And for the record I didn't know Chris Metzen said so, I was assuming there were still cerebrates as "I have freed you from the overmind" et cetera beginning of brood war implied that you were all good and fine without the overmind.)
Yes Chris Metzen has confirmed the Cerebrates are all dead, on several occasions. Metzen stated the following during a lore panel at the 2007 BlizzCon:
"since Brood War there’s only one mind controlling the Zerg (as far as anyone knows). After Brood War she whacked out all the (remaining) cerebrates, so as far as anyone knows she is in sole control of the swarm. But that sure is an interesting theme *wink wink*”"Source
In 2009 he further extended and further clarified the status of the cerebrates with the following:
"Metzen - Daggoth is dead, along with the rest of the cerebrates. Kerrigan is the sole power behind the Swarm now. It’s possible that Daggoth could not sustain himself without the Overmind and other cerebrates to power him. We’ve suggested before that the Overmind and its cerebrates were symbiotically linked. The cerebrates were not designed to exist without their creator. That’s a partial reason behind the cerebrates’ merging into a new, singular Overmind during the early events of Brood War. Source
The Cerebrate originally played by the gamer in SC was killed by Tassadar, source while the Cerebrate played by the gamer in BW also died (same source as first Metzen quote, SC2 Wiki article here). The Cerebrates are all dead and they are not coming back, unless Chris Metzen decides to ignore established Lore (again) and make up some crazy crap because he is out of ideas (again).
I have no issue with new threads in single player, but it we are going to have a discussion it should be intelligent or substantive. I think the OP would have been much better off framing a good discussion about the direction of the lore concerning the zerg race (which is of course filled with holes and ridiculous re-writes of established events) which I would love to see more discussion of, rather than making a whole thread to ask if we miss the cerebrates...
(and don't question my lore knowlege!  )
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frame the discussion yourselves, sheesh, it's no one's responsibility to write a master's thesis to get you started.
it was my understanding that many of the cerebrates merged to form the new overmind that was killed, with many of the remaining being killed by kerrigan because of their ties to the overmind. and yeah i'd heard that chris metzen quote before. it seems like the queens were eventually designed by kerrigan to somewhat fill the role left empty by the cerebrates, but based them more on herself and the way she leads the zerg (in person and fighting the enemy herself, with a strong personality and sense of independence.) hence why a queen is our adviser in multiplayer. i really wish they had introduced the concept of the queen in WoL, besides that one random boss fight that came with no explanation. i guess we'll probably get some more background on them in HotS.
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the cerebrates are not dependent on the overmind because kerrigan was controlling/supporting you in bw (as the cerebrate), so that explaniation isn't sufficient.
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On June 07 2011 13:35 da_head wrote:
the cerebrates are not dependent on the overmind because kerrigan was controlling/supporting you in bw (as the cerebrate), so that explaniation isn't sufficient.
On June 07 2011 10:15 TheToast wrote:The Cerebrate originally played by the gamer in SC was killed by Tassadar, source while the Cerebrate played by the gamer in BW also died (same source as first Metzen quote, SC2 Wiki article here). The Cerebrates are all dead and they are not coming back, unless Chris Metzen decides to ignore established Lore (again) and make up some crazy crap because he is out of ideas (again).
The BW Cerebrate's Dead.
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I miss the Cerebrates  .
Kerrigan is an Awesome general and all but she is just ONE woman.
The cerebrates were huge living brains dedicated soley to commanding the broods. They were the Zerg commanders but unlike commanders of ther races, they were literally bred for the duty. They were built for it. Designed for it.
We saw the genius of the cerebrates in the original, where as the newest and most cunning cerebrate of the swarm you win countless battles agaisnt grim odds. In the protoss campaign we also see how the zerg master stategy outwits that of the conclave, resulting in the fall of Fenix.
And in Brood War we see one zerg cerebrate outwit the UED, Protoss and the Dominion fleets in one bloody and unfair battle.
It's probably a good thing for the terrans and protoss that there are no more cerebrates/overmind because if there was then they would not stand a chance agaisnt zerg.
