EPTOn June 20 2015 00:49 Alaric wrote:
Didn't they smoke out the person they were supposed to save in the process, Soniv?
Didn't they smoke out the person they were supposed to save in the process, Soniv?
They were ambitious, not wise.
The LiquidLegends Lounge - Page 93
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
They were ambitious, not wise. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On June 20 2015 00:39 jcarlsoniv wrote: Adventure ended short. FigurativelyLiterally. | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On June 20 2015 00:35 WaveofShadow wrote: And the other problem with one-shots, is you can't tell much of a story. Amso can tell you, I like being able to tell stories. You're also missing out on a whole bunch of cool shit and encounters by everyone being level 1 I imagine. Campaign it is. You can also provide high level characters for one shots or just tell people to "make something at level 6-20" | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On June 20 2015 01:37 Requizen wrote: So it's decided. Once we beat Iris (and we will, since Asmo is the easiest boss fight of all time), Wave is next for DM. Don't worry. I can adapt. After nearly dying to a random encounter this week, I'd think you'd have learned some humility.  | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:13 AsmodeusXI wrote: Don't worry. I can adapt. After nearly dying to a random encounter this week, I'd think you'd have learned some humility. BUT WE HAD TO HELP THE CUTE LITTLE STONE SOLDIER | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:13 AsmodeusXI wrote: Don't worry. I can adapt. After nearly dying to a random encounter this week, I'd think you'd have learned some humility. I'm the tank. If I'm not nearly dying, something is incorrect. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:13 AsmodeusXI wrote: Don't worry. I can adapt. After nearly dying to a random encounter this week, I'd think you'd have learned some humility. I think part of the problem is that you've spoiled us a little Asmo. I mean I guess maybe there's stuff we missed somewhere because we don't always 'search' or whatever, but most of the time I don't get the feeling there are repercussions for actions that should/shouldn't be done? (For example shooting a city guard in the head) Or maybe because we haven't really experienced encounters that 'would be easier to beat if we did A/B/C' or something? Or maybe spellcasting/healing has spoiled us? Or maybe I'm not explaining this well. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:20 WaveofShadow wrote: I think part of the problem is that you've spoiled us a little Asmo. I mean I guess maybe there's stuff we missed somewhere because we don't always 'search' or whatever, but most of the time I don't get the feeling there are repercussions for actions that should/shouldn't be done? (For example shooting a city guard in the head) Or maybe because we haven't really experienced encounters that 'would be easier to beat if we did A/B/C' or something? Or maybe spellcasting/healing has spoiled us? Or maybe I'm not explaining this well. I have literally no idea what you're trying to say | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:21 jcarlsoniv wrote: I have literally no idea what you're trying to say In reference to the almost dying because we didn't check for vines and were nearly overwhelmed by what should have been a fairly easy encounter if done properly. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:23 WaveofShadow wrote: In reference to the almost dying because we didn't check for vines and were nearly overwhelmed by what should have been a fairly easy encounter if done properly. I talked about this kind of thing a while back. TL;DR tuning encounters is really hard because if the party can just brute force everything it gets really boring, but if the party isn't creative enough to figure out a non-brute force solution to a particular encounter, it can feel unfair when they lose. It takes some back and forth and a lot of trust between the DM and the players for the players to get the message that they won't beat everything by brute-forcing it, but also that the DM is trying to be fair when designing encounters that require some thought or party coordination. EDIT: Also, the party has to recognize that running the fuck away when they're getting their asses handed to them is a real option they should exercise liberally so that every "lost" encounter doesn't result in someone dying. This is why the death rules have gotten steadily more lenient over successive versions of D&D IMO. The DM should not have to be afraid to present encounters that the PCs are not *supposed* to be able to win against, because for the sake of the story, this is sometimes necessary to emphasize the fact that the party is in fact human and not capable of beating everything they encounter. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:32 TheYango wrote: I talked about this kind of thing a while back. TL;DR tuning encounters is really hard because if the party can just brute force everything it gets really boring, but if the party isn't creative enough to figure out a non-brute force solution to a particular encounter, it can feel unfair when they lose. It takes some back and forth and a lot of trust between the DM and the players for the players to get the message that they won't beat everything by brute-forcing it, but also that the DM is trying to be fair when designing encounters that require some thought or party coordination. Well yeah, in every encounter we've had so far, it's either been charge in or evade. The only one I can remember preparing for was the time we boarded up the barn while we waited. In previous games that I've been in, players will prepare for sometimes up to half an hour for an encounter, occasionally trivializing something that the DM thought would be much more difficult. The opposite happened on Tuesday, honestly. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:32 TheYango wrote: I talked about this kind of thing a while back. TL;DR tuning encounters is really hard because if the party can just brute force everything it gets really boring, but if the party isn't creative enough to figure out a non-brute force solution to a particular encounter, it can feel unfair when they lose. It takes some back and forth and a lot of trust between the DM and the players for the players to get the message that they won't beat everything by brute-forcing it, but also that the DM is trying to be fair when designing encounters that require some thought or party coordination. EDIT: Also, the party has to recognize that running the fuck away when they're getting their asses handed to them is a real option they should exercise liberally so that every "lost" encounter doesn't result in someone dying. This is why the death rules have gotten steadily more lenient over successive versions of D&D IMO. To piggyback - Last week I posted about my duo campaigns and how we took out a small army force of 40+ people. That encounter was designed to be accomplished through more thought and care, but we didn't really pay attention and just brute forced it anyway. We were supposed to die or be heavily injured if we did this, but our DM didn't realize how ridiculous a level 7 spellcaster is. Encounter balance is hard. But as much as we rag on Asmo, I've enjoyed all the encounters we've had in Iris. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
I'm not a fan of encounters that are hard by virtue of a particular gimmick that can trivialize it or make it hard if not noticed--but I do prefer some greater encouragement of teamwork and communication between party members. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31495 Posts
I would do it in character but it's hard to keep that up when I don't know other people's capabilities. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:41 WaveofShadow wrote: I always feel metagame-y when I tell people what to do in battle. Is that a thing that's supposd to happen more often? I would do it in character but it's hard to keep that up when I don't know other people's capabilities. It comes down to the preference of the group as a whole. Some parties do think it breaks the experience for party members to plan things out so much when it might not fit their characters, and that's a perfectly fair opinion. I personally think that encouraging teamwork and communication enhances the experience enough to be worth it, even if it is a little metagame-y at times. But ultimately it's for you guys and Asmo to figure out what you enjoy more. I'm just stating what I think would be more interesting to see as a viewer.  | ||
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AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:41 WaveofShadow wrote: I always feel metagame-y when I tell people what to do in battle. Is that a thing that's supposd to happen more often? I would do it in character but it's hard to keep that up when I don't know other people's capabilities. You're allowed to coordinate your actions as players. It is a game after all. Plus you're also getting better ideas of your abilities IN GAME so things might be fine in that regard. As far as consequences go, that's partially an unfortunate result of the place you were in. Law doesn't work WELL in Lower Fordran, so attacking a guard will be remembered, but there's be no swift response. Other places might (and likely would be) different. But it comes down to what Yango said: I don't want to RANDOMLY kill folk. So my encounters tend to be a little light. I'm still working on that balance. I might be running more one-shots soon so that might help me figure that stuff out better (balance and significantly but not murderously challenging encounters). | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On June 20 2015 02:40 TheYango wrote: The one thing I've noticed thus far is that in large part, the party still tends to act fairly individually in combat with everyone kind of doing their own thing rather than communicating and figuring out how particular abilities of each character can be used together (though this does happen some of the time, as a viewer I'd like to see it more often). To use an awful League analogy--you're all kind of still playing combat like it's solo queue rather than a 5-stack. I'm not a fan of encounters that are hard by virtue of a particular gimmick that can trivialize it or make it hard if not noticed--but I do prefer some greater encouragement of teamwork and communication between party members. Excuse me, Roger is, if nothing else, the beacon of teamwork | ||
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