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On February 28 2021 03:11 Fanatic-Templar wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:08 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:02 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:01 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 Doublemint wrote:
wow I see clem beat serral, is that considered a major upset these days? and how is his TvP? if it is "classic foreigner" level
or is Zest actually in danger? Zest is clearly in danger, I think he is gonna win but Clem pvt is really good. He is complete player nowadays. can't believe we're saying those things about a French Terran. Feels good ngl ^^ Yeah it's great, and despite their flaws, it's largely thanks to ogaming work ! I still admit on sc2 I generally privilege race over nation :p hope they solved their connexion problems because I definitely want to see the Zest - Clem series on their stream I think of switching too. That said parting/ty casted by demuslim was really funny, you could feel the pain haha the series was probably painful for anyone who doesn't actively hates TY ^^ I don't actively hate Ty, but actively hate Terran in general. I assume that's good enough?
100% good enough
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On February 28 2021 03:09 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:08 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 Elentos wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:04 deacon.frost wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 mierin wrote:On February 28 2021 02:58 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:56 mpmaley86 wrote:On February 28 2021 02:55 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:54 mpmaley86 wrote:
I think it's bad optics to have someone in the room next to him, can't believe they didn't set that in the rules.
edit: Fantastic micro by parting in there at the end. please don't complain about "optics" unless you're going to make a legitimate complaints about competitive integrity as well Sorry, I might be being dense, what do you mean? if you don't actually think there's an actual competitive integrity problem of someone being in the room, then why do you care about the "optics" of it? There's certainly an integrity problem. What if this person actually knew a lot about starcraft, reminded the players to do things like upgrades, etc? It's preposterous to imagine someone's girlfriend sitting with them in the booth at a LAN, why is it less so to see someone else at a strictly 1v1 sport? Eh, I actually think that having there a coach player would be a bad think. PLayers need to focus and the game has high tempo. having somebody backseat driving you will break your focus and get you out of the tempo. Unless you practiced it I don't think that on this level it would be any helpfull. I honestly believe it would be very harmful. Also it's the year of lord 2021 we're all stuck at home and therefore you can't enforce it anyway Well you can certainly disqualify people if it's obvious Disqualifying people for others showing up on camera would do absolutely nothing to prevent people from stream cheating, unless you forced the players to stream multiple cameras of their own room for the admins to stare at Chess tournament force the players to have 2 cameras around their rooms in order to prevent cheating, dunno if it is possible and I don't think it is very useful for sc2 but at least this solution exists...
I would prob do that (2 cameras), and also require the players to either stream their POV to admins or that the admins can check the running processes on their computer and limit them to run only approved softwares when playing a match...
But as someone said, there's no surefire way to prevent all this. I brought up this issue of cheat prevention before, but didn't get any attention at all. Even if it's just someone off to their side, and just say "upgrades" or "drop/nydus in main", it's already such a big deal.
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Czech Republic12129 Posts
On February 28 2021 03:09 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:08 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 Elentos wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:04 deacon.frost wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 mierin wrote:On February 28 2021 02:58 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:56 mpmaley86 wrote:On February 28 2021 02:55 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:54 mpmaley86 wrote:
I think it's bad optics to have someone in the room next to him, can't believe they didn't set that in the rules.
edit: Fantastic micro by parting in there at the end. please don't complain about "optics" unless you're going to make a legitimate complaints about competitive integrity as well Sorry, I might be being dense, what do you mean? if you don't actually think there's an actual competitive integrity problem of someone being in the room, then why do you care about the "optics" of it? There's certainly an integrity problem. What if this person actually knew a lot about starcraft, reminded the players to do things like upgrades, etc? It's preposterous to imagine someone's girlfriend sitting with them in the booth at a LAN, why is it less so to see someone else at a strictly 1v1 sport? Eh, I actually think that having there a coach player would be a bad think. PLayers need to focus and the game has high tempo. having somebody backseat driving you will break your focus and get you out of the tempo. Unless you practiced it I don't think that on this level it would be any helpfull. I honestly believe it would be very harmful. Also it's the year of lord 2021 we're all stuck at home and therefore you can't enforce it anyway Well you can certainly disqualify people if it's obvious Disqualifying people for others showing up on camera would do absolutely nothing to prevent people from stream cheating, unless you forced the players to stream multiple cameras of their own room for the admins to stare at Chess tournament force the players to have 2 cameras around their rooms in order to prevent cheating, dunno if it is possible and I don't think it is very useful for sc2 but at least this solution exists...
Yeah, but chess is a little bit different kind of a game  I mean c'mon, streamers who stream for living and for years can't talk about the game while playing it as they say it makes them to do mistakes. And pros should benefit from a person watching at a shitty angle(probably) while they give them advices? I don't know, Kev
If SC2 would be slower or turn based, sure, would make much more sense. But for SC2 this seems to me like a huge overkill.
