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Merkmerk
United States96 Posts
But I agree that the 'free' harass options are a bit much when zerg doesn't have any options to be aggressive against T or P early game that isn't an easily counterable allin They should have given the wings ability to jump cliffs for a 25/25 jump or something | ||
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smOOthMayDie
United States997 Posts
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HellHound
Bulgaria5962 Posts
On December 27 2015 16:23 smOOthMayDie wrote: What is everyone vetoing? Nothing all the maps are doable for Z Veto whatever you hate the most/is your worst winrate. Actually just do that for any map pool  | ||
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Ulrezaj1
1 Post
I started playing starcraft again after 3 years. Back in 2012 I was Masterleague, now I claimed Diamond after ~ 40 games without knowing any BO or advantages/disadvantages of the maps. I have a few questions that realy confuse me now when playing the game: 1. Biggest problem: Injects: I used to Inject with the minimap. All Queens bind at 5, select hotkey - shift and than on minimap: klcik klick klick klick. The problem: Now the hatches can be incted all the time, no cooldown anymore. So lets say the queen in the main has only 23 energy. She's doing nothing, but the queen of the natural starts running to the mainbase to inject. