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[Code S] Grand Finals WCS Korea Season 1 2013 - Page 372

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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ObeseHydra
Profile Joined March 2013
Brazil196 Posts
June 01 2013 16:51 GMT
#7421
The game is not made only of mechanical skill. Yes, Innovation may be more skilled than Soulkey (not much, this is dificult to measure), but the decision making and willpower are of equal importance. And, this time, the Zerg player got the upper hand on both.

Great finals, imo. Even if I lost 20 bucks on my bet on Bogus with a friend. =/

MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
June 01 2013 16:57 GMT
#7422
That 4-3 comeback, jesus
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
June 01 2013 16:58 GMT
#7423
On June 02 2013 01:16 lichter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 02 2013 01:04 ShowTheLights wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 Havik_ wrote:
On June 02 2013 00:40 ssg wrote:
What the fuck went to bed after game 3


You didn't miss much. Games weren't good. Quality wise they were about on parity with Seed vs MC

Game 1: Proxy rax
Game 2-5: Roach Baneling all in
Game 6: Proxy rax
Game 7: Mediocre macro game

Kespa players have a knack for cheesing, so I guess this shouldn't be too surprising, but I expected better, especially from Innovation.


Summarized very well.


Eh. It's actually kinda inaccurate

1 - Proxy 12/12. Soulkey just dies.
2 - Hellbat drop opening into 3cc does no damage. Soulkey decides to roach hydra attack, but a drop does too much damage so he decides to keep attacking. Over extends, dies on the counter eventually.
3 - Soulkey decides to roach bane all in on cross positions Whirlwind. Gets in, but Innovation's amazing micro saves him. Counter into gg.
4 - Speed roach speed bane all in on 3 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
5 - Slow roach and bane all in on 2.5 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
6 - Failed 2rax because Soulkey cancels his hatch. Baneling counter into gg.
7 - Macro game. Innovation's 3rd cc denied. Triple drop dies to mutas. gg.

Yeah, 2, 3 (for the amazing defense by Innovation) and 7 were the only ones worth watching. In 7 you could really see in Innovation's play how desperate he must've gotten by then, the three medivacs full with army would never have been lost by him if he wasn't nervous as hell.

Soulkey really won with his nerves of steel today, he earned my respect with that!
Get off my lawn, young punks
WIllBIll
Profile Joined June 2011
590 Posts
June 01 2013 16:58 GMT
#7424
What the fuck how did this happen, I went to sleep at 3-0. God damnit. Really happy Soulkey won tho.
lichter
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
June 01 2013 17:02 GMT
#7425
On June 02 2013 01:58 ACrow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 02 2013 01:16 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 ShowTheLights wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 Havik_ wrote:
On June 02 2013 00:40 ssg wrote:
What the fuck went to bed after game 3


You didn't miss much. Games weren't good. Quality wise they were about on parity with Seed vs MC

Game 1: Proxy rax
Game 2-5: Roach Baneling all in
Game 6: Proxy rax
Game 7: Mediocre macro game

Kespa players have a knack for cheesing, so I guess this shouldn't be too surprising, but I expected better, especially from Innovation.


Summarized very well.


Eh. It's actually kinda inaccurate

1 - Proxy 12/12. Soulkey just dies.
2 - Hellbat drop opening into 3cc does no damage. Soulkey decides to roach hydra attack, but a drop does too much damage so he decides to keep attacking. Over extends, dies on the counter eventually.
3 - Soulkey decides to roach bane all in on cross positions Whirlwind. Gets in, but Innovation's amazing micro saves him. Counter into gg.
4 - Speed roach speed bane all in on 3 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
5 - Slow roach and bane all in on 2.5 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
6 - Failed 2rax because Soulkey cancels his hatch. Baneling counter into gg.
7 - Macro game. Innovation's 3rd cc denied. Triple drop dies to mutas. gg.

Yeah, 2, 3 (for the amazing defense by Innovation) and 7 were the only ones worth watching. In 7 you could really see in Innovation's play how desperate he must've gotten by then, the three medivacs full with army would never have been lost by him if he wasn't nervous as hell.

Soulkey really won with his nerves of steel today, he earned my respect with that!


I do not remember Innovation ever going for a doom drop like that. Always multipronged drops, better never all his eggs in one basket.
AdministratorYOU MUST HEED MY INSTRUCTIONS TAKE OFF YOUR THIIIINGS
IPA
Profile Joined August 2010
United States3206 Posts
June 01 2013 17:02 GMT
#7426
People apparently want 200/200 death ball play only?

