I'm pumped. I've been waiting to see Ragnarok for a long time. My expectations are probably higher than they should be given the minor showings from him, but the smalls signs are all pointing towards positives. I even took the risk of making him the captain of my fantasy team.
- Only 16 - Former TSL zerg - One of the strongest zergs during the beta - Pretty much only has ZvT to play lately given his code A path and Prime's heavy dependence on them.
If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
worse than NSH coach sending out Tassadar as ace? wow Fionn getting seriously mad at Gerrard these days.
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
worse than NSH coach sending out Tassadar as ace? wow Fionn getting seriously mad at Gerrard these days.
Gerrard's really stuck between a rock and a hard place. Either send out his four best players to almost certainly get sniped, or send some rookies who will almost certainly lose embarrassingly.
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
Axiom-Acer has the best Coach. Which other team now has a coach that will personally step into the booth and finish off the last player of the opposing team?
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
Axiom-Acer has the best Coach. Which other team now has a coach that will personally step into the booth and finish off the last player of the opposing team?
Well there used to be FXO... but then Choya retired
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
........... so who else would you send out on the prime bench hm? exactly. maru mkp creator and byun.
I really don't see the problem of sending out the new kids, even if there is a 95% of them losing. Get them experience. Give them a chance.
The ONLY reason why he should be sending the same four over and over is because Prime needs to win this season or they're disbanding. If Prime was in a good place financially and stable, there should be no reason why they can't give Mini Clide or Mini Choya a chance to play. Going into a series and telling your opponents that you aren't playing a Zerg? It makes practicing and sniping your players extremely easy.
On May 17 2013 10:16 Fionn wrote: I really don't see the problem of sending out the new kids, even if there is a 95% of them losing. Get them experience. Give them a chance.
The ONLY reason why he should be sending the same four over and over is because Prime needs to win this season or they're disbanding. If Prime was in a good place financially and stable, there should be no reason why they can't give Mini Clide or Mini Choya a chance to play. Going into a series and telling your opponents that you aren't playing a Zerg? It makes practicing and sniping your players extremely easy.
from what it seems like, this is true. they need wins BAD. They believe (from what it looks like) they can't take chances right now so they are sending out their experienced players. Well who knows, they might even send out one of their zergs for a change.(doubt it though)
RagnaroK will defeat Maru, MKP, and Creator and then Byun will cheese him, Squirtle, and Mvp out. Yoda will then be sent out and he will absolutely dominate and humiliate Byun. Anyone agree?
On May 17 2013 10:21 The_Templar wrote: RagnaroK will defeat Maru, MKP, and Creator and then Byun will cheese him, Squirtle, and Mvp out. Yoda will then be sent out and he will absolutely dominate and humiliate Byun. Anyone agree?
On May 17 2013 10:21 The_Templar wrote: RagnaroK will defeat Maru, MKP, and Creator and then Byun will cheese him, Squirtle, and Mvp out. Yoda will then be sent out and he will absolutely dominate and humiliate Byun. Anyone agree?
Mvp learned teleport!
Yoda gets to play twice. Once as himself and once with the spirit of MVP possessing him.
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
........... so who else would you send out on the prime bench hm? exactly. maru mkp creator and byun.
Anyone.
Team league isn't always about the best players. It's about sniping, practicing for certain players, and having a strong anchor that can carry at the end. Also, if Prime isn't on death's door, then they should be wanting to develop their new members. How is someone like Mini Clide ever going to do well if he isn't given a chance?
Any time a team can ignore an entire race, you aren't going to win a championship.
On May 17 2013 10:21 The_Templar wrote: RagnaroK will defeat Maru, MKP, and Creator and then Byun will cheese him, Squirtle, and Mvp out. Yoda will then be sent out and he will absolutely dominate and humiliate Byun. Anyone agree?
Mvp learned teleport!
Yoda gets to play twice. Once as himself and once with the spirit of MVP possessing him.
On May 17 2013 08:41 Fionn wrote: If Gerrard uses the same four players again, then I vote him the worst coach in GSTL history. That beats Axiom-Acer who actually doesn't even have a coach.
........... so who else would you send out on the prime bench hm? exactly. maru mkp creator and byun.
Anyone.
Team league isn't always about the best players. It's about sniping, practicing for certain players, and having a strong anchor that can carry at the end. Also, if Prime isn't on death's door, then they should be wanting to develop their new members. How is someone like Mini Clide ever going to do well if he isn't given a chance?
Any time a team can ignore an entire race, you aren't going to win a championship.
I totally agree, they should prepare the newbies as snipers, only question I have is......which one do you think is Mini Clide, and which is Mini Choya?
I've generally liked IM and never got much impressions from PRIME, but this is getting to the point where I do feel some pity for them. So, from one fan of a GSTL underdog to another...good luck Prime guys and I hope to see them surprise us all with good play.
On May 17 2013 10:16 Fionn wrote: The ONLY reason why he should be sending the same four over and over is because Prime needs to win this season or they're disbanding.
If that's the case, they're pretty much already disbanded. You can't get the four same players of the same race (and Creator) every match and expect to beat teams with even moderate depth, especially when two (three?) of the four are underperforming...
Despite currently being below the playoff line, IM has done pretty decently so far. The thing is, they haven't met any of the "weaker" teams until now, finally they meet Prime and they haven't met NSH (A lot of other teams have a free NSH win/all-kill to edge out IM at the moment).
