• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:16
CEST 15:16
KST 22:16
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8
Community News
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)43Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple3BSL Season 2313Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double Recent Patches and the Future
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) 2026 GSTL Grand Finals SC2 INu's Battles#21 [ 3-Days tournament ] ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses
Brood War
General
Fantasy returning? BW General Discussion ASL22 General Discussion Bot on ladder a Announcement on the JEDI Ringing
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 4 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 3 [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread All you football fans (soccer)! Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9019 users

[WCS KR] WR1 D3 - Page 94

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 92 93 94 95 96 97 Next
GoSuChicken
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Germany1726 Posts
August 08 2012 21:01 GMT
#1861
wow what kind of guy is Reality?
fasdaf
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
138 Posts
August 08 2012 21:03 GMT
#1862
On August 09 2012 03:09 Sandermatt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 02:53 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:43 fraktoasters wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."


I'm not sure what you're quoting.

"I am saying that there are 300 current pros and semi-pros that have the potential to come in and dominate SC2 at any moment"


I worded that poorly, as it was not a quote. I was just highlighting that the article doesn't say anything about the future, just (what was) the present.


Even at the time this article was written it wasn't true.
The article argues, that because the SC2 players had bad performances in BW (which they played until 2010), the players with better performances in BW would also be much better in SC2.
Reality is a player with little/nothing to show until the release of SC2 (4 games all lost). Now he does really well in SC2.
He is basically what any of the GSL players could have been if he stayed with Kespa and only now switched over.

Some players have been bad at BW and good at SC2, some bad at both, some good at both and some were good at BW and are bad at SC2. GSL players will not continue to dominate the Kespa players forever, but the Kespa players will not dominate the GSL players either.


What? I have no idea why you think (T)Reality had little/nothing to show until the release of SC2. Take a look at his TLPD page. He's qualified for individual leagues before, and was an A-teamer and regular in SPL, which is a very different situation from that of most GSL players.
Elroi
Profile Joined August 2009
Sweden5617 Posts
August 08 2012 21:05 GMT
#1863
On August 09 2012 03:43 ShiroKaisen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 03:26 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


Of course it was a huge middle finger to the entire SC2 scene. It was also unnecessarily inflammatory and condescending, and pretty surprising to be published as a feature article. It's also been disproved by every BW player that changed over after the article was written, and continues to be disproved now in WCS, WCG, and every other tournament Kespa players go against GSL players.


The problem with claiming it was "disproved" is that every KeSPA player who's switched so far hasn't remained on a KeSPA team. The KeSPA pro-house environment and practice and coaching is so far above even what the eSF teams do. fOrGG practicing alone or in the oGs house is a Code S player. fOrGG practicing in the KT Rolster house is an MSL champion.

In the Hwaseung OZ house yo.

The problem for the current sc2 guys is that a bunch of people (like 15-20 guys) who were way better than MVP and zergbong at every aspect of a very similar game (multi tasking, making build orders, micro, macro, game sens...) are going to swich over. After hots, I don't see any GSL players among top 10 anymore, maybe among top 20.
"To all eSports fans, I want to be remembered as a progamer who can make something out of nothing, and someone who always does his best. I think that is the right way of living, and I'm always doing my best to follow that." - Jaedong. /watch?v=jfghAzJqAp0
Nickemwit
Profile Joined December 2007
United States253 Posts
August 08 2012 21:22 GMT
#1864
On August 09 2012 06:01 sOda~ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


it died cos the game was old as fuck, if sc2 wasnt around youd just as likely be watching LoL

You are so fucking wrong and it's people like you that make new school gaming scenes fucking awful. You have no idea what it's like to love a game for its quality.
Fight Fire with ShrieK
ShiroKaisen
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States1082 Posts
August 08 2012 21:25 GMT
#1865
On August 09 2012 06:05 Elroi wrote:

In the Hwaseung OZ house yo.


