On December 29 2013 09:01 Ryuu314 wrote: In the US, teachers make shit money unless you're a tenured professor at a reasonably well known university, but getting tenure at a good university can take many many many years.
This is a total myth. Teachers make decent money with (typically) really good benefits and job security. Additionally, teachers in the USA are typically drawn from some of the least talented college grads, so if you compare apples to apples, they are overcompensated compared to a similar person in the private sector.
Teachers only don't make good money if you ignore that they have low ACT/SAT scores exiting high school, typically graduate from relatively uncompetitive schools from non-rigorous majors, and typically receive post-baccalaureate degrees from similarly weak programs.
My cousins are teachers and they said the pay started out pretty low but after a couple years it gets better. Honestly the lack of jobs is probably a bigger problem with the job rather than the pay.
The lack of jobs is a big problem for nearly every profession right now. Unless you are a STEM person (and even then only certain STEM areas are truly booming). My old high school, I know, only has 4 science teachers right now and had to basically conscript math teachers to do physics classes for non-AP students.
It also depends within the field as well.
For instance with history professors: if you wanted to specialize in European History, you're competing against like 50-100 other applicants for the same position. Chinese History professors, on the other hand? Major gap for most university history departments that they're scrambling to fill, so getting tenure for it is significantly easier.
Yeah you can't say teachers aren't compensated enough..... Teacher's make a reasonable salary with extremely good benefits. Like, majorly fucking good. And if you're a REALLY good teacher/professor and can get a job at a good school/uni, you'll be raking in hundreds of thousands/year on top of said really good benefits. But most are lackluster because a lot of teachers are those who failed in their actual profession, so went into teaching, lol. I've had so many teachers like that it's not even funny.
University employment has radically different requirements from primary/secondary educational employment (Bachelor's is all that's necessary for the latter, whereas Masters is required as a minimum to teach Associates/2-year programs, PhD/Doctorates normally for 4-year unis/programs; graduate degrees require pretty extensive qualifications), which requires an extra 2-6 years of education on top of the usual 4 years for a bachelors. So that doesn't really fall in the same category of educational requirement as primary/secondary education.
On December 29 2013 10:19 BlackPaladin wrote: Yeah you can't say teachers aren't compensated enough..... Teacher's make a reasonable salary with extremely good benefits. Like, majorly fucking good. And if you're a REALLY good teacher/professor and can get a job at a good school/uni, you'll be raking in hundreds of thousands/year on top of said really good benefits. But most are lackluster because a lot of teachers are those who failed in their actual profession, so went into teaching, lol. I've had so many teachers like that it's not even funny.
lol are you fucking kidding me. Tenured professors at major universities are very well off, that much is true. Associate professors and teachers at high schools, middle schools, etc...(non-private basically) make shit money. Benefits depend on the location you teach as does salary. In California, teacher's unions are very influential so teachers can expect to make ~40k starting salary with a reasonably good health insurance plan. My mom has been teaching at the same public high school for 10+ years and she only makes less than 60k. She to school to become a teacher btw. In lower income areas, teachers get paid very little.
Furthermore the teachers who make hundreds of thousands a year are the vast minority and their salary/benefits literally have nothing to do with how well they teach. Rather, it has everything to do with tenure, which is determined by how long you've been teaching at said university plus your prestige. In other words, you can be the shittiest teacher alive, but if you've won a Nobel Prize for say physics research, you can easily get tenure and the benefits that come with. The opposite is also true - you can be an amazing teacher, but if you have no tenure (new to the school/no or few spectacular academic achievements) you won't be paid that well.
Source: Numerous tenured professors at UC Berkeley, where I went to uni, are shitty teachers, but amazing academics. On the flip side, some of the best professors (in terms of teaching) are relatively new to the university meaning no tenure. No tenure means a salary only slightly above that of public school teachers. My mom was offered a position as a Chinese professor at UC Davis, starting salary 60k; great benefits however. Being a professor means a lot more responsibilities than being a secondary school teacher, since all professors at major universities are virtually required to constantly publish regardless of your field.
On December 29 2013 09:01 Ryuu314 wrote: In the US, teachers make shit money unless you're a tenured professor at a reasonably well known university, but getting tenure at a good university can take many many many years.
This is a total myth. Teachers make decent money with (typically) really good benefits and job security. Additionally, teachers in the USA are typically drawn from some of the least talented college grads, so if you compare apples to apples, they are overcompensated compared to a similar person in the private sector.
Teachers only don't make good money if you ignore that they have low ACT/SAT scores exiting high school, typically graduate from relatively uncompetitive schools from non-rigorous majors, and typically receive post-baccalaureate degrees from similarly weak programs.
Lol. You honestly have 0 idea what you're talking about. Job security for teachers is not that great, especially a few years ago with the recession. In the school district where my mom works, literally every single teacher was pink slipped, meaning the district could fire them at any time. In the school district where I live, which is reasonably high income, things were a bit better, but several teachers were still let go.
Again, you need to make the distinction between tenured university professors and all other teachers. Tenured university professors are paid a ton of money and virtually can never be fired. All other teachers don't make much money and their job security is very much dependent on where they teach+the economy in general. Their job security is no better than most other jobs.
Here's a link showing average salary for secondary school teachers in California. Now keep in mind that California has one of the highest teacher salaries in the nation due to the strength of teacher's unions in California.
Those numbers are meaningless without a comparison to what the average person makes. And, in particular, you need to adjust for more than just education level (because, as I explained, teachers are not drawn from the same pool as Silicon Valley Employees). AEI did a study in 2011 that showed this, and no one has since refuted it with data, unless you have done some research.
Wheres the study you're referencing? The average salary can easily be looked up. IIRC average salary in the us is around 40k but that number includes those without college degrees.
I just read the XJ9 post on reddit, I'm now feeling depressed it was legitimately one of the saddest and most pathetic things I've ever read. Like seriously, this kid is messed up wtf.
In a cursory overview: I would be abit suspect of the source, as it is Heritage Foundation (and AEI), both with marked agendas on the issue, but the study appears to be fairly rigorous and valid. I'll get back to you on that.
On December 29 2013 11:54 Fusilero wrote: I just read the XJ9 post on reddit, I'm now feeling depressed it was legitimately one of the saddest and most pathetic things I've ever read. Like seriously, this kid is messed up wtf.
On December 29 2013 11:54 Fusilero wrote: I just read the XJ9 post on reddit, I'm now feeling depressed it was legitimately one of the saddest and most pathetic things I've ever read. Like seriously, this kid is messed up wtf.
In a cursory overview: I would be abit suspect of the source, as it is Heritage Foundation (and AEI), both with marked agendas on the issue, but the study appears to be fairly rigorous and valid. I'll get back to you on that.
Not denying that. The problem is that there is not another source on the issue that actually accounts for the factors I'm talking about.
On December 29 2013 11:54 Fusilero wrote: I just read the XJ9 post on reddit, I'm now feeling depressed it was legitimately one of the saddest and most pathetic things I've ever read. Like seriously, this kid is messed up wtf.
I cant even get through half of that... to be fair though, dropping out of high school to be a professional streamer and then to get banned is a very shitty position to be in.
this guy I'm facing in arena has played 5 blood imps thus far. I've managed to kill 2 -_- update: I've killed all 5, but still going to lose.
On December 29 2013 11:54 Fusilero wrote: I just read the XJ9 post on reddit, I'm now feeling depressed it was legitimately one of the saddest and most pathetic things I've ever read. Like seriously, this kid is messed up wtf.
I cant even get through half of that... to be fair though, dropping out of high school to be a professional streamer and then to get banned is a very shitty position to be in.
EPT
