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Players such as Jinro, HuK, and Adelscott did not apply for this tour, so don't ask why they aren't on this list. DIMAGA, Kas, and LaLush turned applications in late so they will not appear either. Please take some time to learn who exactly applied. Please inform yourself about who applied and who didn't. |
On March 30 2011 13:20 applejuice wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 11:55 jmbthirteen wrote:On March 30 2011 11:41 TurpinOS wrote:On March 30 2011 11:38 jmbthirteen wrote:On March 30 2011 11:28 mordk wrote:
If it were up to me, and I just had to pick that last EG player, I'd definitely pick one-arm DemusliM over 4 arm Incontrol. He's just a better player, offering better results, more compelling play, great strategies and is overall an awesome player to watch.
Plus, being from UK he's a player that increases diversity, and allows a country that is normally not so hot on e-sports to have someone to root for.
On the whole NightEnd issue. It is the tournament's organizers responsibility to state ALL the conditions required to sign the contracts in question. I find it unbelievable that Xeris is justifying their mistake based on BRAT_OK's manager's managerial acumen.
Xeris, you should remember that most of these players do not have that kind of managers, and that, whenever a person starts something requiring an application process, the conditions to be met must be fully detailed. This is actually a HUGE mistake by NASL's organization, it's sort of a sentinel mistake, in that it reveals that there's a problem with how things are being done.
The damage is already done though, all you can do is look to the future and ensure it won't be happening again, but you should definitely recognize this is a managerial mistake by NASL, since nightend had no way to know this could be an issue. Basically what I'm saying is, that while RoX_KiS manager's attitude is good, and commendable, you can't expect everyone to act in the same way, since conditions are different for different players, this is why the minimum the organization can do is state is full detail every condition needed to apply. When NightEnd was informed that the finals will take place in the USA he should have realized that he would need a Visa. It's pretty damn obvious. RoX_KiS's manager knows what must be done because he is better at his job. It is not Xeris fault that NightEnd or his manager don't know the basic knowledge of foreign travel, especially when applying to a league that has the finals in a foreign country to him. Yes, and nightend TOLD THEM he wouldnt have any issues getting a VISA, if NASL wanted more than that (an ACTUAL visa) they should have asked so, and not just sat there and once the selection is done turn around and tell him ''oh btw we needed a visa so youre cut'' Implying that Nighend or his manager dont know how travelling word is a baseless statement, obviously they know how this works, but actually knowing that you require to ''already have a visa in case you get selected in the 50'' is a whole different issue Also, from the general tone of your post its obvious you havent read half of this thread but ill still bait, rox_kis' manager did so only because brat_ok already had issues in previous tournaments, this is also a totally different situation. I have read this whole thread, been keeping a close eye on it since the NASL was announced. I know about Brat_ok's troubles with traveling too. It means he and his manager have learned from past mistakes. Why didn't NightEnd or his manager learn from Brat_ok's troubles? NightEnd thinks he wouldn't have any trouble getting a Visa, but it is not a given. Yes he should have gotten his Visa in advance not only for NASL, but also if he makes the finals of the TSL. What if it turns out he makes the finals, but can't get his Visa in time or at all? Its a process he and his manager should have completed already. That said, anybody who knows anything travel knows that no one ever gets denied for a visa unless there's a reason for it. For 99.9% of travelers to the vast majority of countries, it's just a formality. He's a pro gamer for fucks sake, there's not going to be a reason to deny his visa app. It's petty to deny someone's application for this reason. There are a million other more likely reasons why someone couldn't attend, why focus on this one?
Brat_OK could not attend Dreamhack 2010 in sweden due to visa issues... That was sweden, i promise you USA is a lot stricter when it comes to visas than sweden so it is not a far fetched requirement. It all depends on where you come from and if that country has some kind of visa program with the country you are visiting.
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As bad as I feel for NightEnd, let's all step back here and look at what he's actually asking for.
He wants the PRIVILEGE to compete in a videogame tournament where there is $400,000 in prizes spread over three tournaments.
I don't mean to be so cold or callous, but NO, being a great tournament player is NOT enough of a reason to guarantee your application. There is only 50 spots, and there are probably hundreds of great players out there that haven't even been discovered yet.
The onus is on the players show initiative, be professional, and convince the league that they belong in the tournament, not the other way around.
As an aside, I found the the quality of some of the video applications very disappointing. Some were so poor and half-assed, you would think that these players were applying for a job at MacDonald's, rather than the chance to compete for hundreds of thousands of dollars.