Such an exciting, action packed series. Incredible control and crisp all ins. I loved this series and cheered when Soulkey was crying on stage.
Time held me green and dying though I sang in my chains like the sea.
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-01 17:07:01
June 01 2013 17:03 GMT
#7427
On June 02 2013 02:02 lichter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 02 2013 01:58 ACrow wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:16 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 ShowTheLights wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 Havik_ wrote:
On June 02 2013 00:40 ssg wrote:
What the fuck went to bed after game 3


You didn't miss much. Games weren't good. Quality wise they were about on parity with Seed vs MC

Game 1: Proxy rax
Game 2-5: Roach Baneling all in
Game 6: Proxy rax
Game 7: Mediocre macro game

Kespa players have a knack for cheesing, so I guess this shouldn't be too surprising, but I expected better, especially from Innovation.


Summarized very well.


Eh. It's actually kinda inaccurate

1 - Proxy 12/12. Soulkey just dies.
2 - Hellbat drop opening into 3cc does no damage. Soulkey decides to roach hydra attack, but a drop does too much damage so he decides to keep attacking. Over extends, dies on the counter eventually.
3 - Soulkey decides to roach bane all in on cross positions Whirlwind. Gets in, but Innovation's amazing micro saves him. Counter into gg.
4 - Speed roach speed bane all in on 3 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
5 - Slow roach and bane all in on 2.5 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
6 - Failed 2rax because Soulkey cancels his hatch. Baneling counter into gg.
7 - Macro game. Innovation's 3rd cc denied. Triple drop dies to mutas. gg.

Yeah, 2, 3 (for the amazing defense by Innovation) and 7 were the only ones worth watching. In 7 you could really see in Innovation's play how desperate he must've gotten by then, the three medivacs full with army would never have been lost by him if he wasn't nervous as hell.

Soulkey really won with his nerves of steel today, he earned my respect with that!


I do not remember Innovation ever going for a doom drop like that. Always multipronged drops, better never all his eggs in one basket.

You didn't see the three fully packed medivacs in game seven flying directly into Soulkey's mutas? Which was what lost him the last game?

Edit: at around 9:55 in set 7 http://www.gomtv.net/2013wcs1/vod/80094
Innovation was, arguably, ahead until that point in time. He even knew the mutas were in that area, because mere seconds before that his lone viking was killed in that exact spot. He was very shaken in that game.
Get off my lawn, young punks
PVJ
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
Hungary5221 Posts
June 01 2013 17:03 GMT
#7428
Woongjin to make the grand slam and win OSL - GSL - SPL this year. WAAAARRRGGGHHHHH ~~~~~~~~

So sorry for Bogus tho. Hope he doesn't fall from here, and we seem him in the next finals again. We need consistency.
The heart's eternal vow
renkin
Profile Joined July 2010
France249 Posts
June 01 2013 17:03 GMT
#7429
On June 02 2013 01:39 Snowpoint wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I know there was all the 'why no macro game' complaints, but I don't think it was for lack of trying.

Games 1 & 6: Yes they were both proxy rax. But Game 1 was a great mind-game, and Game 6 showed why you don't try it twice after getting your opponent to commit to drone scout every game after the first time you try it.

Games 3, 4 & 5: It seems that Soulkey had recognized the greedy 3CC build with minimal army that Innovation frequently played, so he had a couple variants of timing counters ready. Ling/Bling Run-by (G3), Speed Roach/Bling (G4) and Roach/Bling followed by Speed Roach/Bling (G5). Short games with timing attacks might not always be the most fun, but strategically they were a brilliant prepared response to not just a macro build, but to the very greedy macro build that Innovation used too frequently.

A friend pointed out to me that these Roach/Bling timings happened a lot less in WoL because terrans played a lot more of a siege tank style, which defended them. The big note is that Innovation used very similar openings that wasn't overly safe 3 games in a row. To the 'macro' criers: there is no reason to put yourself behind by allowing your opponent to freely do a very greedy macro build. A chink in the armor of that build type was found, and exploited.

Games 2 & 7: These two games featured Innovation going for the Hellbat drop into macro style that is commonly seen in the current meta. The only problem? Soulkey's drop defense style shut it down extremely hard. Ling/Roach, then Hydra after defended with nearly no losses (G2), and Ling/Roach then Muta after defended with minimal losses (G7).