Thanks! Added them to OP. :D Normally I can crosscheck with old threads, but most people don't put in the Kpop, so couldn't find recent examples of this playlist.
Prime's roster looks like its getting smaller and smaller...can't be long before they fold? I don't want them too, but i mean they haven't got that strong of a roster when you take out Byun. Maru has potential, Creator too. MKP has been in a slump for months and doesn't look like he is even being coached out of it. Byun himself has nerve issuese stopping him perform in the booths. >.< Sad times
Wish Khaldor wouldn't downtune IM so much... They are tied in points with 3rd place, and they haven't played any of the "freewin"-ish matches (Prime (sorry) and NSH (mildly sorry)). I'd be pretty surprised if LG-IM didn't make the playoffs.
On May 17 2013 18:23 Pandemona wrote: Prime's roster looks like its getting smaller and smaller...can't be long before they fold? I
People have been saying that about NSH forever, I doubt they will fold they just won't grow which is worse imo. So many good player's getting no support/exposure.
On May 17 2013 18:24 Nebuchad wrote: Wish Khaldor wouldn't downtune IM so much... They are tied in points with 3rd place, and they haven't played any of the "freewin"-ish matches (Prime (sorry) and NSH (mildly sorry)). I'd be pretty surprised if LG-IM didn't make the playoffs.
IM is my favorite team, but you can't blame him lol. IM breaks my heart every god damn GSTL season. Losing to teams they really shouldn't.
On May 17 2013 18:24 Nebuchad wrote: Wish Khaldor wouldn't downtune IM so much... They are tied in points with 3rd place, and they haven't played any of the "freewin"-ish matches (Prime (sorry) and NSH (mildly sorry)). I'd be pretty surprised if LG-IM didn't make the playoffs.
Exactly. Downtuning anyone in the 2-2 tie situation is silly. :p
On May 17 2013 18:24 Nebuchad wrote: Wish Khaldor wouldn't downtune IM so much... They are tied in points with 3rd place, and they haven't played any of the "freewin"-ish matches (Prime (sorry) and NSH (mildly sorry)). I'd be pretty surprised if LG-IM didn't make the playoffs.
IM is my favorite team, but you can't blame him lol. IM breaks my heart every god damn GSTL season. Losing to teams they really shouldn't.
Yeap same here man
Instead of MVP/NesTea all kills in 2011, we got piddled about
I have to say I approve of playing safe against Maru. Those lings could do slight pressure if Maru was CC first greedy, and defend if Maru is doing something aggressive.
On May 17 2013 18:24 Nebuchad wrote: Wish Khaldor wouldn't downtune IM so much... They are tied in points with 3rd place, and they haven't played any of the "freewin"-ish matches (Prime (sorry) and NSH (mildly sorry)). I'd be pretty surprised if LG-IM didn't make the playoffs.
IM is my favorite team, but you can't blame him lol. IM breaks my heart every god damn GSTL season. Losing to teams they really shouldn't.
I feel like they would shine in Proleague format. They have a stacked team but cant really show it.
On May 17 2013 18:36 Blaec wrote: That was nowhere near worth it for Ragnarok
it had potential
If he starts a contain with swarmhosts it could be very cool, but it just isn't worth it to spread creep.
He did the best he could considering it got scouted, I think delaying the third and getting in his opponents head was something at least.
I guess it is a good transition if you think your roach/ling nydus allin has failed. But it isn't a standalone tactic, nydus exits are too expensive and scans are too good at clearing creep.
On May 17 2013 18:36 Blaec wrote: That was nowhere near worth it for Ragnarok
it had potential
If he starts a contain with swarmhosts it could be very cool, but it just isn't worth it to spread creep.
He did the best he could considering it got scouted, I think delaying the third and getting in his opponents head was something at least.
I guess it is a good transition if you think your roach/ling nydus allin has failed. But it isn't a standalone tactic, nydus exits are too expensive and scans are too good a clearing creep.
Yeh I agree, in fairness when it was scouted Khaldor and Wolf made the excellent point that he just gave up on the all in straight away rather than force it and just spread creep and started back making drones so he really didn't have to give up too much.
On May 17 2013 18:36 Blaec wrote: That was nowhere near worth it for Ragnarok
it had potential
If he starts a contain with swarmhosts it could be very cool, but it just isn't worth it to spread creep.
He did the best he could considering it got scouted, I think delaying the third and getting in his opponents head was something at least.
I guess it is a good transition if you think your roach/ling nydus allin has failed. But it isn't a standalone tactic, nydus exits are too expensive and scans are too good a clearing creep.
Yeh I agree, in fairness when it was scouted Khaldor and Wolf made the excellent point that he just gave up on the all in straight away rather than force it and just spread creep and started back making drones so he really didn't have to give up too much.
Yeah it bought a lot of time and kept Maru unsure.
It is so frustrating getting stuck on Ragnarok's composition.
On May 17 2013 18:48 phrenzy wrote: Zerg army get weaker overtime, not s surprising result. Hope someone on IM can show if there is a way to play zvt.
Not throw away 7 ultras for one planetary would be an option. Zerg was very behind from the earlier stages of the game. I don't think RagnaroK would have lost that game in a complete standard macro game.
This was very cool but the contain put him quite behind and didn't really dely the third. However when he finally distracted Maru and got the nydus in the main the game equalized again. And it then became standard and all about control and mechanics.
There is still potential here though! For instance on a map with only one obvious third and doing the same with less nydus worms. They are just so expensive.
On May 17 2013 19:13 Ghanburighan wrote: "Really well done by First, lots of kills" He didn't do anything! Just a-clicked an oracle on the scv's and Maru was slow with the pull.
Huh, that was actually well done, his movements with the oracles, and scouting with the mothership core first, duping marines into moving to the low ground.
On May 17 2013 19:13 Ghanburighan wrote: "Really well done by First, lots of kills" He didn't do anything! Just a-clicked an oracle on the scv's and Maru was slow with the pull.
On May 17 2013 19:13 Ghanburighan wrote: "Really well done by First, lots of kills" He didn't do anything! Just a-clicked an oracle on the scv's and Maru was slow with the pull.
On May 17 2013 19:13 Ghanburighan wrote: "Really well done by First, lots of kills" He didn't do anything! Just a-clicked an oracle on the scv's and Maru was slow with the pull.
Huh, that was actually well done, his movements with the oracles, and scouting with the mothership core first, duping marines into moving to the low ground.
That quote was on the first oracle. Maru had his clump of marines on the ramp irrespective of the Msc. First just got lucky Maru wasn't positioning his marines properly.
On May 17 2013 19:13 Ghanburighan wrote: "Really well done by First, lots of kills" He didn't do anything! Just a-clicked an oracle on the scv's and Maru was slow with the pull.
Huh, that was actually well done, his movements with the oracles, and scouting with the mothership core first, duping marines into moving to the low ground.
That quote was on the first oracle. Maru had his clump of marines on the ramp irrespective of the Msc. First just got lucky Maru wasn't positioning his marines properly.
oracle play looks so stable if used correctly, first even lost one but anyways protoss seems to have so much control over the game right from the start with pressure, constant scouting etc
Hmm I wouldn't mind seeing Icarus in the ladder pool
It isn't the greatest map but it is cool to play on real GSL/GSTL maps and I think it could replace the new one with the narrow bridge that I vetoed after 1 game.
On May 17 2013 19:32 KelsierSC wrote: Hmm I wouldn't mind seeing Icarus in the ladder pool
It isn't the greatest map but it is cool to play on real GSL/GSTL maps and I think it could replace the new one with the narrow bridge that I vetoed after 1 game.
Anything would be a good replacement for that stupid bridge map.
On May 17 2013 19:32 KelsierSC wrote: Hmm I wouldn't mind seeing Icarus in the ladder pool
It isn't the greatest map but it is cool to play on real GSL/GSTL maps and I think it could replace the new one with the narrow bridge that I vetoed after 1 game.
Now when I think about it, yeah, you are right. Map isn't that good, but it is still much better than any Blizzard variations of two-base play Maps or rush maps.
sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
On May 17 2013 19:42 xgtx wrote: mkp lost yeahh! i love when overrated persons lose
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
Using the same four players over and over, disregarding an entire race, and not giving your new players booth experience is just bad. Teams don't win championships with predictability. You need snipers and versatility. Any time a team can just ignore an entire race, practice mostly vT, and have a Creator sniper, you're not going anywhere. Only way it works is if Byun or one of them goes god mode and carries.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
And IM sucks at team league. What's your point?
That Wolfdor & co are using a bad match to insist on how Prime's predictability is a problem?
On May 17 2013 19:49 Soda-88 wrote: GSL/GSTL/PL breaks between games are getting increasingly annoying now that ESL spoiled me with content between their games
On May 17 2013 19:49 Soda-88 wrote: GSL/GSTL/PL breaks between games are getting increasingly annoying now that ESL spoiled me with content between their games
GSL is fine cause they only break every 3 games or so.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
And IM sucks at team league. What's your point?
That Wolfdor & co are using a bad match to insist on how Prime's predictability is a problem?
Well prime are 1-3 in GSTL so far and it looks like things are about to get worse. predictability does seem to be a problem for them
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
And IM sucks at team league. What's your point?
That Wolfdor & co are using a bad match to insist on how Prime's predictability is a problem?
Well prime are 1-3 in GSTL so far and it looks like things are about to get worse. predictability does seem to be a problem for them
I agree it is, don't know why I was suddenly antagonized. Just agreeing with Tsubbi that this match has more to do with Prime stars underperforming than their small roster.
On May 17 2013 19:51 KristofferAG wrote: What's with these insanely long breaks
Is it always like this?
Yeah in GSTL it is, i just remembered why i stopped watching GSTL. Much better to just watch the VOD's, but i only invested in the regular GSL pass this time, cause i usualy dont have time to watch all of that starcraft anyways.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
And IM sucks at team league. What's your point?
That Wolfdor & co are using a bad match to insist on how Prime's predictability is a problem?
Well prime are 1-3 in GSTL so far and it looks like things are about to get worse. predictability does seem to be a problem for them
I agree it is, don't know why I was suddenly antagonized. Just agreeing with Tsubbi that this match has more to do with Prime stars underperforming than their small roster.
On May 17 2013 19:41 Tsubbi wrote: sorry but all this talk about predictablilty is over the top, after all prime has got 3 very strong terran players who surprisingly arent doing well in hots so far and creator, one of the strongest protosses at the end of wol who also looks worse than ever since hots
prime players are just not playing well lately somehow :/
I believe predictability does factor in to a team's relative strength. Their opposing team can easily prepare builds and counter builds when they know exactly what players are going to come online that day. Against a team like MVP or LGIM, their players are very diverse, and you will have more difficulty preparing yourself for the builds that could come against you.
