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On May 27 2012 17:02 ProxyKnoxy wrote:
After he took out the third he should have teched to infestors right away. He had a really good game plan though - you could see it all coming together. I think he wanted a base race, which is why he sent all those roaches to the fourth and burrowed them, while building loads of spine crawlers and keeping his infestors at home. It didn't really work out though. He could have sent a much smaller group of roaches to kill the third and kept the rest at home and he might have had a chance.
Yeah, he had a plan, but not the timings to execute it. I think Jaedong needs to step back and get his basic timings down instead of trying for these huge plays that fall flat because of timing, macro, and composition errors.
He said that he plays the games out in his head, and that's why he loves Stephano because Stephano does the same huge plays that he plays out in his head. But the difference between his plays and Stephano's is that Stephano has the basics down and knows when he is able to make those plays and when he isn't. Jaedong doesn't.
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On May 27 2012 17:11 Veldril wrote:
WTH with mirror match up all night - -
Hey, at least it's not Protoss, right? PvProleague was getting quite tiresome.
I'm really looking forward to this match :D
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On May 27 2012 17:11 sc14s wrote:
woo, lets see how flash is coming along after another week.
also my money is on flash this game.. TvT should be his strong point in sc2 atm IMO with his strength in tactics / strategy.
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On May 27 2012 17:11 roymarthyup wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 17:07 TheBanana wrote:On May 27 2012 17:02 roymarthyup wrote:
Jaedong played extremely well early game and should have had essentially a game-winning advantage for any other zerg but i guess no one gave jaedong the memo
In sc2 three bases is really all you need. Each base can be massively saturated with 20 drones on minerals, 6 on gas. thats 78 drones for 3 bases, most opt to go for about 72-75. Once you actually have 3 bases power out to max saturation ASAP then after that use that insane income to power out a massive army to do battle with
crazy-hydra did this. jaedong didnt he just wasnt given the memo i guess that your supposed to power drones asap whenever you can. jaedong was way slower on making drones. so crazy-hydra overran him midgame
still impressed with jaedong good mechanics just wasnt given the memo i guess... His problem wasn't drones, it was making things in general. His macro slipped hard. i wouldnt say his macro "slipped" as in he knew what he should do and he didnt instead i think he just didnt know exactly how strong it is to get 3base saturation ASAP then power out the army. crazy-hydra got saturation faster, faster gasses, then went straight into army after obtaining saturation while jaedong was banking resources thinking that was viable so crazy-hydra ended up winning because all his money was put into units while jaedong had a bank and spines building i wouldnt say jaedongs "macro slipped" as that sort of implies he knew what "proper macro" was i mean hes got great mechanics but i guess he just didnt exactly know what the most powerful move to make in his position was so he was confused and lost Exactly this, jaedong clearly didn't know what he needed do what and at what times.
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United States23455 Posts
On May 27 2012 17:11 Ribbon wrote:
So, TBLS is 0-5 in SC2, now?
By.Sun > Jaedong
Effort > Flash
Zero > Stork
hero > Bisu
Crazy-Hydra > Jaedong
So yes.
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Another bad counter attack from Jaedong, and horrible macro decisions. He stayed around 160 food forever and basically let Crazy-Hydra come back, tech to everything, and a-move. I really don't understand this - decision making, and especially macro, are some of his strengths.
SC2 takes away the multitasking requirement that dominates BW macro, allowing players to focus more on micro and decision making/battles. Yet thus far it seems like many BW players are struggling with...everything. I had thought they'd be building huge armies and microing the shit out of them, now that they didn't have to worry about constantly rallying units to a battle. Jaedong should have won that game but completely threw it away
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Flash TvT, this should be good.
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On May 27 2012 17:12 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 17:02 ProxyKnoxy wrote:
After he took out the third he should have teched to infestors right away. He had a really good game plan though - you could see it all coming together. I think he wanted a base race, which is why he sent all those roaches to the fourth and burrowed them, while building loads of spine crawlers and keeping his infestors at home. It didn't really work out though. He could have sent a much smaller group of roaches to kill the third and kept the rest at home and he might have had a chance. Yeah, he had a plan, but not the timings to execute it. I think Jaedong needs to step back and get his basic timings down instead of trying for these huge plays that fall flat because of timing, macro, and composition errors. He said that he plays the games out in his head, and that's why he loves Stephano because Stephano does the same huge plays that he plays out in his head. But the difference between his plays and Stephano's is that Stephano has the basics down and knows when he is able to make those plays and when he isn't. Jaedong doesn't.
Stephano also has 2 years of experience playing this game, Jaedong doesn't.
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On May 27 2012 17:09 smallerk wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 17:05 rysecake wrote:On May 27 2012 17:04 smallerk wrote:
To be honest JD just lacks execution, he isn't nearly as bad as he looks. He doesn't lack execution. Mechanically he's godly. Just lacks the knowledge... He has good mechanics, thats why he had 2k minerals and a ton of larva; the thing is he didnt spend them nearly as quickly as he should have, he lacks execution, nothing else. Same shit with his ZvP last week, had he executed the counter attack better he would've won.
Look at his gas. He had almost 2k and like no gas at all because he was teching to +2attack and +1 armor and also infestor
tech. But i agreed he should have plant a lot of spines if he planned to counter attack.
His early-mid game was fantastic though. His execution will get better when he get more game experience.
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51507 Posts
of course flash goes cc first.
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both players going CC first!
wait nvm LOL
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On May 27 2012 17:11 Ribbon wrote:
So, TBLS is 0-5 in SC2, now?
It's something that was to be expected in my opinion, the best players are the one who started practicing SC2 the later, because their team relied on them for proleague games. It's also the reason that this format is bad, it's a bit unfortunate to see the legendaries players of broodwar loose to lower level opponents because they have been playing sc2 much less, it's also probably confusing for proleague viewers.
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United Kingdom38257 Posts
On May 27 2012 17:12 Rainfall7711 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 17:08 Asha` wrote:On May 27 2012 17:03 Rainfall7711 wrote:
Some of these comments just show some you guys lack knowledge about SC2 in general. First, his macro wasn't bad at all, and he was way ahead, and before you call bullshit it's kind of known around 60 drones is all that is needed for ZvZ. Came from Nestea's mouth and you don't see much more than that because it's not needed.
As far as i can see he made one bad decision and that was to go for a basetrade rather than go home and press his big advantage he had.
Stop making this seems bigger than it is, he made one wrong move because he's new to the game, nothing more. He was floating 1.5k to 2k minerals while at around 150 supply, and with enough gas to build units too. He was way ahead, his macro slipped badly, and he made a bad decision to counterattack (which wouldn't have been so bad had he been macroing properly and had an extra 30-40 supply of roaches on the map ><) Yes he floated those minerals but seconds after he produced 21 Roaches and both resources were down below 100. Seriously. He was simply floating until his Roach Warren was complete.
What are you talking about, he had roaches out on the map while he was floating lol.
Resources only came down towards normal levels when he lost his third/fourth/fifth hatches and his mining income died off but he still had larva for last ditch rounds of production.
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On May 27 2012 17:15 pdd wrote:
Was that a Flash 14CC?
of course.
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EPT
