• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 16:20
CET 22:20
KST 06:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 101SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-1820Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises3Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies3ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !11
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Starcraft 2 Zerg Coach ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !
Tourneys
uThermal 2v2 Circuit OSC Season 13 World Championship WardiTV Mondays $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play
Brood War
General
Empty tournaments section on Liquipedia A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone I would like to say something about StarCraft StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
SLON Grand Finals – Season 2 [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Beyond All Reason Elden Ring Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Big Programming Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced
Blogs
National Diversity: A Challe…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1147 users

TLO vs MadFrog showmatch - Page 5

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 27 28 29 Next All
OTIX
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden491 Posts
August 04 2010 14:28 GMT
#81
TLO is awesome. Madfrog is awesome. This is gonna be awesome.

That is all.
Squeegy
Profile Joined October 2009
Finland1166 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-04 14:32:23
August 04 2010 14:31 GMT
#82
On August 04 2010 08:18 Dionyseus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2010 08:08 Squeegy wrote:
On August 04 2010 04:38 PokePill wrote:
On August 04 2010 04:33 infuzer wrote:
SC is like 99% macro.
WC3 is like 99% micro.
I think SC2 depends more on micro than macro for winning.



SC2 is 99% timings, build orders, and decision making. Micro and macro are the easiest aspects by far.


Moreover, while macro was nonexistent in WC3, micro wasn't nonexistent in SC. It was very much there and much, much harder to pull off than in WC3, although admittably the game wasn't as much about micro as WC3. Anyway, this is why Bisu is the person whose micro has been by far the most impressive I've ever seen from any game. I don't get it why they think SC had no micro.


I don't see how micro in BW is harder to pull off than in WC3. WC3 has tons of spells and fewer units which makes it even more important to keep your units alive.


But that has nothing to do with what I said. I said its true that the amount of micro percentage-wise in WC3 is larger than in SC. I'm just correcting the false claim that SC doesn't have much micro at all. And I'm also pointing out that the micro moves are much harder to pull off in SC. For example pulling a wounded unit back is much easier in War3 than in SC because of the game mechanics (engine). I've seen some War3 people claiming some of the "wow" moments in SC micro are not at all impressive in War3 standards. They don't really seem to have a clue. Then there is also the matter of the units being much smaller and weaker. Not to mention that some tiny micro moves are just a waste of time in SC. It is often better to just move the whole group of marines right away, instead of wasting time with a single marine. You still have to click like hell though. War3 people think that SC can have macro while they have micro. But that's just not how it is.

On August 04 2010 12:13 Macavity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2010 10:44 holy_war wrote:
Thread after thread the shitstorm stirs. SC players just can't admit that WC3 is a skillful game that is vastly different compared to SC. Most if not all WC3 pros APM averages are above 200. Why cant we both coexist and just stop bashing eachother over and over?


You know what was really funny? It was the chatroom going bonkers during the Day[9] SC 2 Countdown Party when all these Warcraft 3 players being interviewed and saying, "Starcraft 2 is nice, graphically, but the game is much simpler/easier than Warcraft 3." I never saw so many heads exploding in a chatroom before.

If War3 was such a cakewalk, why didn't only BW players dominate it? Probably because it wasn't a cakewalk.

Anyway, I remember downloading many MadFrog replays and watching them. The guy is a very skilled player. This should be a fun showmatch, either way.


Why would only BW players dominate it even if it was a cakewalk? In early stages of War3, BW players did dominate more or less. Elky for example won some Korean league, and War3 wasn't even the only game he was playing at the time afaik. Many just moved back to BW pretty soon. A large number of War3 pros who stayed have a BW background too, so those who stuck with it, have performed quite well it seems. Anyway, you do have a point. We see mediocre BW players outplaying much better BW players. Clearly how and what skills transfer over is a complex matter.

With that being said, I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with Madfrog. Sure, this fanboyism is really annoying, but don't hate Madfrog for it.