That's one thing to say, but IM are notorious for not preparing for a team game that much, just picking four players and going with them no matter what. I don't think it's as much of a factor in this match as they make it to be.
And IM sucks at team league. What's your point?
That Wolfdor & co are using a bad match to insist on how Prime's predictability is a problem?
Well prime are 1-3 in GSTL so far and it looks like things are about to get worse. predictability does seem to be a problem for them
I agree it is, don't know why I was suddenly antagonized. Just agreeing with Tsubbi that this match has more to do with Prime stars underperforming than their small roster.
Hmm yeh maybe, I suppose it is hard to know the reason but I think that having a small roster can't help your team.
Just went on Liquipedia to check Prime's team, but ByuN, Creator, MKP and Maru are really all they have. The other 4 players I have never even heard of.
They really need to do something about the matchup, TvP has gotten incredibly stale. Toss on 2 bases vs a Terran with infinite economy hoping he doesn't fuck up his engagement.
At least Byun has better multitasking than MarineKing. *nightmare of that one zealot at the natural that MarineKing couldn't kill after multiple attempts in the previous game*
On May 17 2013 20:22 DasHawk wrote: Can someone explain why the fuck Byun turned around there??!!!! His only chance was basicly walking into the main and basetrade....
On May 17 2013 20:12 teddyoojo wrote: how is byun losing
No ghosts.
Shouldn´t make such a big difference, when the T is 50 supply up :/
no Ghosts, no Combat Shield, lot of supply in workers, 2 good storms.
Pretty much. People are saying this "50 supply up" nonsense. Supply doesn't really matter if your composition and micro aren't as good(not saying about this game exactly, but overall looking at it).
Wow, really suprised that he atleast dident try to win there? He had a decent army and first lost most his expensive units, yes he WAS mining, but he diden't really have a good bank.
That was kind of a weird GG. He sticks around for the fight, the when it goes as good for him as it possibly could he just leaves? He actually had a ghost of a chance there. Still so much Ghost energy and he retained enough Vikings.
I just have the impression that byun could have tryed to engage like 10 min ago, it looks like he was just moving in the middle of the map just to have zelot run-by and the main army picking him appart...-_-
people think it's a weird gg timing? he is getting teared apart by the chargelot run by, first has a huge bank to remax into whatever he needs because warpgate tech is pretty good at remaxing. he can even base trade if he really needs to
On May 17 2013 20:26 DoeniDon wrote: There was no point in trying to play that game out, First had a decent bank and all the infrastructure he would ever need.
On top of that First had HTs with energy at every single one of his bases.
oh yeah and there were about 10 zealots in Byun's main.
Normal gg timing
Yeah it looked like he had a chance but he was pretty dead.
On May 17 2013 20:25 Exarl25 wrote: That was kind of a weird GG. He sticks around for the fight, the when it goes as good for him as it possibly could he just leaves? He actually had a ghost of a chance there. Still so much Ghost energy and he retained enough Vikings.
Viking will be useless, also there was warp-in and many High Templars in home + cannons, there will be another warp-in before Buyn can even attack something - no point and he knows it
i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:23 teddyoojo wrote: wtf kind of gg timing is that? 70 to 90 army supply u can still try
First can just keep remaxing. There was nothing Byun could do at that point.
Yeah first had like 10 ht at home and byun had no bank so it was over, he just wanted to show his gosu army control
it was more like ByuN's like "fucking First, give me a fucking GG timing, engage me so I can get crushed and leave the game already" except First just refused to engage him and only kept compounding his lead. Once First actually DID engage ByuN, ByuN was prepped to leave after getting destroyed, but it was a horrible engagement from first and he actually won the fight... but he knew it was over regardless so he just left
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:23 teddyoojo wrote: wtf kind of gg timing is that? 70 to 90 army supply u can still try
First can just keep remaxing. There was nothing Byun could do at that point.
Yeah first had like 10 ht at home and byun had no bank so it was over, he just wanted to show his gosu army control
it was more like ByuN's like "fucking First, give me a fucking GG timing, engage me so I can get crushed and leave the game already" except First just refused to engage him and only kept compounding his lead. Once First actually DID engage ByuN, ByuN was prepped to leave after getting destroyed, but it was a horrible engagement from first and he actually won the fight... but he knew it was over regardless so he just left
That fight was even worse, I think no Archon attacked the Vikings, I am not sure but I think the Archons just walked by and died in the middle of the ramp doing nothing
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:23 teddyoojo wrote: wtf kind of gg timing is that? 70 to 90 army supply u can still try
First can just keep remaxing. There was nothing Byun could do at that point.
Yeah first had like 10 ht at home and byun had no bank so it was over, he just wanted to show his gosu army control
it was more like ByuN's like "fucking First, give me a fucking GG timing, engage me so I can get crushed and leave the game already" except First just refused to engage him and only kept compounding his lead. Once First actually DID engage ByuN, ByuN was prepped to leave after getting destroyed, but it was a horrible engagement from first and he actually won the fight... but he knew it was over regardless so he just left
This really accentuates just how infuriatingly First played that game, poor Byun.
against a 4base protos u need a 5base-20 rax approx and not 3base. With 5base 20rax u might can keep up if u constantly trade well. Else tosstech kiils u outright.
