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United Kingdom12042 Posts
On December 17 2012 23:02 Elem wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:49 JeffGoldblum wrote:On December 17 2012 21:39 Elem wrote:On December 17 2012 21:30 sc2superfan101 wrote:On December 17 2012 21:27 Elem wrote:
Not sure what's more retarded. This Zerg's play or this map... the Zerg played really badly, but the map is actually really cool. of course, JYJ played that as well as the zerg played it badly, so it looked ugly Really cool? Are you kidding me? You don't even need to look for 3 seconds to see that it is massive bullshit in TvZ. Worse than both Xel'Naga and Jungle Basin. Why are you mad though? No one is forcing any team to field a zerg on that map so I don't see any problem with having it in the map pool. Unless you want 'Daybreak 24/7 fast respawn 100Mbit'. When OSL comes it around I'd be surprised if it was one of their maps. Doesn't freaking excuse that it is a piss poor map. Daybreak is a good map but I'm not saying I want all maps to be that way. Variety is FINE but this way is not. "No one is forcing any team to field a zerg on that map" is the worst fucking excuse I've ever heard. It is so disgustingly ignorant. Muta play is relatively strong on it but Muta Ling Bling has never countered BioTank builds. It's a balanced matchup which generally is about skill and positioning. And if you look at the map the attacking Terran has a very favoured position. Meanwhile an attacking Zerg does not have such an advantage, as all their ground units vs T are melee and cannot make use of the terrain.
You mention muta ling bling, but who says you have to go for t hat style?
Mutas can be built alongside other units, not just ling bling and you can get 6-7 mutas to start with to just shut down drop play.
It's a really experimental, fun and good map to watch.
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lol you guys
Anyone who thinks Arkanoid in any way shape or form is a balanced map is out of their minds. Even people from BW know that Arkanoid was fucking retarded for Zergs and Protosses who yielded less than 50% winrates against Terran, with Zerg having 35.2% vs Terran and Protoss having a 39% winrate versus Terran and 32.2% versus Zerg. *balanced*
Only Savior could win on that map and that was because he was god and everyone else was just bad.
Arkanoid blooowws and all it takes is for an informed person to look at that map for 5 seconds to know that it's just shit.
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On December 17 2012 23:32 Zergneedsfood wrote:
lol you guys
Anyone who thinks Arkanoid in any way shape or form is a balanced map is out of their minds. Even people from BW know that Arkanoid was fucking retarded for Zergs and Protosses who yielded less than 50% winrates against Terran, with Zerg having 35.2% vs Terran and Protoss having a 39% winrate versus Terran and 32.2% versus Zerg. *balanced*
Only Savior could win on that map and that was because he was god and everyone else was just bad.
Arkanoid blooowws and all it takes is for an informed person to look at that map for 5 seconds to know that it's just shit.
Why is map balance so important for you guys?
If you really believe map balance is so critical, I would say current ladder map pool is pathetic balance wise. Standard doesn't mean balance.
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On December 18 2012 00:04 Dr.Hydralisk wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 23:32 Zergneedsfood wrote:
lol you guys
Anyone who thinks Arkanoid in any way shape or form is a balanced map is out of their minds. Even people from BW know that Arkanoid was fucking retarded for Zergs and Protosses who yielded less than 50% winrates against Terran, with Zerg having 35.2% vs Terran and Protoss having a 39% winrate versus Terran and 32.2% versus Zerg. *balanced*
Only Savior could win on that map and that was because he was god and everyone else was just bad.
Arkanoid blooowws and all it takes is for an informed person to look at that map for 5 seconds to know that it's just shit. Why is map balance so important for you guys? If you really believe map balance is so critical, I would say current ladder map pool is pathetic balance wise. Standard doesn't mean balance.
Because there's a reason why you don't see Bloodbath or Challenger from BW played in a competitive setting unless it's a joke or entertainment purposes? It's why some maps are heralded as battlefields for some of the greatest games in the competitive era.
People don't remember games just because of the players, though that's definitely one of the primary components. People also remember the map because a map's design is integral for an entertaining experience.
Also, I don't care about Sc2 maps really and I think they're all garbage. I just came in here when I heard people were giving Arkanoid credibility at all and decided to tell people that makes no sense.
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Yeah that map would be horrible in an individual league. But here where teams can chose who to send, having fun "new" maps like this is awesome and makes for interesting strats 
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On December 18 2012 00:09 Zergneedsfood wrote:
Also, I don't care about Sc2 maps really and I think they're all garbage.
Love this statement too much to argue about anything else.
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On December 18 2012 00:10 Salteador Neo wrote:Yeah that map would be horrible in an individual league. But here where teams can chose who to send, having fun "new" maps like this is awesome and makes for interesting strats
I'm intrigued. Please enlighten us on what kind of "interesting strats" you have in mind!
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Oh thank you... Guess i didn't open the good tab because i could have thought about it being in liquidpedia 
On December 17 2012 22:46 Zeon0 wrote:
gold level Terran theorycrafts about Zerg strategies on a map he never played on and saw like two TvZs? good stuff!
Really ? So Gold players can't have opinions ? He said he supposed a thing and people bashing him... Not really nice.
On December 18 2012 00:19 Zergneedsfood wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2012 00:10 Salteador Neo wrote:Yeah that map would be horrible in an individual league. But here where teams can chose who to send, having fun "new" maps like this is awesome and makes for interesting strats I'm intrigued. Please enlighten us on what kind of "interesting strats" you have in mind!