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On February 28 2021 03:12 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:11 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:08 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:02 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:01 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 Doublemint wrote:
wow I see clem beat serral, is that considered a major upset these days? and how is his TvP? if it is "classic foreigner" level
or is Zest actually in danger? Zest is clearly in danger, I think he is gonna win but Clem pvt is really good. He is complete player nowadays. can't believe we're saying those things about a French Terran. Feels good ngl ^^ Yeah it's great, and despite their flaws, it's largely thanks to ogaming work ! I still admit on sc2 I generally privilege race over nation :p hope they solved their connexion problems because I definitely want to see the Zest - Clem series on their stream I think of switching too. That said parting/ty casted by demuslim was really funny, you could feel the pain haha the series was probably painful for anyone who doesn't actively hates TY ^^ I don't hate TY but I was cheering for Parting  I like TY and PartinG isn't my favorite player to put it nicely so let's say I didn't have too good a time ^^ To be fair you can't blame PartinG for any of that, TY was really poor.
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Italy12246 Posts
On February 28 2021 03:13 buzz_bender wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:09 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:08 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 Elentos wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:04 deacon.frost wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 mierin wrote:On February 28 2021 02:58 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:56 mpmaley86 wrote:On February 28 2021 02:55 Waxangel wrote:
[quote]
please don't complain about "optics" unless you're going to make a legitimate complaints about competitive integrity as well Sorry, I might be being dense, what do you mean? if you don't actually think there's an actual competitive integrity problem of someone being in the room, then why do you care about the "optics" of it? There's certainly an integrity problem. What if this person actually knew a lot about starcraft, reminded the players to do things like upgrades, etc? It's preposterous to imagine someone's girlfriend sitting with them in the booth at a LAN, why is it less so to see someone else at a strictly 1v1 sport? Eh, I actually think that having there a coach player would be a bad think. PLayers need to focus and the game has high tempo. having somebody backseat driving you will break your focus and get you out of the tempo. Unless you practiced it I don't think that on this level it would be any helpfull. I honestly believe it would be very harmful. Also it's the year of lord 2021 we're all stuck at home and therefore you can't enforce it anyway Well you can certainly disqualify people if it's obvious Disqualifying people for others showing up on camera would do absolutely nothing to prevent people from stream cheating, unless you forced the players to stream multiple cameras of their own room for the admins to stare at Chess tournament force the players to have 2 cameras around their rooms in order to prevent cheating, dunno if it is possible and I don't think it is very useful for sc2 but at least this solution exists... I would prob do that (2 cameras), and also require the players to either stream their POV to admins or that the admins can check the running processes on their computer and limit them to run only approved softwares when playing a match...
Or we can put a small delay on the stream....
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this is it. I'm not sure I'm ready.
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Chess cheating is more like maphacking in Starcraft.
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On February 28 2021 03:13 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:12 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:11 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:08 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:02 [PkF] Wire wrote:On February 28 2021 03:01 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 Doublemint wrote:
wow I see clem beat serral, is that considered a major upset these days? and how is his TvP? if it is "classic foreigner" level
or is Zest actually in danger? Zest is clearly in danger, I think he is gonna win but Clem pvt is really good. He is complete player nowadays. can't believe we're saying those things about a French Terran. Feels good ngl ^^ Yeah it's great, and despite their flaws, it's largely thanks to ogaming work ! I still admit on sc2 I generally privilege race over nation :p hope they solved their connexion problems because I definitely want to see the Zest - Clem series on their stream I think of switching too. That said parting/ty casted by demuslim was really funny, you could feel the pain haha the series was probably painful for anyone who doesn't actively hates TY ^^ I don't hate TY but I was cheering for Parting I like TY and PartinG isn't my favorite player to put it nicely so let's say I didn't have too good a time ^^ To be fair you can't blame PartinG for any of that, TY was really poor.
oh definitely, but I'm unsure that makes me feel any better 
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On February 28 2021 03:14 Teoita wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:13 buzz_bender wrote:On February 28 2021 03:09 stilt wrote:On February 28 2021 03:08 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 Elentos wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:04 deacon.frost wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 mierin wrote:On February 28 2021 02:58 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:56 mpmaley86 wrote:
[quote]
Sorry, I might be being dense, what do you mean? if you don't actually think there's an actual competitive integrity problem of someone being in the room, then why do you care about the "optics" of it? There's certainly an integrity problem. What if this person actually knew a lot about starcraft, reminded the players to do things like upgrades, etc? It's preposterous to imagine someone's girlfriend sitting with them in the booth at a LAN, why is it less so to see someone else at a strictly 1v1 sport? Eh, I actually think that having there a coach player would be a bad think. PLayers need to focus and the game has high tempo. having somebody backseat driving you will break your focus and get you out of the tempo. Unless you practiced it I don't think that on this level it would be any helpfull. I honestly believe it would be very harmful. Also it's the year of lord 2021 we're all stuck at home and therefore you can't enforce it anyway Well you can certainly disqualify people if it's obvious Disqualifying people for others showing up on camera would do absolutely nothing to prevent people from stream cheating, unless you forced the players to stream multiple cameras of their own room for the admins to stare at Chess tournament force the players to have 2 cameras around their rooms in order to prevent cheating, dunno if it is possible and I don't think it is very useful for sc2 but at least this solution exists... I would prob do that (2 cameras), and also require the players to either stream their POV to admins or that the admins can check the running processes on their computer and limit them to run only approved softwares when playing a match... Or we can put a small delay on the stream....