This is indeed going to be awesome although if TLO has been practising I'm expecting him to win quite decisively.
Stan: Dude, dolphins are intelligent and friendly. Cartman: Intelligent and friendly on rye bread with some mayonnaise.
FeeL_ThE_RusH
Profile Joined February 2010
Ireland227 Posts
August 04 2010 14:32 GMT
#83
Madfrog's been invited to the IEM in Cologne too, so happy he's playing SC2 was my favourite WC3 player for years.
#starcraft.ie on Quakenet, Irish SC2ers assemble
Rokit5
Profile Joined April 2010
236 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-04 14:40:40
August 04 2010 14:36 GMT
#84
YESSSSSSSS MADFROQ IS BACK! MY ALL TIME FAVORITE PRO GAMER!! He was the guy that got me into e-sport at all. Madfroq for teh win!! TLO is also totally awesome so TLO+Madfroq sounds like a blast
Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
August 04 2010 14:38 GMT
#85
Madfrog was awesome at BW back in the day too
SpiritAshura
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1271 Posts
August 04 2010 14:42 GMT
#86
I like the mix, the ex-wc3 players are managing well in sc2 so far. should be a fun showmatch, would like to see madfrog win but i think TLO will win 2-1
Cade
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada1420 Posts
August 04 2010 14:42 GMT
#87
sounds like a pretty interesting series!
Integra
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Sweden5626 Posts
August 04 2010 14:48 GMT
#88
since this thread is about the awesome Madfrog a picture of him is in order for those who doesn't know who this god is:
[image loading]
"Dark Pleasure" | | I survived the Locust war of May 3, 2014
FlashIsHigh
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States474 Posts
August 04 2010 14:51 GMT
#89
Damn Ive been noticing there are a lot of Madfrog fans in the world, but lets be serious TLO is gunna crush him
KT Flash// WhiteRa/Scarlett/Naniwa/MC/Huk/Nony
See.Blue
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2673 Posts
August 04 2010 14:59 GMT
#90
Wow stoked for this. Shoutout/high five/firm handshake to blizzard for orchestrating this.
Nereus
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden9 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-04 15:07:30
August 04 2010 15:05 GMT
#91
in rts in general madfrog is one of the best players in the whole world, he's like boxer and nada, but he ended his career early, if he takes sc2 serious he can be the best. he's getting old though

TLO is good but its nothing to compared to madfrog, but TLO has been playing sc2 a lot more
clusen
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany8702 Posts
August 04 2010 15:08 GMT
#92
On August 04 2010 11:38 MICHELLE wrote:
Best nonkorean? :S....
What about sky, grubby, tod, infi...... I wouldn't say he was the best nonkorean player.... But he was a very good UD for sure.

Sky was just on the rise and came to the proscene in late 05, infi was a noname back then. ToD wasn't as good and Grubby might be the only contender for being as skilled as Frog in Europe.

But there was one specific player who was better than Frog or Moon-> FoV. Maybe Sweet aswell.

Madfrog was a god, noone comes close to him. In terms of skill maybe, but Frog was like Backstreet Boys for wc3-nerds in Europe. He was the rolemodel for players like Grubby. He was more than just some skilled player.

And now he is back
Jameser
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden951 Posts
August 04 2010 15:56 GMT
#93
for the wc3 hatin BW players; I was a mediocre at best wc3 player, and am now I would say by comparison a much much better sc2 player

so if wc3 took no skills, I guess sc2 takes even less lol (clearly it doesn't)
Nereus
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden9 Posts
August 04 2010 16:09 GMT
#94
SC2 is a very easy game compared to wc3 and bw, but thats mostly because wc3 and bw has been out for a long time
SolHeiM
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden1264 Posts
August 04 2010 16:10 GMT
#95
On August 05 2010 00:56 Jameser wrote:
for the wc3 hatin BW players; I was a mediocre at best wc3 player, and am now I would say by comparison a much much better sc2 player

so if wc3 took no skills, I guess sc2 takes even less lol (clearly it doesn't)


Yeah, you're better because you've had prolonged exposure to the RTS genre, therefore, your skill has increased. It has nothing to do with one game being easier than the other.
xzidez
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden147 Posts
August 04 2010 16:20 GMT
#96
On August 05 2010 01:09 Nereus wrote:
SC2 is a very easy game compared to wc3 and bw, but thats mostly because wc3 and bw has been out for a long time



Why do people keep saying this bullshit? SC2 is just as easy for the opponent as it is for you, unless you are playing singleplayer.. Which makes it just as hard as any other game where both parts are playing at the same difficulty. If it is so easy, howcome I dont see you anywhere at the top?