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
Look how many marauders and ghosts he had left! And really, first has 2 mining bases, but really no bank.. He he had the best shot of taking that game right after that fight than he had most the game..
The korean commentators are all questioning the timing and giving him a chance to win.
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:25 Exarl25 wrote: That was kind of a weird GG. He sticks around for the fight, the when it goes as good for him as it possibly could he just leaves? He actually had a ghost of a chance there. Still so much Ghost energy and he retained enough Vikings.
Viking will be useless, also there was warp-in and many High Templars in home + cannons, there will be another warp-in before Buyn can even attack something - no point and he knows it
They won't be useless, it means First can't chrono boost out a couple of Colossi and be in good shape. He had a good number of Ghosts so with perfect snipes/emps the HT would be negated. He had a good chunk of Marauders and plenty of Medivacs. First did not have a big bank. I'm not saying Byun was in a good position or was at all likely to win, but that went as good for him as it possibly could and it seems weird to stick around in a losing position only to leave when a comeback opportunity finally presents itself, slim as that opportunity may be.
The thing is, his base was already dying, he could go for the throat of First, and lose the baserace, or defend, which would lead to First simply remaxing.
On May 17 2013 20:31 govie wrote: against a 4base protos u need a 5base-20 rax approx and not 3base. With 5base 20rax u might can keep up if u constantly trade well. Else tosstech kiils u outright.
On May 17 2013 20:28 Bam Lee wrote: i think the point is that he just won a huge fight and could have atleast TRIED to do something instead of just leaving the game right after winning an engagement. Of course he didnt have much of a chance but he could have tried, lost his army and left afterwards
On May 17 2013 20:31 govie wrote: against a 4base protos u need a 5base-20 rax approx and not 3base. With 5base 20rax u might can keep up if u constantly trade well. Else tosstech kiils u outright.
I was rooting for LGIM all the way, and I dislike Prime, but gotta feel sorry for them. The way First ripped Creator apart was very brutal.
As a protoss player, losing a PvP like that (semi-build order loss) is one of the worst ways a game can go. It doesn't even feel like you played a game.
GG First and IM. Also wtf happened to Creator? I didnt have the time to watch all the sc after the Hots release cause of work, but I watched in last 3 days games of Creator and he is terrible.
On May 17 2013 20:52 ilikeredheads wrote: whats the warning they're talking about?
Pausing because your keybindings were wrong, arriving late, etc, all give you a warning. The warnings will amongst other things be used as a tiebreaker.
On May 17 2013 20:54 Porishan wrote: Prime need to change, they have only four players ? omg
They have some other players, but they refuse to field them at all.
It's never good when your big 4 keep getting smashed and then all killed
Felt bad for them
Yeah, you could see how crushed everyone felt, absolutely devastated. I don't understand how things went this sour for Prime, near the end of '12 they even had young prospects, ClassicPrime taking maps in the GSTL, and people like Salmosa qualifying for Code A.
On May 17 2013 21:05 djack0666 wrote: Prime needs to close down. This is too much
I'm not really a prime fan but the idea of them disbanding is sad. I'm pretty sure they're the oldest ESF team remaining and they were once one of the largest back at the dawn of WoL. I think only ogs and zenex had them beat in the number of players.
On May 17 2013 21:05 djack0666 wrote: Prime needs to close down. This is too much
I'm not really a prime fan but the idea of them disbanding is sad. I'm pretty sure they're the oldest ESF team remaining and they were once one of the largest back at the dawn of WoL. I think only ogs and zenex had them beat in the number of players.
On May 17 2013 21:05 djack0666 wrote: Prime needs to close down. This is too much
I'm not really a prime fan but the idea of them disbanding is sad. I'm pretty sure they're the oldest ESF team remaining and they were once one of the largest back at the dawn of WoL. I think only ogs and zenex had them beat in the number of players.
I know. But something in the TEAM is hurting the players. It is obvious that they are having trouble within Prime walls.
Can't stand seeing bullshit as what happened here today
Again a sad day. The season is over for Prime with that result. Now the only solution for their misery is focussing on long term recovery. Creator and Marineking have to change up their playstyle towards HotS. They're playing like they did in WoL and this doesn't cut it at all anymore. Maru and Byun seem more adapted but they need further refinement. I expect them to send out 2-3 B-Teamers in both their last matches from now on. They can't sink any further, so they have to get them out now to get them used to playing in the booth.
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
And EG-TL is def not going better than Prime, sure they've pulled a couple wins but for such a big organization with such financial backroll to be dead-last. EG was better off winning GSTL with SlayerS, TL as much as I love the branding has never been anywhere near competitive as a team in Korea.
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
Sad situation. :s
It's certainly time to start recruiting some new dogs to chew some bones.
I don't think you can blame Gerard for not sending out anyone else. These guys must play in-house ranking games. If he actually believed they even remotely stood a chance, he would probably give it a shot.
On May 18 2013 00:51 sitromit wrote: I don't think you can blame Gerard for not sending out anyone else. These guys must play in-house ranking games. If he actually believed they even remotely stood a chance, he would probably give it a shot.
If Gerard is the team manager, and his team has failed to recruit young talent to the point that they rely on a 4-player rotation for weeks on end, yes he is culpable...
On May 18 2013 00:51 sitromit wrote: I don't think you can blame Gerard for not sending out anyone else. These guys must play in-house ranking games. If he actually believed they even remotely stood a chance, he would probably give it a shot.