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On March 30 2011 15:49 DND_Enkil wrote:
Sucks for Nightend i agree, but from NASL's point of view the most important thing would be the integrity of the tournament and having as little risk for no-shows as possible. I am not sure if there are any other players invited who also comes from a country without VWP but do not think so.
in:
mouz.MaNa (Poland)
RoX.KIS.BRAT_OK (Russia)
mouz.Strelok (Ukraine)
Duckload.White-Ra (Ukraine)
applied:
Fenix (Peru)
Cocoa (Panama)
These do not have a VWP.
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On March 30 2011 15:56 pampelmus wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 15:49 DND_Enkil wrote:
Sucks for Nightend i agree, but from NASL's point of view the most important thing would be the integrity of the tournament and having as little risk for no-shows as possible. I am not sure if there are any other players invited who also comes from a country without VWP but do not think so. in: mouz.MaNa (Poland) RoX.KIS.BRAT_OK (Russia) mouz.Strelok (Ukraine) Duckload.White-Ra (Ukraine) applied: Fenix (Peru) Cocoa (Panama) These do not have a VWP.
Ah true, i hope Strelok and MaNa was able to provide some evidence aswell, since Strelok at least has struggled a lot with visa rejections in the past. Maybe Mouz manager was able to guarantee it somehow?
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On March 30 2011 15:56 pampelmus wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 15:49 DND_Enkil wrote:
Sucks for Nightend i agree, but from NASL's point of view the most important thing would be the integrity of the tournament and having as little risk for no-shows as possible. I am not sure if there are any other players invited who also comes from a country without VWP but do not think so. in: mouz.MaNa (Poland) RoX.KIS.BRAT_OK (Russia) mouz.Strelok (Ukraine) Duckload.White-Ra (Ukraine) applied: Fenix (Peru) Cocoa (Panama) These do not have a VWP.
Fenix is in
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Did NASL organizers tell the players that they will need visa's before hand to enter in this tournament ? If not this is the biggest bullshit i have ever seen and in my eyes a huge disrespect to the players who deserved to get in this tournament . Kas probably the best player in EU based on results and consistency gets left out , because NASL organizers didn't inform the players about their demands ... in other worlds they didn't do their job and also NightEND who deserved to be there more then 1/4 of the NA players .
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On March 30 2011 16:16 raga4ka wrote:
Did NASL organizers tell the players that they will need visa's before hand to enter in this tournament ? If not this is the biggest bullshit i have ever seen and in my eyes a huge disrespect to the players who deserved to get in this tournament . Kas probably the best player in EU based on results and consistency gets left out , because NASL organizers didn't inform the players about their demands and in other worlds they didn't do their job and also NightEND who deserved to be there more then 1/4 of the NA players .
They sad players had to prove that they would be able to attend the final in the US. Did they specificly say this meant proving your ability to get a visa if required? No, but anyone with experience in international Esports knows visas are a big issue when travelling internationally for many players. Take 10 min and google White-Ra + visa, Brat_OK + visa, Strelok + visa. (Thus RoX's manager provided Xeris with Brat_OK's visa number straight away so he could verify it)
Thus demonstrating your ability to get a visa would go a long way to prove that you are able to attend a final in the US.
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On March 30 2011 16:24 DND_Enkil wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 16:16 raga4ka wrote:
Did NASL organizers tell the players that they will need visa's before hand to enter in this tournament ? If not this is the biggest bullshit i have ever seen and in my eyes a huge disrespect to the players who deserved to get in this tournament . Kas probably the best player in EU based on results and consistency gets left out , because NASL organizers didn't inform the players about their demands and in other worlds they didn't do their job and also NightEND who deserved to be there more then 1/4 of the NA players . They sad players had to prove that they would be able to attend the final in the US. Did they specificly say this meant proving your ability to get a visa if required? No, but anyone with experience in international Esports knows visas are a big issue when travelling internationally for many players. Take 10 min and google White-Ra + visa, Brat_OK + visa, Strelok + visa. Thus demonstrating your ability to get a visa would go a long way to prove that you are able to attend a final in the US.
Exactly. It's not that hard to understand.
And plus Kas didn't get in because he missed the deadlines.
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Biggest problem is that this thing is actually in the US (as funny as that sounds)... The US is acting incredibly bitchy when you want to go there compared to most other countries ^^. Even for countries with some extra law/ruling/contract whatever it's called.
It's to bad but hardly the NASL's fault and it's just "normal" that they want to be on the save side here.
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On March 30 2011 16:24 DND_Enkil wrote:
Thus demonstrating your ability to get a visa would go a long way to prove that you are able to attend a final in the US.
Well, isn't the point that to prove your ability to get a visa you would essentialy have to get a visa, at a time when you still don't know if you would be in or not. Not to mention that a visa costs you some (for me in Switzerland) or a lot of (for some players in Eastern Europe?) of money, and takes a lot of time to get (got to the embassy yourself, do an interview, etc....? minimum 2 weeks in Switzerland for example).