If you are playing singleplayer I apologise, because then it would perhaps be correct to say its easy.
StormsInJuly
Profile Joined January 2009
Sweden165 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-04 16:22:57
August 04 2010 16:22 GMT
#97
On August 05 2010 01:20 xzidez wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2010 01:09 Nereus wrote:
SC2 is a very easy game compared to wc3 and bw, but thats mostly because wc3 and bw has been out for a long time



Why do people keep saying this bullshit? SC2 is just as easy for the opponent as it is for you, unless you are playing singleplayer.. Which makes it just as hard as any other game where both parts are playing at the same difficulty. If it is so easy, howcome I dont see you anywhere at the top?


If you are playing singleplayer I apologise, because then it would perhaps be correct to say its easy.

He's right though, they're harder because they've been out for many years and player skill level has increased

In sc and war3 everybody on ladder has played every map a thousand times and has memorized every detail and every possible matchup, so it's a lot harder to get into
alphafuzard
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1610 Posts
August 04 2010 16:22 GMT
#98
all the madfrog support from these little peons is cute
but lets put hands together for team liquid's own TLO!!!
more weight
xzidez
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden147 Posts
August 04 2010 16:24 GMT
#99
On August 05 2010 01:22 StormsInJuly wrote:
He's right though, they're harder because they've been out for many years and player skill level has increased

In sc and war3 everybody on ladder has played every map a thousand times and has memorized every detail and every possible matchup, so it's a lot harder to get into


Ah you are right here. But the game itself is just as easy as it was when it was released .

Thanks for the correction tho!
Squeegy
Profile Joined October 2009
Finland1166 Posts
August 04 2010 16:52 GMT
#100
On August 05 2010 00:05 Nereus wrote:
in rts in general madfrog is one of the best players in the whole world, he's like boxer and nada, but he ended his career early, if he takes sc2 serious he can be the best. he's getting old though

TLO is good but its nothing to compared to madfrog, but TLO has been playing sc2 a lot more


*facepalm*

No, he's not like Boxer or Nada.
Stan: Dude, dolphins are intelligent and friendly. Cartman: Intelligent and friendly on rye bread with some mayonnaise.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 27 28 29 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Patches Events
20:00
The 5.4k Patch Clash #10
RotterdaM261
Liquipedia
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
18:00
FSL s9 code B championships
Freeedom19
Liquipedia
OSC
18:00
World Championship: Challenger
WardiTV882
davetesta38
Belair 19
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 261
PiGStarcraft240
IndyStarCraft 141
ProTech140
JuggernautJason114
Nathanias 92
Railgan 45
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 403
Dewaltoss 128
Sexy 22
soO 16
ajuk12(nOOB) 11
NaDa 11
Dota 2
febbydoto2
Other Games
Grubby5912
Liquid`RaSZi2315
FrodaN1800
fl0m826
mouzStarbuck493
Liquid`Hasu443
DeMusliM420
JimRising 261
B2W.Neo231
ArmadaUGS191
Livibee140
Mew2King76
Ketroc6
Organizations
StarCraft 2
angryscii 27
Other Games
BasetradeTV17
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• printf 95
• Hupsaiya 35
• Kozan
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• 80smullet 31
• Pr0nogo 4
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV282
Other Games
• imaqtpie2563
• Shiphtur347
Upcoming Events
OSC
14h 41m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
16h 41m
BSL 21
22h 41m
Dewalt vs Cross
Replay Cast
1d 11h
Wardi Open
1d 14h
RotterdaM Event
1d 20h
Patches Events
1d 22h
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
OSC
2 days
OSC
3 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
4 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S1: W2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
Escore Tournament S1: W3
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Thunderfire SC2 All-star 2025
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
Underdog Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.