That said I sorely miss the Overmind and his cerebrates...
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HotS campaign is focused on Queens. Kerrigan has to regain her control of the swarm from other queens. So I guess new lore, new times, new ideas which kind of blend in with the zerg nature.
Zergs are very adaptable, able to mutate and transform, why not able to change the way they are controlled? By a Queen instead of a cerebrate.
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On June 07 2011 18:33 MindRush wrote:
HotS campaign is focused on Queens. Kerrigan has to regain her control of the swarm from other queens. So I guess new lore, new times, new ideas which kind of blend in with the zerg nature.
Zergs are very adaptable, able to mutate and transform, why not able to change the way they are controlled? By a Queen instead of a cerebrate.
That's how I see it as well, Kerrigan made queens after herself, to replace the cerebrates wich where created by the overmind.
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From a personal standpoint, I would much rather play as myself than as someone else (eg, I'd rather play Dragon Age where I can create my own character rather than The Witcher where I'm Geralt whether I like it or not). The Zerg campaign in SC1 did this, allowing me to play as a cerebrate, and I much prefer that over the thought of being Kerrigan. I do miss it, and thanks to people pointing out that the cerebrates are now gone :-(
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well, people, think about it: can a queen replace a cerebrate?
A cerebrate is a psyonic being which has high psyonic energy, sufficient to control broods. But a queen... only a unit. can it control all those broods? besides, if a queen replaces a cerebrate, and a queen has relative less health compared to cerebrates, wont the protoss and terran just snipe the queen? they cant snipe a cerebrate, right?
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From an evolutionary standpoint, surely a cerebrate could be recreated from the merger of several overlords / queens / combination of other zerg creatures we never meet on the battlefield like those being introduced in the HotS. A new hive mind would grow even if you destroyed all the old ones, because otherwise the entire race is doomed to die whenever Kerrigan does. I feel that a continuously mutating, evolving race like the Zerg would be up to the task 
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On June 07 2011 21:05 erikzbi wrote:
well, people, think about it: can a queen replace a cerebrate?
A cerebrate is a psyonic being which has high psyonic energy, sufficient to control broods. But a queen... only a unit. can it control all those broods? besides, if a queen replaces a cerebrate, and a queen has relative less health compared to cerebrates, wont the protoss and terran just snipe the queen? they cant snipe a cerebrate, right?
Why not? The queens area "rumored" to have some of Kerrigan's DNA in them. Since zerg examine the beings around them for what they can absorb into their collective arsenal they would be easily be able to tell that. The queens are the genetically stamped mouth pieces of Kerrigan and psionic in their own right as well. The cerebrates trick to endurance it out of the bag, they are now sitting ducks with a sign saying "void blade me" all over them.
+ Show Spoiler +http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/game/heart-of-the-swarm-preview/story Za’gara - A very intelligent type of queen known as a Brood Mother, Za'gara seeks to take over the Swarm in the absence of the Queen of Blades.
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Heart of the Swarm spoilers inside.
+ Show Spoiler +There is a new type of queens called "Brood Mothers" that were designed by kerrigan to replace the Cerebrates.
The Cerebrates were technically a part of the Overmind, so I'm not surprised Kerrigan would hunt them down (except for the one we play, but it is about the same thing as Artanis refering to us as Executor when he is now said to have been the Executor).
And I assume she created the Brood Mothers for the exact same reason the Overmind created the Cerebrates and the Overlords: because it is difficult for one entity to control a very large number of zerg.
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I think having cerebrates would be cooler than queens in HotS campaign, mainly because it was something you grew up with in SC/BW and would kind of bring some nostalgia to those who have played since the first game came out. But then again they may find a way to make the queens in the game feel more baller than in multiplayer where there almost like a golden egg your trying to hold on to all game and not ever lose one lol.
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I miss my cute, cudly Cerebrates. =[ Damn you Blizzard! Damn you straight to hell!
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Found it weird that the Overmind required numerous cerebrates to assert full control over the swarm while Kerrigan needed only herself. Back in BW, she had the player cerebrate and Duran.
There is also this Brood Queen from HOTS that serves as a mini-cerebrate of sorts.
