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United States7481 Posts
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On October 14 2010 20:17 Tevinhead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:16 yowza wrote:On October 14 2010 20:09 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:07 yowza wrote:
Why do people refer to that as cheese, because he used void rays? It was just a timing attack, wasn't a proxied stargate or an all in. If it isn't zealots and stalkers its hurr durr cheese amirite? Cheese is a pejorative expression which refers to a strategy that is highly unconventional and designed to take one's opponent by surprise. Minus the 'highly' I think that about sums it up. Quoting liquipedia? "In general, cheese is hard to beat if not scouted but easy to defeat if it is scouted." He scouted it before the first VR was even out, responded by building addons instead of pumping marines and didn't get enough bunkers up. "If a build order classified as Cheese fails, the player using it will usually be far behind in the game." As it was not an all in and it wasn't pure voidrays (he had a sizable groundarmy aswell) he would have caused considerable damage even if he had been forced to retreat so again it doesn't apply here. Not to mention he would have gained map control regardless as the terran would have to turtle up. "Finally, the usage of the term is often restricted to the victim of the "cheesy" strategy, to play down the opponent's achievement. " Now that sounds about accurate of this situation. He scouted it late the voidray was almost complete. And if the rush had been scouted earlier and failed I'm pretty sure the protoss was at a significant disadvantage.
-_- The thing is that the chance to deal damage is so high that there's no real way that ITR could easily have defended it even after scouting it without taking any damage and still being in a substantial lead. Do you really call a 1rax 1-marine 2-marauder with concussive an allin because you're behind if you deal no damage and lose all your units? No, because you're 99% guaranteed to deal some damage with okay micro.
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On October 14 2010 20:19 ReachTheSky wrote:
could someone stream this? I'm on a macbook and gomtv doesn't support mac os ;(
would be greatly appreciated
agreed
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fOu is a old SC1 clan that is known for creating a number of professional players including the likes of EffOrt. They recently announced that the team was going to become a SC2 team. AFAIK a lot of them have not been playing SC2 for that long, but do have that SC1 background.
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On October 14 2010 20:21 Skyze wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:19 ReachTheSky wrote:
could someone stream this? I'm on a macbook and gomtv doesn't support mac os ;(
would be greatly appreciated agreed
throwing in another please for this.
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The only thing that i don´t get about such a game is that these are pros with so much practice and than they play such a risky build where they have almost no chance at all at beating void ray. And i mean void ray push is really popular and still they go for this FE build were they just get rolled.
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On October 14 2010 20:17 Tevinhead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:16 yowza wrote:On October 14 2010 20:09 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:07 yowza wrote:
Why do people refer to that as cheese, because he used void rays? It was just a timing attack, wasn't a proxied stargate or an all in. If it isn't zealots and stalkers its hurr durr cheese amirite? Cheese is a pejorative expression which refers to a strategy that is highly unconventional and designed to take one's opponent by surprise. Minus the 'highly' I think that about sums it up. Quoting liquipedia? "In general, cheese is hard to beat if not scouted but easy to defeat if it is scouted." He scouted it before the first VR was even out, responded by building addons instead of pumping marines and didn't get enough bunkers up. "If a build order classified as Cheese fails, the player using it will usually be far behind in the game." As it was not an all in and it wasn't pure voidrays (he had a sizable groundarmy aswell) he would have caused considerable damage even if he had been forced to retreat so again it doesn't apply here. Not to mention he would have gained map control regardless as the terran would have to turtle up. "Finally, the usage of the term is often restricted to the victim of the "cheesy" strategy, to play down the opponent's achievement. " Now that sounds about accurate of this situation. He scouted it late the voidray was almost complete. And if the rush had been scouted earlier and failed I'm pretty sure the protoss was at a significant disadvantage.
Why are you completely overlooking the fact that the terran FE'd, so it was obvious his fast tech push would cause a lot of damage because the terran had no army. The toss knew this.
