On February 21 2014 18:53 Darkhorse wrote: Shit but Classic is really good. Hopefully Maru does well in TvZ
Hahahahahaa
...Explain yourself if you're just going to do that please. Or just don't do it.
TvZ is by far Maru's worst MU and he's lost a lot in it recently. Granted, those games were mostly against Soulkey...
Yeah but did I say, "I bet Maru does well in TvZ!" nope I said I hope he will. I also hope I win the lottery which will never happen. So yeah nice response.
Nitpicking, nice...
Lol. It's what I said and what I meant. You chose to respond in a stupid way. Call it nitpicking if you want.
On February 21 2014 18:53 teamamerica wrote: I wonder how Classic vs Polt would do. Imo Polt goes into ghosts a bit quicker the Maru but he also tries to play a really drop heavy aggressive style, and Classic just handles this shit.
I don't know any Protoss outside Rain maybe who would have lost so little to Polts aggro from game 1. More power to Classic I guess. Glad to see such high level Protoss play.
Polt already beat Classic at IEM
In a weekend tournament with no preparation and classic being outside of Korea for the first time in his life. I think what he meant was have classic and polt face off in a decent environment.
Classic was already in Cologne for a few days. How is the ESL studio not a decent enviroment.
I didn't say jetlagged I said it was his first time outside of Korea and Rain even talked about having to comfort Classic due to this. First and for most it doesn't even have booths, but my main point is rather that beating someone by 1 map with little to no preparation for that match is very different to having 1+ week to prepare for 1 opponent, so just because polt beat classic at IEM doesn't necessarily mean he would have performed better than Maru if he had played Classic today.
So you're just wildly speculating. Firstly who said that the korean style of playing games after weeks of preparation is the only valid style to measure skill? Also as far as I remember Polt was pretty good at preparing too. And of course classic has the potential to beat Polt in a BoX.. All top korean pros are so close in skill, that they can beat each other in a Bo3 or 5.
I don't think you even comprehend my point. The situation at hand IS preperation format, which one prefer doesn't even matter here, and all I was saying is that classic vs polt is not comparable to maru vs classic as the circumstances are way too different so talking about how Polt beat Classic makes little sense when you compare it to marus performance in the last two games.
On February 21 2014 19:02 gTank wrote: I wonder why it is called Blink all in if there is basically no risk doing it, not doing that much damage and transitioning into a strong midgame? Isn't the definition of all in to do something with high risk, high reward option?
2base blink isn't really an all in. It was already popular for some time on Antiga back in the day (people tend to forget that). The problem is the map pools makes this opening really strong (too?).
On February 21 2014 19:01 Vindicare605 wrote: I missed the first set. Anyone got a quick sum up of what happened? Macro games? Blink All ins? Oracles?
First game was amazing (Dear vs Maru-esque situation, with a very cool comp by Classic) and second game was blink all-in into whine. Protoss won, which means everything is wrong with us (apparently morphing archons is OP now). Players were good, LR was average-bad (I expected it to be way worse honestly
On February 21 2014 18:53 vthree wrote: Serious, so many protoss are afraid of the blink cool down nerf. But nothing in that game made the blink cool down necessary...
What? everytime he was inside Marus base he was waiting for the cooldown to finish and lost units in the progress. When he was chasing the units in the middle, he was waiting for it to finish so he could blink forward first, and backwards later on. There were so many situations in that game where +5seconds on blink might have been desastrous for classic!
Yeah imagine an all in build actually being risky and committal for the attacker. That would be so wrong....
didn't say that it is necessary for Protoss to play like that, so you are arguing against a strawman. I merely said that it would have a big impact on this game, since vthree said it wouldn't...
Well the whole point of the proposed balance changes is to make an impact on blink play.
yeah. Which again goes against nothing I was saying. Just pointing out that unlike vthree said it would have had a huge impact on how the game played out.
I didn't say it didn't impact the game. I am saying it is necessary for the survival of the protoss. Protoss were claiming that protoss NEED the 10 sec CD of TvP would tilt the other way.
On February 21 2014 18:57 Loccstana wrote: its obvious from these games that ghosts need some sort of buff. Either a cost reduction or dps increase.
ghosts would be perfectly fine if blizzard didn't completely fuck up the time they nerfed the ghost, and we've seen how stubborn blizzard is when it comes to reverting bad changes (the ghost nerf should have been just snipe doing less damage to massive units, rather than just less damage to everything)
Well part of the issue is that you can't retreat with ghosts because they don't stim, so it really limits how aggressive you can be. I guess maybe you can pick up your ghosts and boost away, I wonder why pros don't really do that?
On February 21 2014 19:01 Vindicare605 wrote: I missed the first set. Anyone got a quick sum up of what happened? Macro games? Blink All ins? Oracles?
First game was amazing (Dear vs Maru-esque situation, with a very cool comp by Classic) and second game was blink all-in into whine. Protoss won, which means everything is wrong with us (apparently morphing archons is OP now). Players were good, LR was average-bad (I expected it to be way worse honestly
wow cheers man
I think he meant the LR thread not your live report haha you're doing great!
On February 21 2014 18:50 opterown wrote: [quote] yeah but costs more energy -> less FF
Isn't halluc 100 energy for all units?
oh i thought it cost more for bigger units
No, it is the same for all units. But, IIRC, you get two zealots for the price of one Hallucination. All the rest are single units.
you even get 4 probes!
Thanks, I've never considered hallucinating probes!