Oddly, after the initial drops failed to be cost efficient, both games were decided by micro mistakes/attention that snowballed the game. Soulkey's move of Roach/Hydra across the map without Hydra speed upgrade completed, and then Innovation's 3 Medivac drop after the Muta pack had already been confirmed on the map (and not boosting them to safety the moment he saw the Muta on the minimap).

Final Thoughts: Thus after a good night's sleep to gather my thoughts, Innovation was not innovative in his play style through the sets. 2 proxy rax (succeeded, then failed hard), 2 Hellbat drop expand builds (succeeded, then failed on repeat), and 3x3CC early builds (succeeded, then busted hard on both repeats). By the 3rd time he tried the 3CC build, he should have made some sort of adjustment to be better prepared for almost expected roach/bling all-in.

I really have to applaud Soulkey's prepared reaction builds to what he was seeing. He made a couple of small mistakes of army movement in games 2 and 3 (lings dying before banes done, and roach/hydra @ opposing natural) that nearly cost him the series. He deserved the win.



Totally agreed.
The reason Soulkey won is because he saw and exploited every flaw he found.
The way they lost because of those little little mistakes shows how high level it was ( exept the triple drop into the muta cloud, I guess he started to feel the pressure ).

What could you expect when 2 macro specialists prevent each other to go where they feel the strongest ?
lichter
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
June 01 2013 17:04 GMT
#7430
On June 02 2013 02:03 ACrow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 02 2013 02:02 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:58 ACrow wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:16 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 ShowTheLights wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 Havik_ wrote:
On June 02 2013 00:40 ssg wrote:
What the fuck went to bed after game 3


You didn't miss much. Games weren't good. Quality wise they were about on parity with Seed vs MC

Game 1: Proxy rax
Game 2-5: Roach Baneling all in
Game 6: Proxy rax
Game 7: Mediocre macro game

Kespa players have a knack for cheesing, so I guess this shouldn't be too surprising, but I expected better, especially from Innovation.


Summarized very well.


Eh. It's actually kinda inaccurate

1 - Proxy 12/12. Soulkey just dies.
2 - Hellbat drop opening into 3cc does no damage. Soulkey decides to roach hydra attack, but a drop does too much damage so he decides to keep attacking. Over extends, dies on the counter eventually.
3 - Soulkey decides to roach bane all in on cross positions Whirlwind. Gets in, but Innovation's amazing micro saves him. Counter into gg.
4 - Speed roach speed bane all in on 3 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
5 - Slow roach and bane all in on 2.5 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
6 - Failed 2rax because Soulkey cancels his hatch. Baneling counter into gg.
7 - Macro game. Innovation's 3rd cc denied. Triple drop dies to mutas. gg.

Yeah, 2, 3 (for the amazing defense by Innovation) and 7 were the only ones worth watching. In 7 you could really see in Innovation's play how desperate he must've gotten by then, the three medivacs full with army would never have been lost by him if he wasn't nervous as hell.

Soulkey really won with his nerves of steel today, he earned my respect with that!


I do not remember Innovation ever going for a doom drop like that. Always multipronged drops, better never all his eggs in one basket.

You didn't see the three fully packed medivacs in game seven flying directly into Soulkey's mutas? Which was what lost him the last game?


I mean in other games. That's the first time I've ever seen him do something that desperate.
AdministratorYOU MUST HEED MY INSTRUCTIONS TAKE OFF YOUR THIIIINGS
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
June 01 2013 17:08 GMT
#7431
On June 02 2013 02:04 lichter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 02 2013 02:03 ACrow wrote:
On June 02 2013 02:02 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:58 ACrow wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:16 lichter wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 ShowTheLights wrote:
On June 02 2013 01:04 Havik_ wrote:
On June 02 2013 00:40 ssg wrote:
What the fuck went to bed after game 3


You didn't miss much. Games weren't good. Quality wise they were about on parity with Seed vs MC

Game 1: Proxy rax
Game 2-5: Roach Baneling all in
Game 6: Proxy rax
Game 7: Mediocre macro game

Kespa players have a knack for cheesing, so I guess this shouldn't be too surprising, but I expected better, especially from Innovation.


Summarized very well.


Eh. It's actually kinda inaccurate

1 - Proxy 12/12. Soulkey just dies.
2 - Hellbat drop opening into 3cc does no damage. Soulkey decides to roach hydra attack, but a drop does too much damage so he decides to keep attacking. Over extends, dies on the counter eventually.
3 - Soulkey decides to roach bane all in on cross positions Whirlwind. Gets in, but Innovation's amazing micro saves him. Counter into gg.
4 - Speed roach speed bane all in on 3 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
5 - Slow roach and bane all in on 2.5 bases. Innovation doesn't like tanks. Dies.
6 - Failed 2rax because Soulkey cancels his hatch. Baneling counter into gg.
7 - Macro game. Innovation's 3rd cc denied. Triple drop dies to mutas. gg.