Well it's not SC2 but there were a lot of great games in BW on it. Savior did his part, UpMagic (dat Supply depot). Or if i remember correctly (i'm not really sure). There was a PvP with cool Dark Archon. Who was it ? I can't recall (no that was not Jaehoon)
But yes it is NOT a balanced map. None of the KESPA BW maps were (can't think of one). Also there was cool games on Blood Bath :p (MBC Game attack i think). I really think that stupid maps like that serves to entertain the public. And when some zerg will pull of his hat a crazy strat to do it will be so cool 
I remember that the imbalance on some maps made cool strats. For exemple the barracks behind the mineral line from Boxer against... euh... no don't remember. A protoss. Boxer was really good at studying map. When all maps are balanced you always see the same thing over and over again. (i'm exagerating of course)
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Map balance isn't very critical in Proleague. If a map is completely unbalanced, it'll be taken out in the next round, anyway.
Central Plains was a recent BW map that was only in a single round of Proleague because 27 out of 34 games were PvP. But while it was in, it was still a fun map to watch.
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So when Thorzain loses everyone says the map is imba for Terran because of Zerg run-bys
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On December 18 2012 00:25 FFW_Rude wrote:Oh thank you... Guess i didn't open the good tab because i could have thought about it being in liquidpedia Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:46 Zeon0 wrote:
gold level Terran theorycrafts about Zerg strategies on a map he never played on and saw like two TvZs? good stuff! Really ? So Gold players can't have opinions ? He said he supposed a thing and people bashing him... Not really nice. Show nested quote +On December 18 2012 00:19 Zergneedsfood wrote:On December 18 2012 00:10 Salteador Neo wrote:Yeah that map would be horrible in an individual league. But here where teams can chose who to send, having fun "new" maps like this is awesome and makes for interesting strats I'm intrigued. Please enlighten us on what kind of "interesting strats" you have in mind! Well it's not SC2 but there were a lot of great games in BW on it. Savior did his part, UpMagic (dat Supply depot). Or if i remember correctly (i'm not really sure). There was a PvP with cool Dark Archon. Who was it ? I can't recall (no that was not Jaehoon) But yes it is NOT a balanced map. None of the KESPA BW maps were (can't think of one). Also there was cool games on Blood Bath :p (MBC Game attack i think). I really think that stupid maps like that serves to entertain the public. And when some zerg will pull of his hat a crazy strat to do it will be so cool I remember that the imbalance on some maps made cool strats. For exemple the barracks behind the mineral line from Boxer against... euh... no don't remember. A protoss. Boxer was really good at studying map. When all maps are balanced you always see the same thing over and over again. (i'm exagerating of course)
Wtf? Okay, it doesn't have to be perfectly balanced, but at least most BW maps that stayed popular had the decency to have close to 50% win ratios for each matchup.
Not saying certain SC2 maps don't, but I think it's fair to say that crap maps are crap maps, and it's stupid to let a map like this fly by saying "ooh, but...interesting strats!" That's pretty stupid when considering the best strats are pulled off on maps that are fairly balanced.
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On December 17 2012 23:22 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 23:21 Big J wrote:
Quick question: what keeps Terran on this map from going 1rax 5 CC? Nydus, Mutas, killing the rocks and attacking? Sure there are rocks but It's not impossible to break them, the ones that lead right up the middle to the enemy base has less HP and armor than the ones on the side, I believe It's only 2000 or 1000 even.
Well, I mean I'm assuming a Terran uses 1-3scans around 6-7mins to see the starting spawn of a zerg. If it is not a Lair, no superfast drop or Nydus or Mutas are coming. For 1base mutas, all you need is the marines turret per mineral line. For two base mutas you can have mass marine or Thors + turrets ready.
Any kind of fast pool is obviously bullshit with the rocks. 1-2base roach based armies usually hit between 6-8mins. With the rocks I'd assume it's like 8-10mins. You can have tanks or mass bio at that point of the build I'm talking, and you are going to hold. (I know all this, because I do play 1rax 4-5CC on Cloud Kingdom around Masterlevel, were it's basically unscoutable if properly done)
I think it really comes down to very fast 2base Nydus (spread your buildings and maybe 3-4 units, starting with the first depot and rax and marine, then pull SCVs to stop the Nydus; should be manageable, but of course you can miss it) and 2base drops (which I guess are a real counter). And all of those tech builds are assuming a Zerg that basically did this completly blindly (else you cannot have the lair/drops/mutas in time).
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Just me or is there no English commentary on the VoD's on twitch?
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I believe that the live stream was commented by TLO and Adebesi, but they didn’tm anage to make it into the vods.
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Arkanoïd still has produced funnier games from a viewer's perspective than most of blizzard's maps. If it was so obviously imbalanced proteams wouldn't send a zerg on it.
I've never enjoyed watching proSC2 that much since the new proleague and most of it is due to the new maps. Besides, these are the first sc2 maps ever that Kespa makes so let's give them a chance.
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On December 18 2012 05:31 Iberville wrote:
I believe that the live stream was commented by TLO and Adebesi, but they didn’tm anage to make it into the vods.
That sucks, games are so boring without commentary
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If Arkanoid is so silly for zerg why don't the team just field a protoss on it? It is bad in individual leagues, maybe, but the games are just awesome on it (except this last one).
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Roro already won a tvz on Arkanoid vs a strong terran. Until I actually see imbalance in live games I don't see what all the complaining is about. It is the most exciting map since the introduction of daybreak.
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I haven't read this thread because I don't want to spoil the match, but the VODs for this have no casting at all. Don't know why!
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why is there a timer for a random pro league day? I thought that was only for big tournaments
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EPT