I've seen a few people do them as a manner mule type play
I do this when I want to sneak a probe out onto the map and 4-6 slow lings are outside my door.
I won a game vs a T with them to pretend I still had an economy so he would give up floating for the draw.
I can tell that T hadn't played 5k games worth of TvP. Even if they have an economy, a true T would just alt tab and force the Protoss into making a stargate and Void Ray just to spite him.
On February 21 2014 18:53 vthree wrote: Serious, so many protoss are afraid of the blink cool down nerf. But nothing in that game made the blink cool down necessary...
What? everytime he was inside Marus base he was waiting for the cooldown to finish and lost units in the progress. When he was chasing the units in the middle, he was waiting for it to finish so he could blink forward first, and backwards later on. There were so many situations in that game where +5seconds on blink might have been desastrous for classic!
Yeah imagine an all in build actually being risky and committal for the attacker. That would be so wrong....
didn't say that it is necessary for Protoss to play like that, so you are arguing against a strawman. I merely said that it would have a big impact on this game, since vthree said it wouldn't...
Well the whole point of the proposed balance changes is to make an impact on blink play.
yeah. Which again goes against nothing I was saying. Just pointing out that unlike vthree said it would have had a huge impact on how the game played out.
I didn't say it didn't impact the game. I am saying it is necessary for the survival of the protoss. Protoss were claiming that protoss NEED the 10 sec CD of TvP would tilt the other way.
But nothing in that game made the blink cool down necessary...
For the game to play out like that, it was hugely necessary!
On February 21 2014 18:53 teamamerica wrote: I wonder how Classic vs Polt would do. Imo Polt goes into ghosts a bit quicker the Maru but he also tries to play a really drop heavy aggressive style, and Classic just handles this shit.
I don't know any Protoss outside Rain maybe who would have lost so little to Polts aggro from game 1. More power to Classic I guess. Glad to see such high level Protoss play.
Polt already beat Classic at IEM
In a weekend tournament with no preparation and classic being outside of Korea for the first time in his life. I think what he meant was have classic and polt face off in a decent environment.
Classic was already in Cologne for a few days. How is the ESL studio not a decent enviroment.
I didn't say jetlagged I said it was his first time outside of Korea and Rain even talked about having to comfort Classic due to this. First and for most it doesn't even have booths, but my main point is rather that beating someone by 1 map with little to no preparation for that match is very different to having 1+ week to prepare for 1 opponent, so just because polt beat classic at IEM doesn't necessarily mean he would have performed better than Maru if he had played Classic today.
So you're just wildly speculating. Firstly who said that the korean style of playing games after weeks of preparation is the only valid style to measure skill? Also as far as I remember Polt was pretty good at preparing too. And of course classic has the potential to beat Polt in a BoX.. All top korean pros are so close in skill, that they can beat each other in a Bo3 or 5.
I don't think you even comprehend my point. The situation at hand IS preperation format, which one prefer doesn't even matter here, and all I was saying is that classic vs polt is not comparable to maru vs classic as the circumstances are way too different so talking about how Polt beat Classic makes little sense when you compare it to marus performance in the last two games.
But I didn't compare it. I just said Polt could do well against koreans in GSL which he did time and time again.
On February 21 2014 19:01 Vindicare605 wrote: I missed the first set. Anyone got a quick sum up of what happened? Macro games? Blink All ins? Oracles?
First game was amazing (Dear vs Maru-esque situation, with a very cool comp by Classic) and second game was blink all-in into whine. Protoss won, which means everything is wrong with us (apparently morphing archons is OP now). Players were good, LR was average-bad (I expected it to be way worse honestly
wow cheers man
I think he meant the LR thread not your live report haha you're doing great!
Are we now giving ratings on how good the threads are for each game?
On February 21 2014 18:57 Loccstana wrote: its obvious from these games that ghosts need some sort of buff. Either a cost reduction or dps increase.
ghosts would be perfectly fine if blizzard didn't completely fuck up the time they nerfed the ghost, and we've seen how stubborn blizzard is when it comes to reverting bad changes (the ghost nerf should have been just snipe doing less damage to massive units, rather than just less damage to everything)
Well part of the issue is that you can't retreat with ghosts because they don't stim, so it really limits how aggressive you can be. I guess maybe you can pick up your ghosts and boost away, I wonder why pros don't really do that?
Yeah, Emp drops would be sick, but you would need to EMP your medivac to avoid loosing hardcore.
Either way, Maru should have been able to force Classic to get a third and camp out side Marus base. I hate that you can just a-move in to a fortified natural with a decent army defending. Protoss are well able to buy some time by camp their base with MsC and storm. They way Classic just walk right in there and pretty much ended the game bothers me.
On February 21 2014 19:01 Vindicare605 wrote: I missed the first set. Anyone got a quick sum up of what happened? Macro games? Blink All ins? Oracles?
First game was amazing (Dear vs Maru-esque situation, with a very cool comp by Classic) and second game was blink all-in into whine. Protoss won, which means everything is wrong with us (apparently morphing archons is OP now). Players were good, LR was average-bad (I expected it to be way worse honestly
wow cheers man
I think he meant the LR thread not your live report haha you're doing great!
Are we now giving ratings on how good the threads are for each game?
Yeah and if the thread is too bad they just ban literally everyone who posted in it.
EPT
That's like my favorite map in the pool probably
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/icons/9.png){kind=icon}
Hydra vs. 