Yeah, 2, 3 (for the amazing defense by Innovation) and 7 were the only ones worth watching. In 7 you could really see in Innovation's play how desperate he must've gotten by then, the three medivacs full with army would never have been lost by him if he wasn't nervous as hell.

Soulkey really won with his nerves of steel today, he earned my respect with that!


I do not remember Innovation ever going for a doom drop like that. Always multipronged drops, better never all his eggs in one basket.

You didn't see the three fully packed medivacs in game seven flying directly into Soulkey's mutas? Which was what lost him the last game?


I mean in other games. That's the first time I've ever seen him do something that desperate.

Totally agreed, it was only until game 7 that he had a big break down. It's amazing what composure Soulkey showed by turning the 0-3 into a 4-3.
Get off my lawn, young punks
NapkinBox
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States314 Posts
June 01 2013 17:17 GMT
#7432
On June 02 2013 02:02 IPA wrote:
People apparently want 200/200 death ball play only?

Such an exciting, action packed series. Incredible control and crisp all ins. I loved this series and cheered when Soulkey was crying on stage.


No one is saying they want 200/200 death ball... This series didn't show any of that "exciting, action packed" TvZ we all loved through the years and seeing the players are Soulkey and Innovation, it was a major disappointment.
"Who has the best durability feat in all of comic book superheroes?" "Aquaman surviving pop culture."
ObeseHydra
Profile Joined March 2013
Brazil196 Posts
June 01 2013 17:20 GMT
#7433
On June 02 2013 02:02 IPA wrote:
People apparently want 200/200 death ball play only?

Such an exciting, action packed series. Incredible control and crisp all ins. I loved this series and cheered when Soulkey was crying on stage.



No, complainers are just always more vocal and anoying. If you check the pools, will see the majority of us gave 4 or 5 stars for the series. =)

People just like to complain. They bash 200/200 deathball and now complain because there were none of this boring stuff on the finals.
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
June 01 2013 17:25 GMT
#7434
I missed the last two games but it was a surprisingly disappointing finals for me, too many all-ins. Either way, grats to Soulkey, he definitely deserves it more.
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
Proseat
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Germany5113 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-01 17:27:03
June 01 2013 17:26 GMT
#7435
What a comeback by SoulKey. Gratz!

I hope in a while WCS Europe and WCS America will put on similar giant shows for their finals.
The Rise and Fall of SlayerS -- a timeline: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=378097
Zealously
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
East Gorteau22261 Posts
June 01 2013 17:37 GMT
#7436
I don't understand why anyone would ever go to bed when a Bo7 is at 3-0 when players like Life, Squirtle (and now Soulkey) exist. Do you want to miss comebacks?
AdministratorBreak the chains
lichter
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
June 01 2013 17:39 GMT
#7437
On June 02 2013 02:26 Proseat wrote:
What a comeback by SoulKey. Gratz!

I hope in a while WCS Europe and WCS America will put on similar giant shows for their finals.


WCS EU is done yo

Honestly the games were about 12x more fun
AdministratorYOU MUST HEED MY INSTRUCTIONS TAKE OFF YOUR THIIIINGS
lichter
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
June 01 2013 17:40 GMT
#7438
On June 02 2013 02:37 Zealously wrote:
I don't understand why anyone would ever go to bed when a Bo7 is at 3-0 when players like Life, Squirtle (and now Soulkey) exist. Do you want to miss comebacks?


Not enough esports passion
AdministratorYOU MUST HEED MY INSTRUCTIONS TAKE OFF YOUR THIIIINGS
opterown *
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia54784 Posts
June 01 2013 17:41 GMT
#7439
On June 02 2013 02:37 Zealously wrote:
I don't understand why anyone would ever go to bed when a Bo7 is at 3-0 when players like Life, Squirtle (and now Soulkey) exist. Do you want to miss comebacks?

yeah but it was 3-0 pretty one-sided bad games
ModeratorRetired LR Bonjwa
TL+ Member
DiuLaSing
Profile Joined August 2011
Hong Kong225 Posts
June 01 2013 17:41 GMT
#7440
is the stream down? why nothing is playing...sorry just logged in
"You just abuse idiocy" - bad boy
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