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I cant find Jjakji's bracket, who did he lose to?
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On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:43 Alryk wrote:On February 01 2013 03:47 Rewera wrote:
This is the beginning of Kespa teams players domination. 12/20 preliminary winners but 16/20 runner-ups. Code A soon will be dominated by Kespa and then they will start to drag Code S players. One by one. Take them into Kepsa meatgrinder in code A, then Kespa meatgrinder in Code B an bye bye. Non Kespa teams will crumble. Then there will be one team-league [10-12 teams] and one single competition format. [Kespa Gom merger]. ...what. The vast majority of GOM A-team players are already in code A/S. For Kespa A-teamers to not have taken at least half the spots would have been very bad. Note only (I believe) soulkey making it to Ro16 this season, with Innovation to play later. hardly any kespa players made it through Up and Downs (one?). Code A is certainly not going to be dominated by kespa players anytime soon. On February 01 2013 04:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 03:48 Shellshock1122 wrote:
Idk I think it would be kind of embarrassing for Kespa to not make up the majority of finalists at this point. Almost all the good ESF players are already in the GSL so the Kespa players are only going up against low Code A and Code B talent. This isn't "kespa domination" It's only the start of the kespa domination. It's only going to get worst from here for the ESF players even if it does take a little bit longer. But it will eventually happen. If the start of kespa domination included Flash, Jaedong, Bbyong, sOs, Trap, and Fantasy all falling out of the U&D's, and only RorO and Soulkey (Innovation tonight) in Code S... kespa domination is not that great. Edit: You also aren't taking into account proportions. This could go either way, but how many ESF players were registered in comparison to Kespa players? If Kespa had more players participating, you would expect them to qualify more players. I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had.
Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post...
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On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:43 Alryk wrote:On February 01 2013 03:47 Rewera wrote:
This is the beginning of Kespa teams players domination. 12/20 preliminary winners but 16/20 runner-ups. Code A soon will be dominated by Kespa and then they will start to drag Code S players. One by one. Take them into Kepsa meatgrinder in code A, then Kespa meatgrinder in Code B an bye bye. Non Kespa teams will crumble. Then there will be one team-league [10-12 teams] and one single competition format. [Kespa Gom merger]. ...what. The vast majority of GOM A-team players are already in code A/S. For Kespa A-teamers to not have taken at least half the spots would have been very bad. Note only (I believe) soulkey making it to Ro16 this season, with Innovation to play later. hardly any kespa players made it through Up and Downs (one?). Code A is certainly not going to be dominated by kespa players anytime soon. On February 01 2013 04:01 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
It's only the start of the kespa domination. It's only going to get worst from here for the ESF players even if it does take a little bit longer. But it will eventually happen. If the start of kespa domination included Flash, Jaedong, Bbyong, sOs, Trap, and Fantasy all falling out of the U&D's, and only RorO and Soulkey (Innovation tonight) in Code S... kespa domination is not that great. Edit: You also aren't taking into account proportions. This could go either way, but how many ESF players were registered in comparison to Kespa players? If Kespa had more players participating, you would expect them to qualify more players. I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post...
No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough.
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On February 01 2013 09:11 .Wraath wrote:
I cant find Jjakji's bracket, who did he lose to?
Lost to a noname terran ("Mercury")
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On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 04:43 Alryk wrote:
[quote]
...what.
The vast majority of GOM A-team players are already in code A/S. For Kespa A-teamers to not have taken at least half the spots would have been very bad. Note only (I believe) soulkey making it to Ro16 this season, with Innovation to play later. hardly any kespa players made it through Up and Downs (one?). Code A is certainly not going to be dominated by kespa players anytime soon.
[quote]
If the start of kespa domination included Flash, Jaedong, Bbyong, sOs, Trap, and Fantasy all falling out of the U&D's, and only RorO and Soulkey (Innovation tonight) in Code S... kespa domination is not that great.
Edit: You also aren't taking into account proportions. This could go either way, but how many ESF players were registered in comparison to Kespa players? If Kespa had more players participating, you would expect them to qualify more players. I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough.
Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience.
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On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years?
That's how much time the ESF players had before the Kespa transition.
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On February 01 2013 09:15 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:
[quote]
Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? That's how much time the ESF players had before the Kespa transition.
So by this logic, a new player can never catch up. We will be stuck watching the same players forever because it takes 2.5 years to learn the game. And SC2 is easier then BW yet it takes 2.5 years just to catch up to the current pros?
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On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years?
Because everyone else had 2.5 years headstart (somehow). Meaning that when Kespa players get 2.5 years of practice they will arbitrarily be as good as the people playing for 5 years.
Clearly the magic number.
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On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:On February 01 2013 04:58 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
I've touched on the u/d situation before. Keep in min that the ESF players only had that one group to focus on and one group of maps. Whereas the Kespa players had many different players to practice for (Pro League) on an almost entirely different map pool. Flash himself even said that he didn't give his all in the u/d's because he clearly couldn't practice for it with his tight schedule for Pro League. I'm sure the same can be said about the rest of the players. Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience.
Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them.
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On February 01 2013 09:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:
[quote]
Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience. Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them.
So you're saying that SC2 takes longer to learn than BW? But also BW is harder than SC2?
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On February 01 2013 09:18 bittman wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:
[quote]
Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? Because everyone else had 2.5 years headstart (somehow). Meaning that when Kespa players get 2.5 years of practice they will arbitrarily be as good as the people playing for 5 years. Clearly the magic number.
They've already caught up to the players who've played 2.5 years in well under a year. So, I don't see why you're trying to be sarcastic.
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On February 01 2013 09:15 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 05:09 mrtomjones wrote:
[quote]
Ahh yes... always excuses for people like you. I wonder when those will stop
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish. I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? That's how much time the ESF players had before the Kespa transition.
Most of the eSF players did start playing on the first day of beta... Plus do you only count Kespa 'transitition' when they switched full time?
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On February 01 2013 09:19 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish.
I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience. Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them. So you're saying that SC2 takes longer to learn than BW? But also BW is harder than SC2?
That's because BW was already figured out and everything was mechanically harder in terms of doing everything manually. SC2 hasn't been figured out yet.
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On February 01 2013 09:20 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:15 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish.
I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? That's how much time the ESF players had before the Kespa transition. Most of the eSF players did start playing on the first day of beta... Plus do you only count Kespa 'transitition' when they switched full time?
No, I'm including when they switched during the hybrid pro league. Not when they started playing full time.
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On February 01 2013 09:20 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 01 2013 09:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:
[quote]
I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you.
Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience. Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them. So you're saying that SC2 takes longer to learn than BW? But also BW is harder than SC2? That's because BW was already figured out and everything was mechanically harder in terms of doing everything manually. SC2 hasn't been figured out yet.
What about HotS? That'll be everyone starting fresh. It comes out March 12th.
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On February 01 2013 09:19 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:18 bittman wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 05:13 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
There's a difference between excuses and fact. I've clearly stated facts based off what the players themselves said. I really see your posts as reasons to argue with me. Not sure why you hate on Kespa players so much, especially when they're the ones that made StarCraft what it is from the start to finish.
I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you. Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? Because everyone else had 2.5 years headstart (somehow). Meaning that when Kespa players get 2.5 years of practice they will arbitrarily be as good as the people playing for 5 years. Clearly the magic number. They've already caught up to the players who've played 2.5 years in well under a year. So, I don't see why you're trying to be sarcastic.
Yes, I'm not denying that they haven't caught up. I don't know why you think this means that they'll then surpass ala the Elephant article which has been and will continue to be proven as an elitist mockery of genuinely good players that just don't happen to be in Kespa.
Any sarcasm here is because it's honestly hard to take you seriously, which is why there are like 5 people refuting to everything you say.
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On February 01 2013 09:24 Die4Ever wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:20 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 01 2013 09:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:
[quote]
Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one.
Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience. Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them. So you're saying that SC2 takes longer to learn than BW? But also BW is harder than SC2? That's because BW was already figured out and everything was mechanically harder in terms of doing everything manually. SC2 hasn't been figured out yet. What about HotS? That'll be everyone starting fresh. It comes out March 12th.
Yeah, I said 1 year after hots.
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On February 01 2013 09:25 BlazeFury01 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:24 Die4Ever wrote:On February 01 2013 09:20 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:19 Die4Ever wrote:On February 01 2013 09:18 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:
[quote]
Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? There are huge shifts in the meta game. You don't have to re-learn all that. It is like saying that a lot BW players have had 5+ years of pro RTS experience so we shouldn't compare until players like Creator, Life, Maru also have 5 years of pro experience. Yeah but 2 1/2 year old builds weren't viable in brood war like they are in SC2. That's why I said what I said because those old builds can still be used and you can win with them. So you're saying that SC2 takes longer to learn than BW? But also BW is harder than SC2? That's because BW was already figured out and everything was mechanically harder in terms of doing everything manually. SC2 hasn't been figured out yet. What about HotS? That'll be everyone starting fresh. It comes out March 12th. Yeah, I said 1 year after hots.
Why a whole year? Why not 1 month? ESF players were dominating foreigners right off the bat, it didn't take them a year. And most foreigners were playing the beta way before, while the ESF players mostly started with the actual release, and some of them even later than that like Life.
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On February 01 2013 09:25 bittman wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2013 09:19 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:18 bittman wrote:On February 01 2013 09:14 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:12 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:11 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:10 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:08 vthree wrote:On February 01 2013 09:05 BlazeFury01 wrote:On February 01 2013 09:04 vthree wrote:
[quote]
I don't think sc2 fans hate on Kespa players. I think they just hate the elitist Kespa fans like you.
Cool, I'm an "elitist". And I will continue to stay one. Weren't you one of those people that said Kespa would dominate Code S by season 5 2012 when Kespa were winning games in WCS? No, I never said they'd be dominating a particular season. I said futuristically when they have a better understanding of the game or had as much time the ESF players had. Well, technically, they will never have as much time as eSF players...it is a moving goal post... No, 2 1/2 years is how much time they had. If Kespa players had 2 1/2 years then that would be more then enough. Why 2.5 years? Because everyone else had 2.5 years headstart (somehow). Meaning that when Kespa players get 2.5 years of practice they will arbitrarily be as good as the people playing for 5 years. Clearly the magic number. They've already caught up to the players who've played 2.5 years in well under a year. So, I don't see why you're trying to be sarcastic. Yes, I'm not denying that they haven't caught up. I don't know why you think this means that they'll then surpass ala the Elephant article which has been and will continue to be proven as an elitist mockery of genuinely good players that just don't happen to be in Kespa. Any sarcasm here is because it's honestly hard to take you seriously, which is why there are like 5 people refuting to everything you say.
Those same 5 people also bare SC2 icons which tells me that you haven't played BW at a top level. The Elephant article also didn't anticipate Blizzard completely making this game easier for casuals which means you do less and less manually which is where Kespa players shined. I believe that they will surpass the ESF players because of the level they played on BW. Sure it's two different games but fundamentally they're the same. A lot of the ESF pros were BW players who failed to post results. A lot of ESF players are retiring too. You don't have to take me seriously  Your mind is already made up. Regardless of what I say, you'll believe what you want to believe so I don't really care about "winning you over" or anything like that. This is just one of those early, "I told you so" kind of things when it does happen.
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EPT