Can't think of the Hwaseung OZ house without this immediately coming to mind.
Dame da na, zenzen dame da ze!
Dranak
Profile Joined July 2011
United States464 Posts
August 08 2012 21:34 GMT
#1866
On August 09 2012 06:22 ShrieK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:01 sOda~ wrote:
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


it died cos the game was old as fuck, if sc2 wasnt around youd just as likely be watching LoL

You are so fucking wrong and it's people like you that make new school gaming scenes fucking awful. You have no idea what it's like to love a game for its quality.


To be fair, BW was declining long before SC2 came out. It certainly did accelerate the process though.
Nickemwit
Profile Joined December 2007
United States253 Posts
August 08 2012 21:36 GMT
#1867
^not disputing that, I was just sickened by his choice of words -.-
Fight Fire with ShrieK
Darneck
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden1394 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 21:39:52
August 08 2012 21:39 GMT
#1868
On August 09 2012 06:36 ShrieK wrote:
^not disputing that, I was just sickened by his choice of words -.-

Old as fuck didn't necessarily have to be used but there's no escaping or denying that in this day and age graphics and so on is quite a big deal to sponsors etc. I love BW as well and wish it would still have been around, what I would have loved even more though was an exact copy of BW but with sc2 graphics. Even though I love the charm that BW has in its own looks.
Sandermatt
Profile Joined December 2010
Switzerland1365 Posts
August 08 2012 21:41 GMT
#1869
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


Sorry for your loss.
It is not only about the article, the article is more a symbol for the attitude that some BW fans have shown towards SC2, but I know SC2 fans behaved bad in the BW forums too. I wish there was less animosity between the scenes.
Sandermatt
Profile Joined December 2010
Switzerland1365 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 21:45:17
August 08 2012 21:42 GMT
#1870
On August 09 2012 06:39 Darneck wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:36 ShrieK wrote:
^not disputing that, I was just sickened by his choice of words -.-

Old as fuck didn't necessarily have to be used but there's no escaping or denying that in this day and age graphics and so on is quite a big deal to sponsors etc. I love BW as well and wish it would still have been around, what I would have loved even more though was an exact copy of BW but with sc2 graphics. Even though I love the charm that BW has in its own looks.


Doesn't SC2BW exist? I think making more modern graphics for this mod shouldn't be that hard for a modder.

On August 09 2012 06:34 Dranak wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:22 ShrieK wrote:
On August 09 2012 06:01 sOda~ wrote:
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


it died cos the game was old as fuck, if sc2 wasnt around youd just as likely be watching LoL

You are so fucking wrong and it's people like you that make new school gaming scenes fucking awful. You have no idea what it's like to love a game for its quality.


To be fair, BW was declining long before SC2 came out. It certainly did accelerate the process though.


LoL is way more popular in korea than SC2. This game could have grabbed just as much territory from BW if not more.
Darneck
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden1394 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 21:48:06
August 08 2012 21:47 GMT
#1871
On August 09 2012 06:42 Sandermatt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:39 Darneck wrote:
Old as fuck didn't necessarily have to be used but there's no escaping or denying that in this day and age graphics and so on is quite a big deal to sponsors etc. I love BW as well and wish it would still have been around, what I would have loved even more though was an exact copy of BW but with sc2 graphics. Even though I love the charm that BW has in its own looks.


Doesn't SC2BW exist? I think making more modern graphics for this mod shouldn't be that hard for a modder.

It does exist but it's not 100% yet and since it's official it would probably sadly never go "mainstream".
Sandermatt
Profile Joined December 2010
Switzerland1365 Posts
August 08 2012 21:47 GMT
#1872
On August 09 2012 06:03 fasdaf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 03:09 Sandermatt wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:53 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:43 fraktoasters wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."


I'm not sure what you're quoting.

"I am saying that there are 300 current pros and semi-pros that have the potential to come in and dominate SC2 at any moment"


I worded that poorly, as it was not a quote. I was just highlighting that the article doesn't say anything about the future, just (what was) the present.


Even at the time this article was written it wasn't true.
The article argues, that because the SC2 players had bad performances in BW (which they played until 2010), the players with better performances in BW would also be much better in SC2.
Reality is a player with little/nothing to show until the release of SC2 (4 games all lost). Now he does really well in SC2.
He is basically what any of the GSL players could have been if he stayed with Kespa and only now switched over.