I mean stream their POV so that the admins can know that they are not maphacking or using any kind of hacks
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I REALLY recommend you to check the French stream they're already hotter than hell
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Ro12 series were far better than Ro8 ones so far. And all the players coming from Ro12 won.
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What did I miss, why are you talking so much about stream cheating? Nothing suggests they're cheating, right?
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On February 28 2021 03:09 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:08 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:06 Elentos wrote:On February 28 2021 03:05 Teoita wrote:On February 28 2021 03:04 deacon.frost wrote:On February 28 2021 02:59 mierin wrote:On February 28 2021 02:58 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:56 mpmaley86 wrote:On February 28 2021 02:55 Waxangel wrote:On February 28 2021 02:54 mpmaley86 wrote:
I think it's bad optics to have someone in the room next to him, can't believe they didn't set that in the rules.
edit: Fantastic micro by parting in there at the end. please don't complain about "optics" unless you're going to make a legitimate complaints about competitive integrity as well Sorry, I might be being dense, what do you mean? if you don't actually think there's an actual competitive integrity problem of someone being in the room, then why do you care about the "optics" of it? There's certainly an integrity problem. What if this person actually knew a lot about starcraft, reminded the players to do things like upgrades, etc? It's preposterous to imagine someone's girlfriend sitting with them in the booth at a LAN, why is it less so to see someone else at a strictly 1v1 sport? Eh, I actually think that having there a coach player would be a bad think. PLayers need to focus and the game has high tempo. having somebody backseat driving you will break your focus and get you out of the tempo. Unless you practiced it I don't think that on this level it would be any helpfull. I honestly believe it would be very harmful. Also it's the year of lord 2021 we're all stuck at home and therefore you can't enforce it anyway Well you can certainly disqualify people if it's obvious Disqualifying people for others showing up on camera would do absolutely nothing to prevent people from stream cheating, unless you forced the players to stream multiple cameras of their own room for the admins to stare at Chess tournament force the players to have 2 cameras around their rooms in order to prevent cheating, dunno if it is possible and I don't think it is very useful for sc2 but at least this solution exists...
The difference is with chess, cheating (using an engine) basically guarantees a victory, whereas having a second person staring at your screen in Starcraft is a very marginal advantage.
Also for some chess tournaments they sent arbitrators from FIDE to be in the same room as the player iirc. I doubt ESL has the international manpower to do that though.
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On February 28 2021 03:15 nojok wrote:
Ro12 series were far better than Ro8 ones so far.
quite a bad day so far honestly, last games of Dark - Reynor and Maru - Rogue were kinda ok but nothing else was worth watching indeed... Maybe this sets up for a wonderful last day though
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On February 28 2021 03:16 Calliope wrote:
What did I miss, why are you talking so much about stream cheating? Nothing suggests they're cheating, right?
PartinG had someone sitting next to him
but nothing suggests they're cheating at all ofc
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On February 28 2021 03:15 nojok wrote:
Ro12 series were far better than Ro8 ones so far. And all the players coming from Ro12 won.
And the Ro12 wasn't even very good so let's not talk about the Ro8
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On February 28 2021 03:16 Calliope wrote:
What did I miss, why are you talking so much about stream cheating? Nothing suggests they're cheating, right?
Well TY's play suggests he was looking at something other than his screen, but more likely he was watching some TV show rather than the stream.
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“Can we get some new maps? Submarine has been played in 5 out of 237 IEM Katowice games.” - IEM stream ticker just now
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On February 28 2021 03:17 sneakyfox wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2021 03:16 Calliope wrote:
What did I miss, why are you talking so much about stream cheating? Nothing suggests they're cheating, right? Well TY's play suggests he was looking at something other than his screen, but more likely he was watching some TV show rather than the stream.
Touché ^^
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On February 28 2021 03:17 Crocolisk Dundee wrote:
“Can we get some new maps? Submarine has been played in 5 of 237 IEM Katowice games.” - IEM stream ticker just now
Even Zest and PartinG veto Submarine and they're some aggro clowns
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EPT