If Gerard is the team manager, and his team has failed to recruit young talent to the point that they rely on a 4-player rotation for weeks on end, yes he is culpable...
Well that's another can of worms entirely, we're just talking about the picks during the matches here. If you want to talk about Prime's troubles as a team, it's clear that they have some issues.
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
Sad situation. :s
It's certainly time to start recruiting some new dogs to chew some bones.
The problem is than, unlike a team like NHSEO, they still have 4 players relevant (they are all in up and down, except byun that still have to beat rain ), so it's a hard decision to send an inexperimented player over a code A/S regular, that is still relevant (NHSEO can do what they want, evryone is in code B
On May 18 2013 00:51 sitromit wrote: I don't think you can blame Gerard for not sending out anyone else. These guys must play in-house ranking games. If he actually believed they even remotely stood a chance, he would probably give it a shot.
Maybe but they are still on the team. Seeing their teammates getting killed time and time again without even having a chance to fight themselves has to feel really bad.
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
Sad situation. :s
It's certainly time to start recruiting some new dogs to chew some bones.
The problem is than, unlike a team like NHSEO, they still have 4 players relevant (they are all in up and down, except byun that still have to beat rain ), so it's a hard decision to send an inexperimented player over a code A/S regular, that is still relevant (NHSEO can do what they want, evryone is in code B
Well IM did it and look where they are now. I still remember the LR going crazy every time the IM coach refused to send Mvp/Losira/Nestea (back then their top3). And now look where they are now, a freaking powerhouse with so much players they need to choose ahead simply cause of the bench limit. (they need to get a bit better in teamleagues but their is progress)
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
Sad situation. :s
It's certainly time to start recruiting some new dogs to chew some bones.
The problem is than, unlike a team like NHSEO, they still have 4 players relevant (they are all in up and down, except byun that still have to beat rain ), so it's a hard decision to send an inexperimented player over a code A/S regular, that is still relevant (NHSEO can do what they want, evryone is in code B
Well IM did it and look where they are now. I still remember the LR going crazy every time the IM coach refused to send Mvp/Losira/Nestea (back then their top3). And now look where they are now, a freaking powerhouse with so much players they need to choose ahead simply cause of the bench limit. (they need to get a bit better in teamleagues but their is progress)
In the long term, yes, this is a great strategy to employ.
However like I pointed out earlier, I don't think this is feasible for Prime. Keep in mind IM had Mvp (and NesTea) winning tournaments left and right, both in Korea and outside. They had the exposure, they had the money, they even had that partnership with Quantic a bit later on. They also had a slightly larger roster. Prime doesn't have the same possibilities, at least by the looks of it. They're not only failing in team leagues, but failing overall in terms of results. Hopefully things will pick up for them. :/
On May 17 2013 20:43 Killmouse wrote: prime is egtl of gstl
no thats definately NSH.
NSH beat Prime though. Poor Prime, they're getting crushed left and right.
Overall on players I think Prime is the better team though. Frankly I think something needs to change in the PRIME mentality, they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator, no Zergs to be seen. People prob just prepare for those four only making it hard for them to show results. They need to have a little more faith in their other squad members to atleast see some games.
I swear the entire NSH team is in Code B...
The reason they keep sending Byun/Maru/MKP/Creator is because the rest of their players are code B with no experience. Having a Zerg or two to field would be great, but keep in mind their roster no longer includes Annyung, Terius, BboongBboong, Salmosa..
Unlike the IM of past, I don't think Prime can afford to just send out their inexperienced players and hope for the best, they're throwing the best they've currently got in an attempt to not get completely stomped and fade into irrelevance, especially considering their players haven't been doing all too well in individual leagues lately either.
Sad situation. :s
It's certainly time to start recruiting some new dogs to chew some bones.
The problem is than, unlike a team like NHSEO, they still have 4 players relevant (they are all in up and down, except byun that still have to beat rain ), so it's a hard decision to send an inexperimented player over a code A/S regular, that is still relevant (NHSEO can do what they want, evryone is in code B
Well IM did it and look where they are now. I still remember the LR going crazy every time the IM coach refused to send Mvp/Losira/Nestea (back then their top3). And now look where they are now, a freaking powerhouse with so much players they need to choose ahead simply cause of the bench limit. (they need to get a bit better in teamleagues but their is progress)
In the long term, yes, this is a great strategy to employ.
However like I pointed out earlier, I don't think this is feasible for Prime. Keep in mind IM had Mvp (and NesTea) winning tournaments left and right, both in Korea and outside. They had the exposure, they had the money, they even had that partnership with Quantic a bit later on. They also had a slightly larger roster. Prime doesn't have the same possibilities, at least by the looks of it. They're not only failing in team leagues, but failing overall in terms of results. Hopefully things will pick up for them. :/
True but is this so much better? I think its fair to say the way they are doing it currently is simply not working. Not to mention you got people coming to the studio everytime knowing they won't play anyway, has to feel depressing.
I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
Wow, as if I needed another reason to be a MKP anti-fan... xD I guess that's not really his fault though, more Gerrard being biased. It's just kind of annoying thinking about one player getting significantly special treatment in one way or another.
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
So the rumors about MKP not practicing are true?
It's kind of shocking to hear that they don't do in-house ranking matches.
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
So the rumors about MKP not practicing are true?
It's kind of shocking to hear that they don't do in-house ranking matches.