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I just have to ask, since this is the only thing I can make out and it seems to come up every 5 second or so: what does "koro su meeda" (pardon the inevitable bucthering) mean?
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There any restreams going? Can't get the GOM player to stop giving me an error.
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On October 14 2010 20:22 frd wrote:
I just have to ask, since this is the only thing I can make out and it seems to come up every 5 second or so: what does "koro su meeda" (pardon the inevitable bucthering) mean?
isnt it like I agree? don't quote me on this
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On October 14 2010 20:20 Ancestral wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:12 Tevinhead wrote:
Anyone else think the female commentator is super hot? Ummm... the blouse has got to go.
I agree ;-)
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On October 14 2010 20:21 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:17 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:16 yowza wrote:On October 14 2010 20:09 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:07 yowza wrote:
Why do people refer to that as cheese, because he used void rays? It was just a timing attack, wasn't a proxied stargate or an all in. If it isn't zealots and stalkers its hurr durr cheese amirite? Cheese is a pejorative expression which refers to a strategy that is highly unconventional and designed to take one's opponent by surprise. Minus the 'highly' I think that about sums it up. Quoting liquipedia? "In general, cheese is hard to beat if not scouted but easy to defeat if it is scouted." He scouted it before the first VR was even out, responded by building addons instead of pumping marines and didn't get enough bunkers up. "If a build order classified as Cheese fails, the player using it will usually be far behind in the game." As it was not an all in and it wasn't pure voidrays (he had a sizable groundarmy aswell) he would have caused considerable damage even if he had been forced to retreat so again it doesn't apply here. Not to mention he would have gained map control regardless as the terran would have to turtle up. "Finally, the usage of the term is often restricted to the victim of the "cheesy" strategy, to play down the opponent's achievement. " Now that sounds about accurate of this situation. He scouted it late the voidray was almost complete. And if the rush had been scouted earlier and failed I'm pretty sure the protoss was at a significant disadvantage. -_- The thing is that the chance to deal damage is so high that there's no real way that ITR could easily have defended it even after scouting it without taking any damage and still being in a substantial lead. Do you really call a 1rax 1-marine 2-marauder with concussive an allin because you're behind if you deal no damage and lose all your units? No, because you're 99% guaranteed to deal some damage with okay micro.
I'm not calling anything 'allin'. I'm calling it cheese. If rainbow had better scout timing he could have seen the stargate building and build ample marines to make it a lot less effective. He was pretty much caught with his pants down. Although as already mentioned it was probably a bad decision to go reactor on barracks once he spotted it.
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On October 14 2010 20:22 frd wrote:
I just have to ask, since this is the only thing I can make out and it seems to come up every 5 second or so: what does "koro su meeda" (pardon the inevitable bucthering) mean?
well, I remember that the players would always say it at the end of the artosis interviews
soo.... my guess is "thank you?"
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On October 14 2010 20:24 Tevinhead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:21 Shikyo wrote:On October 14 2010 20:17 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:16 yowza wrote:On October 14 2010 20:09 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:07 yowza wrote:
Why do people refer to that as cheese, because he used void rays? It was just a timing attack, wasn't a proxied stargate or an all in. If it isn't zealots and stalkers its hurr durr cheese amirite? Cheese is a pejorative expression which refers to a strategy that is highly unconventional and designed to take one's opponent by surprise. Minus the 'highly' I think that about sums it up. Quoting liquipedia? "In general, cheese is hard to beat if not scouted but easy to defeat if it is scouted." He scouted it before the first VR was even out, responded by building addons instead of pumping marines and didn't get enough bunkers up. "If a build order classified as Cheese fails, the player using it will usually be far behind in the game." As it was not an all in and it wasn't pure voidrays (he had a sizable groundarmy aswell) he would have caused considerable damage even if he had been forced to retreat so again it doesn't apply here. Not to mention he would have gained map control regardless as the terran would have to turtle up. "Finally, the usage of the term is often restricted to the victim of the "cheesy" strategy, to play down the opponent's achievement. " Now that sounds about accurate of this situation. He scouted it late the voidray was almost complete. And if the rush had been scouted earlier and failed I'm pretty sure the protoss was at a significant disadvantage. -_- The thing is that the chance to deal damage is so high that there's no real way that ITR could easily have defended it even after scouting it without taking any damage and still being in a substantial lead. Do you really call a 1rax 1-marine 2-marauder with concussive an allin because you're behind if you deal no damage and lose all your units? No, because you're 99% guaranteed to deal some damage with okay micro. I'm not calling anything 'allin'. I'm calling it cheese. If rainbow had better scout timing he could have seen the stargate building and build ample marines to make it a lot less effective. He was pretty much caught with his pants down. Although as already mentioned it was probably a bad decision to go reactor on barracks once he spotted it.
