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No balance whine |
On September 27 2012 20:22 MeLo wrote:
It was HerO's fault that he lost.
Max Broodlord-Infestor-Queen is the ultimate unit composition by far, even against Terran. You don't let the Zerg get that far, simple.
Hero needed to kill him before he maxed on that.
How exactly is he supposed to do that? Zerg just sits in his base with 16 broods 100 infestors and a wall of spines. Hero denied all his extra bases so he only had to fight this army once and maybe, since he cut of reinforcements, he can beat it on double the bases that leenock has.
No hate against leenock though, I dont think hes a really good player but hes smart and he does what he has to, gotta respect that
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lol. Idk why you guys even watch PvZs anymore... I know I don't. You might as well just check the results spoiler because you already know how the game ended. Was kinda hoping Leenock would lose so I could see TvZ before sleeping ;_;
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On September 27 2012 20:25 Chef0 wrote:
I play zerg, but fuck, no one should win when he is outplayed that hard ;/
Seconded!
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On September 27 2012 20:21 shadowy wrote:
So sad for Hero...he completely outplayed Leenock in the 3rd set... If it wasn't for the lucky vortex, Hero had it for sure.
Getting high ground vision against a toss with more resources and the watchtower, getting an infestor with energy in position, baiting your opponent's mothership into range, then executing the NP->Neural is more than luck. Please give Leenock some credit for his play there. The Broodlord+Overseer concave around the top left quarter was beautiful.
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On September 27 2012 20:24 Talho wrote:
I hope this is fixed in HoTS, not a balance whine, but end-game PvZ is always resolving around that 1 vortex.
You can get outplayed whole game and in the end it comes down to that vortex again, on both sides.
before they even thought about PvZ and new units in HoTS, this problem should have been a priority.
Yes this matchup would indeed suck if every late game PvZ comes down to 1-2 spells
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On September 27 2012 20:25 NexRex wrote:
I haven't played Random in like six months, so I don't know how PvZ matchup should play out, but I'd have to say that Hero gave up the game by not doing more multi attacks to try and destroy important buildings in Leenocks base. No whine from me.
More multi attacks? Did you even watch the game?
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On September 27 2012 20:17 Scarlett` wrote:
zerg player way ahead, gets half his broodlords vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "spread your broods"
protoss player way ahead, lets his mothership get neuraled, gets three quarters his army vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "zerg op :3"
I think the more annoying thing is that Hero was so far ahead and kept killing so much but he just couldn't finish of Leenock. In any other match up with that much of an advantage the game would have been over in Hero's favour much earlier.
*not saying Zerg op because balance whining isn't my thing, but it is frustrating to see it happen to my favourite player.
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On September 27 2012 20:24 DrPandaPhD wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2012 20:23 An2quamaraN wrote:On September 27 2012 20:20 NightOfTheDead wrote:
Stop whining, Leenock picked the map for his strategy, so toss cant move freely around broods. He got composition he wanted. He planned this strat. He did it. Whining is annoying as shit. You are implying that he chosen to never get a fourth, lose his expansions ~ 5 times, play against a 6 base protoss and get outplayed overall? That was also part of his plan? Using the expanions as a decoy to get his army up on the 3 bases. Note that HerO never had a chance to attack his 3 main bases cause he was so distracted by what Leenock was constantly doing at other places on the map.
If you really think that Leenock was banking on Neuralling a mothership to win then I don't think you're giving him much credit. He got a break after playing badly for the first 3/4 of the game. that's what happened.
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hope hero doesnt tilt now and lose to freaking heart
and go squirtle!!
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On September 27 2012 20:25 Havik_ wrote:
Hero could have just walked in and killed Leenock long before BLs we're out, so that's on him. He had ample opportunity to just smash him, but he sat back and teched. Bad call.
yeah. all that foreplay and not finishing him off. hero just got blue balled.
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On September 27 2012 20:20 Dosey wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2012 20:17 Scarlett` wrote:
zerg player way ahead, gets half his broodlords vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "spread your broods"
protoss player way ahead, lets his mothership get neuraled, gets three quarters his army vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "zerg op :3" It wasn't an insta lose either though. HerO had ample opportunity to win that even after the vortex but instead just sat in a corner while not rebuilding any tech structures. It's like he mentally collapsed the moment the vortex hit.
No, he was fucked. He lost an army worth ~6k/6k while the zerg player retained almost his entire army (again, ~6k/6k). You don't mine gas fast enough to get a comparable army before he kills your mining bases.
Consider that you're mining ~800gas/minute (4 base). To get a decent army you need ~3-4k gas; that's 4-5 minutes. Then consider all the tech you need to rebuild - that's another ~400 gas (200 if you just rebuild archives/core). And that's without even considering minerals/probes/gateway rebuilding.
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Goo Leenock, beat ST_turtler!!!(aka. Warp prism Immortal push).
Only way it way outmacro him by faking attacks. Then just A-move Br0lords 
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On September 27 2012 20:24 Primal666 wrote:
i love how protoss are whining that zerg won WITH THEIR OWN FREAKING SPELL HOLY FUCK, btw vortex only imba ifg zerg has it....
You are stupid, nobody is whining about imbalance but about a stupid mechanic that destroys the matchup.
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I've seen Stephano be denied bases and tech to broodlord infestor off 2 and 3 bases before and win, several times. I never see this much whine when he does.
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I feel like people are overrating hero's play that game he basically played a standard Antiga Shipyard vs Zerg but let the zerg max on a deathball with only three bases and then let 5 colossus get neuralled for no reason..>_>
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On September 27 2012 20:22 wangstra wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2012 20:18 Dali. wrote:On September 27 2012 20:17 Scarlett` wrote:
zerg player way ahead, gets half his broodlords vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "spread your broods"
protoss player way ahead, lets his mothership get neuraled, gets three quarters his army vortexed and insta loses
protoss players "zerg op :3" Scarlett dropping madddddd truth. I see it but a six base Zerg with infestors won't loose to one vortex. At least if they are not asleep on their macro.
Except that's not true. A massive economic advantage can be negated by an army with momentum. Both Zerg and Protoss lategame armies possess this ability. There's many examples where a complacent zerg can lose most of their army inefficiently due to vortex and straight up die because they don't have the time to pool all their resources into a meaningful counter deathball. Momentum is king.
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On September 27 2012 20:26 nanoscorp wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2012 20:21 shadowy wrote:
So sad for Hero...he completely outplayed Leenock in the 3rd set... If it wasn't for the lucky vortex, Hero had it for sure.
The Broodlord+Overseer concave around the top left quarter was beautiful.
This is considered beautiful? Compared to the multipronged warp prism harass and constant movement/splitting/blinking of Hero's Army?
Joke
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Haha, this happens in other matchups (in every match up). Just because a player plays well during the majority of the game does not mean he "deserves" to win. As we say in chess, the game is lost by he who makes the last mistake (not he who makes the most mistakes). Deal with it.
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United States97276 Posts
Shit I gtg to class I completely forgot it's Thursday. I thought it was Wednesday for some reason. Can someone else LR the rest of the series? Thanks!
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On September 27 2012 20:25 Arco wrote:
Antiga Shipyard needs to be scrapped from the map pool, not enough room to maneuver around that Zerg deathball and kill it. Not to mention, Mothership vs Neural Parasite is stupid.
Everything is said here.
Antiga Shipyard is a map which is simply not balanced. PvT is a nightmare and PvZ as well if a Protoss gets to the lategame.
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EPT