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On March 30 2011 09:07 Jayrod wrote:
Well overall the list of players looks okay. I think the guys that really dont seem to deserve spots over some of the guys that didnt get in would have to be:
iNcontrol
EG.Machine
Vibe
DDE
Stalife
INcontrol is at least a big part of the community but the other guys only claim to fame is being okay, or in Machine's case, being the worst player in EG
Machine worst player in EG? You have to be kidding, he's awesome. I guess getting 6th in MLG Dallas (better than anyone else in EG) is the mark of the worst player in EG.
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Pretty good list. I am sad that Incredible Miracles didn't even bother to apply but I can understand their decision. Let's hope that they try to win with the qualifiers next season.
With the last 2 rounds of names NASL might become my favorite tournament to follow. I hope they can make sure that we can watch the package they promised.
Pre-game interview - game with live casting - After-game interview = AWESOMENESS.
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104 applications, 50 spots. They made their calls and some good players had to be left out. Deal with it.
Lets talk about how other aspects of the tournament can be improved. Personally I love stats in sports so a statistics or standings section on the NASL homepage showing data such as...
- Wins and losses (obviously)
- Matchup wins/losses (duh)
- Overall record vs a player
- Average game length in each matchup
- win/loss streaks
meh stuff
- Average score/average opponent score (NBA stuff, not so important here)
- Average APM
- Favorite units (http://www.sc2replayed.com/ does a great job of showing unit usage example)
Also customized pages for each player would be great. Somewhat like what the TLPD is but with more personal data and maybe more in depth stats. It would be a lot of work but I can see myself spending a ton of time browsing their site if this was up.
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What everyone seems to be missing is that Romania is part of European Union. Thus it's like hundreds time easier to get a Visa from Romania to US than from Ukraine to US for instance.
Did NASL asked to see the VISA from every non-US players ? Did they asked to see my fellow frenchman MoMaN's ? That's not what I understood.
NASL only asked ( err not 'asked', more like 'required without being very explicit' ) to see Visa from players living in 'risky' ( as far as VISA appliance is concerned of course ) countries. And Romania is not one of them, that's NASL's staff mistake i would say.
I really feel for NightEnd because his results are clearly showing that he belonged there.
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Solid line up.
Very happy to see grubby/artosis
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It's never easy to organize these things, and those that claim it is truly don't know what they're talking about. It's so easy to judge from the sidelines and declare how something should be done, it's much MUCH different to put your money where your mouth is and actually DO it. This isn't "Timmy-o-Toole's $20 Online KOTH", this is a real tournament, with real sponsors putting real money on the line towards its success. There ARE going to be a few bumps along the road, we as a supportive community have an obligation to point out the flaws, and give the NASL a chance to fix their errors before we get up in arms over every little mistake made along the way. It's going to be a learning process for everyone, and whining about the issues too much becomes a detriment, not only to the NASL, but to e-sports in general.
If NightEnD (apparently the most controversial of the "Not-Participating" group) gets his shit together for Season 2 and wants to participate, I hold out hope that the NASL team will sincerely consider his application, and not toss it because of his emotional response to being left out of Season 1. I hope that NightEnD, if he chooses to pursue a spot in Season 2 can come back to the table with a level head and a mature attitude so that we don't have to watch this debacle unfold all over again.
I think that this is a great line up of players and I only hope that no grudges will be held between players that have been left out of Season 1 and the tournament organizers. Emotions run high when dealing with things that the participants are passionate about, and sober thought must win over emotional knee-jerk reactions from all parties involved.
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Momans video is good, but Sen's was the best. Hands Down.
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On March 30 2011 16:34 Kerm wrote:
What everyone seems to be missing is that Romania is part of European Union. Thus it's like hundreds time easier to get a Visa from Romania to US than from Ukraine to US for instance.
Did NASL asked to see the VISA from every non-US players ? Did they asked to see my fellow frenchman MoMaN's ? That's not what I understood.
NASL only asked ( err not 'asked', more like 'required without being very explicit' ) to see Visa from players living in 'risky' ( as far as VISA appliance is concerned of course ) countries. And Romania is not one of them, that's NASL's staff mistake i would say.
I really feel for NightEnd because his results are clearly showing that he belonged there.
Except the whole thing that Romania isn't on the Visa Waiver List like other EU nations...
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On March 30 2011 16:50 jmbthirteen wrote:
Except the whole thing that Romania isn't on the Visa Waiver List like other EU nations...
Poland has not a Visa Waiver Program either. Mana is in. I wonder if he had to show a visa.
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EPT