By calling something a cheese, you're calling it an allin. Please learn the terms before arguing.
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Some people these days.. need to settle down.
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On October 14 2010 20:23 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:22 frd wrote:
I just have to ask, since this is the only thing I can make out and it seems to come up every 5 second or so: what does "koro su meeda" (pardon the inevitable bucthering) mean? isnt it like I agree? don't quote me on this
I was thinking it stands for "indeed", seeing how it's often used to jump-start a sentence, so that'd make sense.
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DTs not goood.. alrdy has techlab on starport !! choya !!!!
jessussss 10kill on banshee b4 probes pulled
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On October 14 2010 20:25 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2010 20:24 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:21 Shikyo wrote:On October 14 2010 20:17 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:16 yowza wrote:On October 14 2010 20:09 Tevinhead wrote:On October 14 2010 20:07 yowza wrote:
Why do people refer to that as cheese, because he used void rays? It was just a timing attack, wasn't a proxied stargate or an all in. If it isn't zealots and stalkers its hurr durr cheese amirite? Cheese is a pejorative expression which refers to a strategy that is highly unconventional and designed to take one's opponent by surprise. Minus the 'highly' I think that about sums it up. Quoting liquipedia? "In general, cheese is hard to beat if not scouted but easy to defeat if it is scouted." He scouted it before the first VR was even out, responded by building addons instead of pumping marines and didn't get enough bunkers up. "If a build order classified as Cheese fails, the player using it will usually be far behind in the game." As it was not an all in and it wasn't pure voidrays (he had a sizable groundarmy aswell) he would have caused considerable damage even if he had been forced to retreat so again it doesn't apply here. Not to mention he would have gained map control regardless as the terran would have to turtle up. "Finally, the usage of the term is often restricted to the victim of the "cheesy" strategy, to play down the opponent's achievement. " Now that sounds about accurate of this situation. He scouted it late the voidray was almost complete. And if the rush had been scouted earlier and failed I'm pretty sure the protoss was at a significant disadvantage. -_- The thing is that the chance to deal damage is so high that there's no real way that ITR could easily have defended it even after scouting it without taking any damage and still being in a substantial lead. Do you really call a 1rax 1-marine 2-marauder with concussive an allin because you're behind if you deal no damage and lose all your units? No, because you're 99% guaranteed to deal some damage with okay micro. I'm not calling anything 'allin'. I'm calling it cheese. If rainbow had better scout timing he could have seen the stargate building and build ample marines to make it a lot less effective. He was pretty much caught with his pants down. Although as already mentioned it was probably a bad decision to go reactor on barracks once he spotted it. By calling something a cheese, you're calling it an allin. Please learn the terms before arguing.
Argue more than semantics before pressing 'post'. It was my understanding that 'Cheese' more specifically defines play that is unorthodox and unexpected whereas 'Allin' refers to any play that looks to end the game right there be it at the beginning or mid game with SCVs for example.
Either way, I'll agree to disagree because there's a new match on and I don't want to spam this topic arguing with you. =)..
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seems the players don't have game sound either, lol! 11 probes before he even notices...
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