Some players have been bad at BW and good at SC2, some bad at both, some good at both and some were good at BW and are bad at SC2. GSL players will not continue to dominate the Kespa players forever, but the Kespa players will not dominate the GSL players either.


What? I have no idea why you think (T)Reality had little/nothing to show until the release of SC2. Take a look at his TLPD page. He's qualified for individual leagues before, and was an A-teamer and regular in SPL, which is a very different situation from that of most GSL players.


This is the source I used.
I only found 4 games up to the date of the SC2 release.
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/details.php?section=korean&type=players&id=712&part=games&vs=all&league=standard&map=any&from_year=2009&from_month=4&from_day=2&to_year=2010&to_month=7&to_day=27&action=Update
Dranak
Profile Joined July 2011
United States464 Posts
August 08 2012 21:50 GMT
#1873
On August 09 2012 06:36 ShrieK wrote:
^not disputing that, I was just sickened by his choice of words -.-


Well that I agree with. He was kind of a dick about it.
Porcelina
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United Kingdom3249 Posts
August 08 2012 21:56 GMT
#1874
Well is this not grand boys and girls. The constant balance whine in live report threads is great and all that, but jazzing it up a little bit with bickering about BW pros v SC2 pros just adds a certain je ne sais quoi to the reader's experience.

Well done, this is going to be so much fun in the future too!
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
August 08 2012 21:56 GMT
#1875
On August 09 2012 06:34 Dranak wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:22 ShrieK wrote:
On August 09 2012 06:01 sOda~ wrote:
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


it died cos the game was old as fuck, if sc2 wasnt around youd just as likely be watching LoL

You are so fucking wrong and it's people like you that make new school gaming scenes fucking awful. You have no idea what it's like to love a game for its quality.


To be fair, BW was declining long before SC2 came out. It certainly did accelerate the process though.


I can't believe people actually buy into that narrative. A betting scandal and a few teams having trouble finding sponsors is not the end of the world. I watched BW all through this supposed "decline." Team Liquid hosted their first ever tournaments during this decline. Record breaking crowds came out to watch in China, the stands were always packed at the OSL, armies of vuvuzelas sounded off at the PL finals. The fans were there. They didn't go anywhere.

Neither did Kespa. Not until Blizzard took away their legal right to even broadcast the games. BW was shut down at gunpoint. That's when they started pushing this fucked up narrative of "BW in decline."

If BW was in such decline why were there more and more international tournaments popping up? Why was BW still in WCG right up until the day SC2 came out? Every time we heard some crap about BW is an old game, BW is fading, you'd see an OSL finals where people poured out in the thousands to watch.

Were you even around during 09-10? It was some of the most exciting times in BW. The game was still evolving. ZvZ hive play, mass queen play, Flash's anti-carrier build, PvZ was even starting to use some 1-base openings again, just bullshit. Such bullshit to say BW was dying.
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 22:01:17
August 08 2012 21:57 GMT
#1876
On August 09 2012 06:47 Sandermatt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:03 fasdaf wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:09 Sandermatt wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:53 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:43 fraktoasters wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."


I'm not sure what you're quoting.

"I am saying that there are 300 current pros and semi-pros that have the potential to come in and dominate SC2 at any moment"


I worded that poorly, as it was not a quote. I was just highlighting that the article doesn't say anything about the future, just (what was) the present.


Even at the time this article was written it wasn't true.
The article argues, that because the SC2 players had bad performances in BW (which they played until 2010), the players with better performances in BW would also be much better in SC2.
Reality is a player with little/nothing to show until the release of SC2 (4 games all lost). Now he does really well in SC2.
He is basically what any of the GSL players could have been if he stayed with Kespa and only now switched over.

Some players have been bad at BW and good at SC2, some bad at both, some good at both and some were good at BW and are bad at SC2. GSL players will not continue to dominate the Kespa players forever, but the Kespa players will not dominate the GSL players either.


What? I have no idea why you think (T)Reality had little/nothing to show until the release of SC2. Take a look at his TLPD page. He's qualified for individual leagues before, and was an A-teamer and regular in SPL, which is a very different situation from that of most GSL players.