It doesnt sound like they really do anything at this point. just a bunch of guys laddering at the same house :/
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
Wow, as if I needed another reason to be a MKP anti-fan... xD I guess that's not really his fault though, more Gerrard being biased. It's just kind of annoying thinking about one player getting significantly special treatment in one way or another.
I only posted one example of that sort of mindset. mkp was able to get away with a lot more than everyone else. stuff that wouldn't be appropriate to post on TL. But even others things like mkp being very loud in the middle of practice, doing really kinda stupid stuff and distracting others from proper practice.
I think mkp more just lacks maturity, whereas someone like Creator has it in spades. Seriously Creator is one of the more hardworking players, whether that has changed I am not sure, I have not spoken to creator in a few months. mkp just doesn't worry or care about anyone else around him, I don't think he ever had that part of his brain developed. He has been in and out of teamhouses since he was like 15-16, that he forgets sometimes that this isn't his personal playhouse.
Personally I was shocked as well they didn't to in house rankings and barely (if ever) practiced against each other. It was very disappointing after a few weeks i had arrived at the house, I was just left to my own devices really and had to work on my own. I wish I had went to a different house, I would have improved much faster than I did at the prime house. They don't have a practice schedule, so players either slack off (most of primes players skill declines can be attributed to this), or they work themselves too hard. If Gerrard would just hire a coach who could get everyone into a strict practice regime, it would work wonders for prime. Prime players would have less stress, and would have free time to have fun (I remember a story about this actually, Gerrard was out for the evening and Byun was playing LoL, Classic saw me watching byun play and told me that I had to keep it a secret because Gerrard would get mad if he saw anyone playing other games than starcraft).
Stuff like that really is why prime won't be successful. I remember When they won the GSTL last year, I was in the house at the time. They slacked off pretty much constantly after they won, after they overworked themselves to the bone beforehand. They don't have any balance in their lives, and Gerrard take every chance he gets to save a penny, not even hiring a maid or proper cook to come around to make sure they get fresh food.
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
Wow, as if I needed another reason to be a MKP anti-fan... xD I guess that's not really his fault though, more Gerrard being biased. It's just kind of annoying thinking about one player getting significantly special treatment in one way or another.
I only posted one example of that sort of mindset. mkp was able to get away with a lot more than everyone else. stuff that wouldn't be appropriate to post on TL. But even others things like mkp being very loud in the middle of practice, doing really kinda stupid stuff and distracting others from proper practice.
I think mkp more just lacks maturity, whereas someone like Creator has it in spades. Seriously Creator is one of the more hardworking players, whether that has changed I am not sure, I have not spoken to creator in a few months. mkp just doesn't worry or care about anyone else around him, I don't think he ever had that part of his brain developed. He has been in and out of teamhouses since he was like 15-16, that he forgets sometimes that this isn't his personal playhouse.
Personally I was shocked as well they didn't to in house rankings and barely (if ever) practiced against each other. It was very disappointing after a few weeks i had arrived at the house, I was just left to my own devices really and had to work on my own. I wish I had went to a different house, I would have improved much faster than I did at the prime house. They don't have a practice schedule, so players either slack off (most of primes players skill declines can be attributed to this), or they work themselves too hard. If Gerrard would just hire a coach who could get everyone into a strict practice regime, it would work wonders for prime. Prime players would have less stress, and would have free time to have fun (I remember a story about this actually, Gerrard was out for the evening and Byun was playing LoL, Classic saw me watching byun play and told me that I had to keep it a secret because Gerrard would get mad if he saw anyone playing other games than starcraft).
Stuff like that really is why prime won't be successful. I remember When they won the GSTL last year, I was in the house at the time. They slacked off pretty much constantly after they won, after they overworked themselves to the bone beforehand. They don't have any balance in their lives, and Gerrard take every chance he gets to save a penny, not even hiring a maid or proper cook to come around to make sure they get fresh food.
Thank you for your insights. Usually I hate it when people who have no inside information make claims of "OMG Prime disbanding!", because that type of irrational fear-mongering really hurts teams. However, as someone who has lived in the Prime house, it's actually pretty amazing and interesting to hear about some of the management problems the team is having. And that does trouble me about Prime's future after hearing about your thoughts.
On May 17 2013 19:20 GunSec wrote: wtf i am confused, I thought maru had this win after he killed the 3rd expansion
TvP doesn't work that way. Just see Parting vs Flash in Code S, where Flash was ahead by 1 or 2 bases whole time and still loses. Problem is Protoss wins if they got this one perfect engagement in mid/lategame. If Terran wins this engagement Protoss still can warp in HT and lots of chargelots to win time to get the composition back they need, which takes several times as long for the terran, that is why you should always a-move vs a terran as soon as he has lost his army, it almost always works ;-)
But well in this case Maru had no eco left compared to the flash game. I was more upset about the MKP vs First game: Mkp had like 5 Upgrades (stim, combat shield, 1-1 etc) and still loses his first battle to this allin who has only (50 50 costing) gatewaytech behind. I think TvP is getting more and more boring, even below thel evels of PvZ in WoL
On May 17 2013 20:12 teddyoojo wrote: how is byun losing
No ghosts.
it SHOULDNT have mattered u dont need ghosts when u are 60 supply up it just made no sense
this is TvP Its a game of counters, and if you don't have the counters to storm... well in sc2 you insta-lose. I hate it too, but this is how the game is designed and it is considered "balanced" cause there is a counter possible to it. Doesn't matter if countering one unit is several times harder (and doesnt kill, like EMP vs Storms) as using the unit it counters
On May 17 2013 20:23 teddyoojo wrote: wtf kind of gg timing is that? 70 to 90 army supply u can still try
in tvP when your economy is murdered and the protoss sees you coming? He just warps in lots of units and moves over you as if you never existed. Plus: first could always warp in in at the back of Byuns base.