On June 08 2011 00:33 Telenil wrote:Heart of the Swarm spoilers inside. + Show Spoiler +There is a new type of queens called "Brood Mothers" that were designed by kerrigan to replace the Cerebrates.
The Cerebrates were technically a part of the Overmind, so I'm not surprised Kerrigan would hunt them down (except for the one we play, but it is about the same thing as Artanis refering to us as Executor when he is now said to have been the Executor).
And I assume she created the Brood Mothers for the exact same reason the Overmind created the Cerebrates and the Overlords: because it is difficult for one entity to control a very large number of zerg.
Artanis was not the executor of BW, he was the executor in the original starcraft.
Was the cerebrate from the original the same cerebrate from BW?
The UED commander from BW that we played as is presumably a flowing corpse somewhere in the galaxy. Or inside a pile of muta crap.
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown.
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On June 08 2011 02:49 dukethegold wrote:
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown.
An interesting theory I have heard on that is that the commander is Horner.
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On June 08 2011 03:09 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2011 02:49 dukethegold wrote:
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown. An interesting theory I have heard on that is that the commander is Horner.
Minor spoilers to the book Liberty's Crusade:
+ Show Spoiler +The book Liberty's Crusade portrays Danny Liberty to be the commander in the terran campaign from the original Starcraft. At least most of it, it's been a while but I distinctly remember the author saying that Danny Liberty alongside Raynor ordered to burn the infested command center on Mar Sara.
In the end Liberty is still alive and trying to spread the truth about Mengsk and his orders to lure the Zerg to Tarsonis to do his dirty work for him.
From what I know both zerg cerabrates from the original and BW are dead,the executor from the original is Artanis and the executor from BW is Selendis. The commander from the original is Danny Liberty and probably the commander from BW is some UED guy. I am not 100% certain though.
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On June 08 2011 00:43 RaLakedaimon wrote:
I think having cerebrates would be cooler than queens in HotS campaign, mainly because it was something you grew up with in SC/BW and would kind of bring some nostalgia to those who have played since the first game came out. But then again they may find a way to make the queens in the game feel more baller than in multiplayer where there almost like a golden egg your trying to hold on to all game and not ever lose one lol.
It'd be kind of cool of that other advisor had some sort of tie to the cerebrates of old, but atm he just looks like a baneling/abomination mix.
I have no problem with Brood Mothers replacing cerebrates, as long as Brood Mothers and Queens are clearly differentiated, as Queens are expendable in-game units that cost supply.
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On June 08 2011 02:49 dukethegold wrote:
Found it weird that the Overmind required numerous cerebrates to assert full control over the swarm while Kerrigan needed only herself. Back in BW, she had the player cerebrate and Duran.
Blizzard was kind of off in how they handled the portrayal of Zerg chain of command.
The OVermind should by all accounts be able to exert control over all of the swarm. They implied in their source material Cerebrates were needed for efficiency purposes. In turn Overlords AND Queens were used to help Cerebrates to help cerebrates in the same manner.
In the end we were left with what seemed to be inconsistencies with Queens not providing supply control over Drones and broods going insane when the Cerebrate dies.
When you look closer there wasn't any issues. When the Overmind died all the zerg rank and file units became frenzied even though the Cerebrates were alive and very much in control of their mental capacities.
This says the Overmind has a subconcious level control over the entire swarm but it abdicated conscious control to the Cerebrates so it can focus on higher function tasks without being stressed. The mental effort needed to regain control of the Garm brood was probably not worth it considering the time table they were on to prepare consuming the Protoss.
Was the cerebrate from the original the same cerebrate from BW?
The UED commander from BW that we played as is presumably a flowing corpse somewhere in the galaxy. Or inside a pile of muta crap.
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown.
The cerebrate from BW died in the Protoss campaign of SC. This was elaborated on in a novel. The cerebrate from BW was different and it got killed in a novel.
BW UED commander is dead.
The fate of the commander from SC isn't known by me but someone else may have some insight.