This is the source I used.
I only found 4 games up to the date of the SC2 release.
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/details.php?section=korean&type=players&id=712&part=games&vs=all&league=standard&map=any&from_year=2009&from_month=4&from_day=2&to_year=2010&to_month=7&to_day=27&action=Update

...............................................................

you forgot to include his other 2 years of progaming

and being sent out for PL and qualifying for OSL within the first year of your progaming career is pretty goddamn impressive, which is why Reality was an extremely strong candidate for Rookie of the Year award .. something that most of the current GSL players didn't even come close to achieving mind you
Writerptrk
Sandermatt
Profile Joined December 2010
Switzerland1365 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 22:03:21
August 08 2012 22:01 GMT
#1877
On August 09 2012 06:57 ArvickHero wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:47 Sandermatt wrote:
On August 09 2012 06:03 fasdaf wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:09 Sandermatt wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:53 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:43 fraktoasters wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."


I'm not sure what you're quoting.

"I am saying that there are 300 current pros and semi-pros that have the potential to come in and dominate SC2 at any moment"


I worded that poorly, as it was not a quote. I was just highlighting that the article doesn't say anything about the future, just (what was) the present.


Even at the time this article was written it wasn't true.
The article argues, that because the SC2 players had bad performances in BW (which they played until 2010), the players with better performances in BW would also be much better in SC2.
Reality is a player with little/nothing to show until the release of SC2 (4 games all lost). Now he does really well in SC2.
He is basically what any of the GSL players could have been if he stayed with Kespa and only now switched over.

Some players have been bad at BW and good at SC2, some bad at both, some good at both and some were good at BW and are bad at SC2. GSL players will not continue to dominate the Kespa players forever, but the Kespa players will not dominate the GSL players either.


What? I have no idea why you think (T)Reality had little/nothing to show until the release of SC2. Take a look at his TLPD page. He's qualified for individual leagues before, and was an A-teamer and regular in SPL, which is a very different situation from that of most GSL players.


This is the source I used.
I only found 4 games up to the date of the SC2 release.
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/details.php?section=korean&type=players&id=712&part=games&vs=all&league=standard&map=any&from_year=2009&from_month=4&from_day=2&to_year=2010&to_month=7&to_day=27&action=Update

...............................................................

you forgot to include his other 2 years of progaming


Even if I make the search start at the year 2000 no other games show up. And I said until the release of SC2, which was in July 2010. With release I mean the game release, not the Kespa switch.
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
August 08 2012 22:02 GMT
#1878
On August 09 2012 06:41 Sandermatt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


Sorry for your loss.
It is not only about the article, the article is more a symbol for the attitude that some BW fans have shown towards SC2, but I know SC2 fans behaved bad in the BW forums too. I wish there was less animosity between the scenes.


Thanks for your condolences. I don't have animosity towards SC2 scene. I was just watching NASL today and these games last night. Love DRG and Stephano, and the gameplay in SC2 has really, really improved over this past year. Before this year, the games were horrendous on all levels and a bore to watch, but now the finesse is starting to shine through and it's turning into a very entertaining game to watch. PvP is exciting as hell to me now that the 4gate trend has faded away and there's a lot more of this immortal prism style coming into play. I think HOTS will improve that matchup even more with that giant AA unit that can splat Colossi from 23 range. Will put an end to the mass laser beams I hope. But I honestly have no complaints about the SC2 scene in terms of players.

What I have a problem with is disrespectful idiots who know nothing about BW and want to insult Kespa players when they haven't even had time to adjust, especially TBLS. To insult the gods of BW scarcely a week after we watched our last major tourney come to an end is like stabbing an open wound.
nextstep
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada705 Posts
August 08 2012 22:19 GMT
#1879
woot! go Reality!!
go KHAN! TBLS <3
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-08 22:32:56
August 08 2012 22:26 GMT
#1880
On August 09 2012 06:22 ShrieK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2012 06:01 sOda~ wrote:
On August 09 2012 05:51 StorkHwaiting wrote:
On August 09 2012 03:04 nokz88 wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:35 Dranak wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:28 Whatson wrote:
On August 09 2012 02:25 ]343[ wrote:
Huh, I think people are failing to recall how much lower the skill level was when the article was written...