On May 17 2013 22:02 Gladiator6 wrote: Team Terran losing, how suprising! Why send out 3 Terrans in a row? ^^ GG WP first
but terran is op, right? or have we moved on?
Stop jocking Terran will always be considered OP cause there are always two other races that complain (and ofc its the other way around with their races). But what terran is missing is a good counter to these Protoss lategame deathballs with storms.
On May 17 2013 19:39 Ctesias wrote: Remembering the times when MarineKing actually won games is getting harder by the day.
It's truly depressing to be an MKP fan these days
it was like this before: MKP showed up with incredible micro at the beginning of gsl abou 2010 or 11 i think, at least that is when he got into my attention. Shortly after that he lost and lost and lost lots of games, due to stupid marine only instead of good composition games. He came back and was at first the runner-up-champion, later he won MLG, so there are 2 possible things: either he doesn't feel well/happy anymore (maybe with the team or sc2 in general) or he comes back like before
On May 18 2013 03:10 masterbreti wrote: I'm going to post what i posted in a different thread because I think it is a bit more relevant here.
I'm honesty surprised Prime hasn't disbanded yet. Prime always is looking for more players yet turn away some pretty damn good players when they have them (ST.Brain, Salmosa (who was kicked)). The Prime team doesn't have a proper coach either, Gerrard almost never spend his time with the players because he is too busy with managing the team. Thats why we saw annyeong and Classic leave the team, because they basically took on coach roles more than anything and they wanted out of it all.
Prime doesn't have good business sense, even things that would be great for the players. I really honestly feel bad for Creator, having to carry the weight of his entire team, at only 17. I've seen the amount of stress creator gets during practice. That's why so many people leave prime. Prime doesn't have a structured practice regime, which forces players to play way more than they should. That causes them to lose sleep and get stressed out. They need a proper practice schedule and a proper coach. But they won't get either. They need time to rest and have fun, but don't get to do much of that either, at least not anyone but mkp.
Anyways I'm venting, but seeing this makes me sad. If they had bothered to take care of the amazing players they once had, they would be such an awesome team.
Gerrard doesn't actually watch any of his player's replays. He doesn't actually spend any time with the players at all. I remember when I was living in the house, I would only see Gerrard during meal time. That was about it.
Then Gerrard goes on to remove players from his team (salmosa being a good example) for lack of skill, yet has never actually spent time with him to improve his skill. leaving him only to ladder and attempt to find practice partners on his own. same has gone for all prime players. they all have to find their own practice partners, and most of the time they just ladder instead. They don't even do in house rankings.
Why does only MKP get time to rest and have fun?
Because he is the only one who actually has any money to go out is one reason, the second being is that he is the only one that Gerrard won't scold for not practicing.
Wow, as if I needed another reason to be a MKP anti-fan... xD I guess that's not really his fault though, more Gerrard being biased. It's just kind of annoying thinking about one player getting significantly special treatment in one way or another.
I only posted one example of that sort of mindset. mkp was able to get away with a lot more than everyone else. stuff that wouldn't be appropriate to post on TL. But even others things like mkp being very loud in the middle of practice, doing really kinda stupid stuff and distracting others from proper practice.
I think mkp more just lacks maturity, whereas someone like Creator has it in spades. Seriously Creator is one of the more hardworking players, whether that has changed I am not sure, I have not spoken to creator in a few months. mkp just doesn't worry or care about anyone else around him, I don't think he ever had that part of his brain developed. He has been in and out of teamhouses since he was like 15-16, that he forgets sometimes that this isn't his personal playhouse.
Personally I was shocked as well they didn't to in house rankings and barely (if ever) practiced against each other. It was very disappointing after a few weeks i had arrived at the house, I was just left to my own devices really and had to work on my own. I wish I had went to a different house, I would have improved much faster than I did at the prime house. They don't have a practice schedule, so players either slack off (most of primes players skill declines can be attributed to this), or they work themselves too hard. If Gerrard would just hire a coach who could get everyone into a strict practice regime, it would work wonders for prime. Prime players would have less stress, and would have free time to have fun (I remember a story about this actually, Gerrard was out for the evening and Byun was playing LoL, Classic saw me watching byun play and told me that I had to keep it a secret because Gerrard would get mad if he saw anyone playing other games than starcraft).
Stuff like that really is why prime won't be successful. I remember When they won the GSTL last year, I was in the house at the time. They slacked off pretty much constantly after they won, after they overworked themselves to the bone beforehand. They don't have any balance in their lives, and Gerrard take every chance he gets to save a penny, not even hiring a maid or proper cook to come around to make sure they get fresh food.
Thank you for your insights. Usually I hate it when people who have no inside information make claims of "OMG Prime disbanding!", because that type of irrational fear-mongering really hurts teams. However, as someone who has lived in the Prime house, it's actually pretty amazing and interesting to hear about some of the management problems the team is having. And that does trouble me about Prime's future after hearing about your thoughts.
This is so sad, I want Prime to be bought by a proper team. Maybe FXO since they're a pretty small team too.
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