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Elentos
55581 Posts
On December 15 2015 01:52 The_Templar wrote: Maybe this? http://www.sc2unmasked.com/?server=kr&page=1 That, some I just know, and many pros are currently using their main account (non-barcode) in GM. Like INnoVation with his 39% TvP winrate. | ||
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Elentos
55581 Posts
Oh apparently that got cancelled, nvm. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
 Maybe we will get some cool ones though, MAYBE | ||
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pure.Wasted
Canada4701 Posts
On December 14 2015 23:01 Nebuchad wrote: Zest will win that tournament because of what you said right here. I was talking about the group with 5 Zergs and no Zest. | ||
Shellshock
United States97276 Posts
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sh0ck
United States52 Posts
On December 15 2015 02:00 Elentos wrote: That, some I just know, and many pros are currently using their main account (non-barcode) in GM. Like INnoVation with his 39% TvP winrate. Well, Innovation's TvP was never really something that (in my opinion, at least) would translate well into LOTV. From what I saw, his successes largely came off of the back of pull-the-boys all-ins, hellbat drops, widow mine drops, a proxy here and there, and holding off Protoss all-ins. He never really seemed to me to have the brilliant tactical mind - especially in TvP - that LOTV really rewards you for. Players like Maru, Bbyong, TY, Polt, Gumiho, Fantasy, just to name a few - while none of them had the powerful macro and build order execution that Innovation had, they are all amazing at getting every last bit of value out of every one of their units, positioning their forces just right, pulling their opponent to one location with one drop while simultaneously microing a small drop somewhere else, etc. That's just my take, but it doesn't surprise me that Innovation would struggle with Protoss in LOTV. | ||
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Mozdk
Denmark6989 Posts
On December 14 2015 21:24 Elentos wrote: How dare you imply Sorry isn't a real Terran? He made Solar rage quit in GSL with consecutive 8/8/8s! He proxied siege tanks in the Grand Finals of Proleague this year! If that's not a real Terran, then nobody is! Ahh sweet 2013, where everybody sucked. 1:20-1:30 in the video TB says only pro players click on gas to see how much have been mined. Right now I'll consider it standard for any diamond player and up. At least in PvZ and PvT. I've never done it in PvP, but gas first is not really used. And you'd be able to see the delay in gateway if you scouted on time. There has been a gas first (one gas) DT build, but if you play safe vs DTs, it doesn't matter. | ||
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
On December 15 2015 02:00 Elentos wrote: That, some I just know, and many pros are currently using their main account (non-barcode) in GM. Like INnoVation with his 39% TvP winrate. So that 60th ranked GM player really was innovation? He's usually always the top or near to top of ladder. | ||
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Elentos
55581 Posts
On December 15 2015 04:23 royalroadweed wrote: So that 60th ranked GM player really was innovation? He's usually always the top or near to top of ladder. Well, that's his main account. I don't know about all potential barcodes. The thing is also that SKT transitioned to LotV really late. They had Proleague finals, a bunch of guys at Blizzcon and to top it off vacation on Hawaii. Probably still getting used to some things. | ||
Poopi
France12938 Posts
On December 15 2015 04:00 sh0ck wrote: Well, Innovation's TvP was never really something that (in my opinion, at least) would translate well into LOTV. From what I saw, his successes largely came off of the back of pull-the-boys all-ins, hellbat drops, widow mine drops, a proxy here and there, and holding off Protoss all-ins. He never really seemed to me to have the brilliant tactical mind - especially in TvP - that LOTV really rewards you for. Players like Maru, Bbyong, TY, Polt, Gumiho, Fantasy, just to name a few - while none of them had the powerful macro and build order execution that Innovation had, they are all amazing at getting every last bit of value out of every one of their units, positioning their forces just right, pulling their opponent to one location with one drop while simultaneously microing a small drop somewhere else, etc. That's just my take, but it doesn't surprise me that Innovation would struggle with Protoss in LOTV. Didn't Maru lose to a random protoss in the qualifier? And isn't INno known for his multitask? I don't see either how the things you said after listing terrans have to do with tactics :x. But yeah INno had a lot of success when he could abuse obvious things mechanically or when the meta is a bit stabilized, 39% winrate is still a worrying trend (lol) for someone of his caliber! | ||
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sh0ck
United States52 Posts
