EPT2016 - 2017 Football Thread - Page 114
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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GTR
51663 Posts
dunno how he got more frozen out than schweinsteiger lol | ||
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Skynx
Turkey7150 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Good luck Oscar! | ||
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sharkie
Austria18713 Posts
On December 23 2016 19:28 DucK- wrote: Bye Oscar. Thanks for the money. Don't quite understand why any young footballer would head to China, USA etc. Obviously the money is crazily good. But I have no respect for them. No passion for the game, motivated by money. Yea this is their job and obviously you want more money. Thing is you're already earning quite a lot, more than enough money to last you. Surely you don't need the extra money. You only want it, and you want it more than your passion for the sport. Disgusted. Everyone wants extra money. And no football player in the world is fueled by passion rofl. With the small minority of exceptions: gerrard, totti, buffon. | ||
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RvB
Netherlands6303 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
I don't mind though, would love to see China and its billions take Football seriously could be fun to see what talent they can produce for the world. On December 23 2016 20:19 RvB wrote: I heard he gets like 20m a year. God damned you'd be a fool not to go for that kind of money. Yeah would been onlike 100k a week at best at Chelsea, so its like quadrupled his wage. | ||
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TerransHill
Germany572 Posts
On December 23 2016 20:00 sharkie wrote: Everyone wants extra money. And no football player in the world is fueled by passion rofl. With the small minority of exceptions: gerrard, totti, buffon. I don't think its only the money. Most players also want to win trophys. If a player goes from Liverpool to Barca or from Dortmund to Bayern for example it is also a step forward in their career and not only more money. Totally different from going to China, Russia, USA, Quatar etc. | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
On December 23 2016 20:00 sharkie wrote: Everyone wants extra money. And no football player in the world is fueled by passion rofl. With the small minority of exceptions: gerrard, totti, buffon. Money is important, trophies are too. That they value the extra money over winning trophies, I don't respect them at all. By passion, I don't mean Gerrard totti where they willingly stick with their boyhood club and forgoing any chance of being in a top club. So young, and has his eyes only on money... | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On December 23 2016 21:00 DucK- wrote: Money is important, trophies are too. That they value the extra money over winning trophies, I don't respect them at all. By passion, I don't mean Gerrard totti where they willingly stick with their boyhood club and forgoing any chance of being in a top club. So young, and has his eyes only on money... I think thats very short sighted, this the angle of someone who has no intention of looking at it from a players perspective. "surely he didnt need the money" is about the most bullshit fan argument in history. Who are you to decide whether he needs it or not ? Player careers are short, things can happen, players do it in other sports all the time, they go to weaker teams to get bigger contracts, if he gets money in a weaker league power to him, helps smaller leagues improve At the end of the day Trophies are memories, money is makes their post career lives comfortable, both are equally as important. He also has the chance to be a star in a burgeoning league, there are many negatives but plenty of positives aswell. Whether it works out or not is ofcourse to be decided. I dont think its great for him as a player either, but I can respect what he wants to do. The impact of Giovinco moving to Toronto here has been a crazy good advertisement for MLS, maybe he can do the same in China, maybe it fizzles, but the least you can do to a player that has worked hard for you and your manager no longer favors is respect his decision. And lets not complain about Oscar never living upto to potential Pande "if you followed Chelsea" you would know that Mourinho literally squeezed any flair he had out of him, he turned him from a flair player into a jobber. And credit to the kid he was willing to do it and did it reasonably well, but it was never what he was going to excel at and he never matured into his strength because he was never allowed to express himself. Guys who refused to do it like Mata got shipped. Again this isnt a knock on anyone in particular but if you are going to suggest that Oscar did not live up to potential then you should be humble enough to accept that he was never allowed to. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On December 23 2016 21:00 DucK- wrote: Money is important, trophies are too. That they value the extra money over winning trophies, I don't respect them at all. By passion, I don't mean Gerrard totti where they willingly stick with their boyhood club and forgoing any chance of being in a top club. So young, and has his eyes only on money... He is a professional, earning money through football is his job. Trophies being important is your personal view as a fan but if someone does not care about that that is completely understandable. To me it actually feels silly and immature to value trophies that highly. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
On December 24 2016 00:08 Rebs wrote: I think thats very short sighted, this the angle of someone who has no intention of looking at it from a players perspective. "surely he didnt need the money" is about the most bullshit fan argument in history. Who are you to decide whether he needs it or not ? Player careers are short, things can happen, players do it in other sports all the time, they go to weaker teams to get bigger contracts, if he gets money in a weaker league power to him, helps smaller leagues improve At the end of the day Trophies are memories, money is makes their post career lives comfortable, both are equally as important. He also has the chance to be a star in a burgeoning league, there are many negatives but plenty of positives aswell. Whether it works out or not is ofcourse to be decided. I dont think its great for him as a player either, but I can respect what he wants to do. The impact of Giovinco moving to Toronto here has been a crazy good advertisement for MLS, maybe he can do the same in China, maybe it fizzles, but the least you can do to a player that has worked hard for you and your manager no longer favors is respect his decision. And lets not complain about Oscar never living upto to potential Pande "if you followed Chelsea" you would know that Mourinho literally squeezed any flair he had out of him, he turned him from a flair player into a jobber. And credit to the kid he was willing to do it and did it reasonably well, but it was never what he was going to excel at and he never matured into his strength because he was never allowed to express himself. Guys who refused to do it like Mata got shipped. Again this isnt a knock on anyone in particular but if you are going to suggest that Oscar did not live up to potential then you should be humble enough to accept that he was never allowed to. Hahahahaha, you realize he played longer at Chelsea without Mourinho being there right?  