I personally enjoyed the Cerebrates but I don't mind they aren't coming back. I do mind that Blizzard is missing an opportunity to make the zerg a very compelling race by going a different route and rehashing the Warcraft 3 orc storyline into the zerg personal story.
The Zerg first and foremost were genetically modified parasites. These parasites formed a group intelligence in the same way ant colonies for intelligence as their population grows.
Eventually from that out growth the OVermind was created. This says to me that while the OVermind is dead the very essence of what created the overmind is not dead. Every zerg being and structure are born from these parasites.
They could have created a ZvZ campaign where a new intelligence spontaneously emerges from the swarm after the Overmind intelligence has failed to deliver the results the swarm needs to keep on being top of the food chain.
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if you had followed the story in sc1 then you would know they were all slain and the overmind also died. no overmind no cerebrates as the overmind keeps them alive.
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yep cerebrates are dead and kerrigan redesigned the queen to control zergs. Cerebrates had to much power and would have been a threat to her. She tryed to kill everyone that would have been able to kill her, why do you think the player was an exception . (or maybe it took her to much power to keep her pet cerebrate alive)
On a sidenote cerebrates were always annoying me in bw. So glad they are gone.
edit: oh right forgot to add, terrans should be capable of creating cerebrats, so there is no guarantee that the cerebrates are gone for good. Maybe mengsk wanted to kill kerrigan just so that his newly enginered cerebrates would be able to take control over the zergs.
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On June 10 2011 03:45 Bhaalgorn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2011 03:09 Gahlo wrote:On June 08 2011 02:49 dukethegold wrote:
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown. An interesting theory I have heard on that is that the commander is Horner. Minor spoilers to the book Liberty's Crusade: The book Liberty's Crusade portrays Danny Liberty to be the commander in the terran campaign from the original Starcraft. At least most of it, it's been a while but I distinctly remember the author saying that Danny Liberty alongside Raynor ordered to burn the infested command center on Mar Sara. In the end Liberty is still alive and trying to spread the truth about Mengsk and his orders to lure the Zerg to Tarsonis to do his dirty work for him. From what I know both zerg cerabrates from the original and BW are dead,the executor from the original is Artanis and the executor from BW is Selendis. The commander from the original is Danny Liberty and probably the commander from BW is some UED guy. I am not 100% certain though.
No. Nothing in the final paragraph is written in Liberty's Crusade and time and again Daniel Liberty is described as at best a civilian with no military knowledge. Not to mention you are referred to as Adjutant and all of the lore points against what you said.
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On June 10 2011 06:52 Probe1 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2011 03:45 Bhaalgorn wrote:On June 08 2011 03:09 Gahlo wrote:On June 08 2011 02:49 dukethegold wrote:
The fate of the commander from the original who defected along with Raynor is also unknown. An interesting theory I have heard on that is that the commander is Horner. Minor spoilers to the book Liberty's Crusade: The book Liberty's Crusade portrays Danny Liberty to be the commander in the terran campaign from the original Starcraft. At least most of it, it's been a while but I distinctly remember the author saying that Danny Liberty alongside Raynor ordered to burn the infested command center on Mar Sara. In the end Liberty is still alive and trying to spread the truth about Mengsk and his orders to lure the Zerg to Tarsonis to do his dirty work for him. From what I know both zerg cerabrates from the original and BW are dead,the executor from the original is Artanis and the executor from BW is Selendis. The commander from the original is Danny Liberty and probably the commander from BW is some UED guy. I am not 100% certain though. No. Nothing in the final paragraph is written in Liberty's Crusade and time and again Daniel Liberty is described as at best a civilian with no military knowledge. Not to mention you are referred to as Adjutant and all of the lore points against what you said.
The last part is indeed not from the book but it's what I think I know about the fate of the various commanders. Though it was clear, but maybe it's not.
You are NEVER referred to as adjutant in any terran mission from the original. You are referred to as magistrate. Not sure what you're exactly called in the BW campaign(terran part) but I am 99% certain it's not adjutant.
Basically most commanders retconned out of the lore so they're either dead or know characters. Closest thing to the magistrate from the original is Danny Liberty.
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EPT