On December 15 2015 04:56 Poopi wrote: Didn't Maru lose to a random protoss in the qualifier? And isn't INno known for his multitask? I don't see either how the things you said after listing terrans have to do with tactics :x. But yeah INno had a lot of success when he could abuse obvious things mechanically or when the meta is a bit stabilized, 39% winrate is still a worrying trend (lol) for someone of his caliber! Sure, Maru might have lost to a protoss in the qualifier, but that doesn't necessarily say anything about his win percentage in TvP. Just like I'm not judging Innovation's TvP based off of a single match, but the 39% win percentage somebody mentioned that was over 100 games. And what I'm trying to describe (poorly) isn't exactly multitasking, but the decisions made about how and where to use that multitasking. That's what I mean by 'tactics.' Just the ability to make brilliant on-the-fly decisions about where and when to push, what exact amount of units to split between a drop here, a drop there, and a main push at the front, etc. I guess the best way to put it is that it seems like LOTV is pretty chaotic, and whereas someone like Maru seems to thrive in chaos, Innovation seems to crumble. Inno likes to win games through game control. | ||
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Mozdk
Denmark6989 Posts
On December 15 2015 04:56 Poopi wrote: Didn't Maru lose to a random protoss in the qualifier? And isn't INno known for his multitask? I don't see either how the things you said after listing terrans have to do with tactics :x. But yeah INno had a lot of success when he could abuse obvious things mechanically or when the meta is a bit stabilized, 39% winrate is still a worrying trend (lol) for someone of his caliber! Has no one considered that he has many GM accounts? And this is the one with his actual name on, so he might not use his actual builds on it? He might just f around and try stuff. | ||
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Die4Ever
United States17737 Posts
WCS Predictor 2016 GSL Preseason 1 in + Show Spoiler [Ro16 Matches] +   Dark vs Solar in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. Dark is at 45.39% Blizzcon Chances, with a 45.48% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 46.41%, or 44.53% if they lose. Solar is at 62.76% Blizzcon Chances, with a 54.52% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 63.71%, or 61.61% if they lose. Life vs DongRaeGu in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. Life has the #2 Headband. Life is at 47.1% Blizzcon Chances, with a 62.39% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 47.75%, or 46.02% if they lose. DongRaeGu is at 9.19% Blizzcon Chances, with a 37.61% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 9.49%, or 9.01% if they lose.  herO vs  TY in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. herO is at 44.97% Blizzcon Chances, with a 55.12% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 45.89%, or 43.83% if they lose. TY is at 31.78% Blizzcon Chances, with a 44.88% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 32.58%, or 31.14% if they lose. Symbol vs Sorry in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. Symbol is at 3.61% Blizzcon Chances, with a 55.92% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 3.68%, or 3.51% if they lose. Sorry is at 1.73% Blizzcon Chances, with a 44.08% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 1.78%, or 1.69% if they lose. Reality vs Bunny in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. Reality is at 23.24% Blizzcon Chances, with a 65.14% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 23.6%, or 22.56% if they lose. Bunny is at 0.71% Blizzcon Chances, with a 34.86% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 0.74%, or 0.7% if they lose. Hurricane vs Zest in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. Hurricane is at 7.35% Blizzcon Chances, with a 34.33% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 7.62%, or 7.2% if they lose. Zest is at 35.92% Blizzcon Chances, with a 65.67% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 36.4%, or 35.01% if they lose. ByuL vs Dear in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. ByuL is at 32.13% Blizzcon Chances, with a 50.07% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 32.88%, or 31.38% if they lose. Dear is at 25.83% Blizzcon Chances, with a 49.93% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 26.52%, or 25.15% if they lose. TRUE vs Forte in in GSL Preseason 1 round of 16. TRUE is at 27.35% Blizzcon Chances, with a 58.82% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 27.91%, or 26.54% if they lose. Forte is at 1.03% Blizzcon Chances, with a 41.18% chance to win this match. If they win their Blizzcon Chances go up to 1.06%, or 1.01% if they lose. Winning Chances Solar has a 12.5% chance to win----going from 62.76% to 70.99% if they get 1st, or 61.58% if they don't. Life has a 10.69% chance to win----going from 47.1% to 56.55% if they get 1st, or 45.97% if they don't. herO has a 10.58% chance to win----going from 44.97% to 54.58% if they get 1st, or 43.83% if they don't. Zest has a 8.42% chance to win----going from 35.92% to 45.65% if they get 1st, or 35.03% if they don't. TRUE has a 8.21% chance to win----going from 27.35% to 36.45% if they get 1st, or 26.53% if