2 Years with Mourinho Di Matteo Benitez Hiddink Holland Conte = 3 years In all these teams Oscar shone for 4-6 games a season where he would do magical things but then in the other 30 games he would be just a hard working midfielder not standing out. You could also argue it was Rafa who changed him from what Di Matteo did with him but that wasn't that good either as he played amazing when he came on vs Juventus then did nothing. He was the player that was good, then just as his memory of what he was like was fading he would score a freekick or play well. Chelsea fans are all puzzled about his consistency. So im sure Conte when was offered 60 million for him said well if he wants to go then he can because that is absurd money for him. | ||
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Ysellian
Netherlands9029 Posts
On December 24 2016 00:08 Rebs wrote: And lets not complain about Oscar never living upto to potential Pande "if you followed Chelsea" you would know that Mourinho literally squeezed any flair he had out of him, he turned him from a flair player into a jobber. And credit to the kid he was willing to do it and did it reasonably well, but it was never what he was going to excel at and he never matured into his strength because he was never allowed to express himself. Guys who refused to do it like Mata got shipped. Again this isnt a knock on anyone in particular but if you are going to suggest that Oscar did not live up to potential then you should be humble enough to accept that he was never allowed to. Yeah this is why de Bruyne turned out great despite IMO Oscar looking the better player earlier on, granted playing in a smaller league or lesser team will also help you. It is honestly a shame to do that with creative players I feel. I get it he has great stamina and work rate, but that could also be put towards other uses than making him a jobber. He is 25 already, but playing in a lesser league I think it can still come back to him. At Feyenoord Koeman did something similar with one of our youth players as well, cut out the flair and make him nothing but a runner. He was mediocre at the role and honestly never looked like the golden boy people thought he was going to be. Just like with Oscar people were giving him hell for not meeting expectations. Then van Bronckhorst came along, cut out the restrictions and he is now indispensable for the team. | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On December 24 2016 00:52 Pandemona wrote: Hahahahaha, you realize he played longer at Chelsea without Mourinho being there right? 2 Years with Mourinho Di Matteo Benitez Hiddink Holland Conte = 3 years In all these teams Oscar shone for 4-6 games a season where he would do magical things but then in the other 30 games he would be just a hard working midfielder not standing out. You could also argue it was Rafa who changed him from what Di Matteo did with him but that wasn't that good either as he played amazing when he came on vs Juventus then did nothing. He was the player that was good, then just as his memory of what he was like was fading he would score a freekick or play well. Chelsea fans are all puzzled about his consistency. So im sure Conte when was offered 60 million for him said well if he wants to go then he can because that is absurd money for him. Oh I agree other manages didnt particularly use him well either. And frankly the thing about flair players is that if the team in general is poor they will look bad. Which is kinda where Chelsea was at during that period. Even with the Cl win and all the team played pretty shitty system for flair players. But Mou time was when you saw him drastically change his game, sure some of it is on him to but the degree to which we will never know because that is speculative, what we do know for sure is what happened. You can give a player a few years to mature into a role but any chance of that happening was kinda taken from him. Im not talking like star potential "build" the team around him kind of player because I dont know if he is that level. The flashes of brilliance you saw from him where despite the system not because of it. I dont think its anyones fault in particular, sometimes circumstances just pan out that way. Its unfortunate, my point is that I wouldnt pin it on him exclusively and what really killed any spark for me was the Mou period. And yeah the player he is now, I would sell him for that anywhere in heartbeat. No thinking twice about that. 60 million for a jobber? Where do I sign ? | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28873 Posts
But for african and south american players it's much harder for me to be judgmental in any way, because I can't relate to their upbringing, I can't relate to how big the difference between being really wealthy and wealthy is, I can't relate to how many people from their local village will have their lives vastly improved from one football player making it big, I can't relate to how big their extended families are. Being able to focus on trophies and fame, that's a luxury made possible through never having experienced desperate poverty. So it's like, I totally get where duck comes from, because I have much of the same gut reflex. But we should still be really careful with judging players because we don't actually know whether a private jet was the motivation (every single person in the world with a private jet sucks, no exceptions) or whether they just wanted to help the 200 people closest to them in life - which by comparison is incredibly commendable. ;p | ||
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RvB
Netherlands6303 Posts
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Faruko
Chile34173 Posts
Shit happens, what if he gets an injury tomorrow and misses 6-12 months and ggwp carreer ? Is not easy to say no to a deal that might actually ensure your children, and your grandsons, grand-grandsons, etc.... life forever. I dont know what i would do if im in that situation. | ||
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Dingodile
4139 Posts
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