Did the writer of the article really not put into consideration the potential for the SC2 players to get better...it's not like they wouldn't improve.


I think the intent was to comment on what was the current state of SC2 play at that time. The article doesn't really talk about the future beyond "If Kespa players all change over NOW..."

The intent was to question the skill (then or potential) of then-best SC2 players, and thus the validity of a scene dominated by them. By showing their awful records in BW, it downplays the players themselves, not their current skill or whatever, not accounting for that they are now in a whole 'nother ballpark.

It's a huge middle finger for SC2. It's the rallying point for BW elitists. It's a shame that more than a year after that piece of crap was written, people still are waiting for the things it predicted, like Christians waiting for the judgement day, to shove their disdain in SC2 fans' faces.


You're upset because one insulting article was written.

The BW community is upset because SC2 killed our game and denied us the chance of ever seeing it on a pro-stage again.


it died cos the game was old as fuck, if sc2 wasnt around youd just as likely be watching LoL

You are so fucking wrong and it's people like you that make new school gaming scenes fucking awful. You have no idea what it's like to love a game for its quality.


Provided that you loved BW strictly for its quality as a RTS game, you'd be following it still. I hear the Chinese are still playing it on stage, so why aren't you watching them?
Prev 1 92 93 94 95 96 97 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Stellar Fest
13:00
Stellar Fest 2 The Moon: Qualifier Day 2
Serral vs herO
Solar vs Shino
Maru vs Clem
SHIN vs GgMaChine
IntoTheiNu 654
SteadfastSC210
TaKeTV 188
ComeBackTV 153
LamboSC2118
Rex63
EnkiAlexander 13
LiquipediaDiscussion
OSC
13:00
King of the Hill #263
EmpressLilyy11
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SteadfastSC 210
ProTech141
LamboSC2 118
Rex 63
BRAT_OK 9
IndyStarCraft 0
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 36602
Shuttle 3126
Horang2 935
Bisu 931
Jaedong 726
Mini 609
EffOrt 556
Light 460
BeSt 348
Soma 344
[ Show more ]
firebathero 340
Hyuk 320
Stork 307
Snow 169
Zeus 161
Rush 155
Last 150
ggaemo 147
ZerO 142
Pusan 91
Leta 83
hero 69
Killer 56
sorry 56
Sea.KH 49
Mong 45
Sharp 44
Mind 42
Bale 28
Shinee 27
Aegong 27
Shine 25
ToSsGirL 24
Trap 23
soO 23
Sexy 22
Terrorterran 20
NotJumperer 19
Free 14
PianO 13
HiyA 10
JulyZerg 9
ajuk12(nOOB) 7
Sacsri 7
Icarus 7
Noble 7
zelot 7
Dota 2
Gorgc5799
qojqva1681
Dendi862
420jenkins90
Fuzer 70
League of Legends
Reynor108
Counter-Strike
x6flipin424
markeloff162
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor2222
crisheroes975
XaKoH 150
Other Games
gofns39455
singsing2161
olofmeister1477
B2W.Neo954
Mlord252
DeMusliM185
Livibee178
Liquid`VortiX122
Hui .117
Mew2King101
ArmadaUGS92
QueenE88
Chillindude13
Railgan12
ZerO(Twitch)12
fpsfer 0
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream130
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 64
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
• intothetv
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix5
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1809
League of Legends
• Jankos2232
• Nemesis979
• TFBlade697
Other Games
• WagamamaTV189
Upcoming Events
OSC
10h 44m
Stellar Fest
23h 44m
OSC
1d 8h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 20h
Online Event
1d 21h
FEL
2 days
AI Arena Tournament
2 days
BSL: Ladder Tournament
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
INu's Battles
2 days
herO vs Classic
Percival vs Rogue
[ Show More ]
BSL Open Qualifier
3 days
BSL Open Qualifier
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Rush vs Light
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Soma vs Soulkey
INu's Battles
4 days
SHIN vs Cure
ByuN vs Zoun
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
INu's Battles
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-30
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Calamity Invitational

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.