they don't. + Show Spoiler [More Winning Chances] + Dark has a 8.09% chance to win----going from 45.39% to 55.06% if they get 1st, or 44.54% if they don't. ByuL has a 7.43% chance to win----going from 32.13% to 41.52% if they get 1st, or 31.38% if they don't. Reality has a 7.33% chance to win----going from 23.24% to 32.08% if they get 1st, or 22.54% if they don't. Dear has a 6.73% chance to win----going from 25.83% to 35.12% if they get 1st, or 25.16% if they don't. TY has a 6.52% chance to win----going from 31.78% to 41.46% if they get 1st, or 31.11% if they don't. Symbol has a 3.07% chance to win----going from 3.61% to 6.79% if they get 1st, or 3.5% if they don't. DongRaeGu has a 3.02% chance to win----going from 9.19% to 14.93% if they get 1st, or 9.01% if they don't. Hurricane has a 2.71% chance to win----going from 7.35% to 12.58% if they get 1st, or 7.2% if they don't. Sorry has a 1.87% chance to win----going from 1.73% to 3.73% if they get 1st, or 1.69% if they don't. Forte has a 1.56% chance to win----going from 1.03% to 2.36% if they get 1st, or 1.01% if they don't. Bunny has a 1.25% chance to win----going from 0.71% to 1.74% if they get 1st, or 0.7% if they don't. | ||
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Poopi
France12938 Posts
On December 15 2015 05:08 sh0ck wrote: Sure, Maru might have lost to a protoss in the qualifier, but that doesn't necessarily say anything about his win percentage in TvP. Just like I'm not judging Innovation's TvP based off of a single match, but the 39% win percentage somebody mentioned that was over 100 games. And what I'm trying to describe (poorly) isn't exactly multitasking, but the decisions made about how and where to use that multitasking. That's what I mean by 'tactics.' Just the ability to make brilliant on-the-fly decisions about where and when to push, what exact amount of units to split between a drop here, a drop there, and a main push at the front, etc. I guess the best way to put it is that it seems like LOTV is pretty chaotic, and whereas someone like Maru seems to thrive in chaos, Innovation seems to crumble. Inno likes to win games through game control. Uh? Ladder games mean nothing in the sense that all their only goal... is to help you win tournament matches. So we don't really care about Maru win percentage in ladder TvP, what is important is how he fares in actual tournaments/qualifiers and if I understand correctly, there are no Code S spot from HotS so you have to qualify no matter who you, thus it was not only a qualifier match, but a very important qualifier match. So basically all your TvP ladder games lead to your performance in this bo3 match and while it doesn't say much about your current skill in the matchup, it says a lot more than your ladder winrate, because INno could "struggle" on his main account yet pull out an important win in the matchup. For the tactics thingy, I did not follow HotS much but it seemed stale enough to basically have all terrans doing the same things "tactically". | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
 Solar > DarkLife > DRG TY > hero Sorry < SymbolZvZ is obviously hard to call, so whatever i guess. TY has a huge fanboy bonus, but he played pretty well in LOTV so far so i think he can do it realistically. Zerg > Terran, especially if none of them is that great to begin with. | ||
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Elentos
55581 Posts
On December 15 2015 06:44 The_Red_Viper wrote: Prediction time: Solar > DarkLife > DRGTY > hero Sorry < SymbolZvZ is obviously hard to call, so whatever i guess. TY has a huge fanboy bonus, but he played pretty well in LOTV so far so i think he can do it realistically. Zerg > Terran, especially if none of them is that great to begin with. It's  herO[jOin] or CJ.herO.On December 15 2015 05:11 Mozdk wrote: Has no one considered that he has many GM accounts? And this is the one with his actual name on, so he might not use his actual builds on it? He might just f around and try stuff. His other winrates were way better, his TvT was at 70% when I checked it. He's not fucking around too much. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
 Either tl changes it or i won't even give a damn hero | ||
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Elentos
55581 Posts
On December 15 2015 07:28 The_Red_Viper wrote: Haha i don't give a fuck anymore Either tl changes it or i won't even give a damn heroAs long as hero still plays in BW tournaments they won't (permanently) change it I reckon. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
The only relevant hero (i even did the capital "o") is CJ.herO. So yeah, i will use "herO" and if it doesn't work, whatever. | ||
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Elentos
55581 Posts
On December 15 2015 07:32 The_Red_Viper wrote: This is for sc2 though. The only relevant hero (i even did the capital "o") is CJ.herO. So yeah, i will use "herO" and if it doesn't work, whatever. You're right, it doesn't make sense. And they had it changed at some point so you could get CJ herO and Liquid HerO easier with TLPD. And then they changed it back for whatever reason. | ||
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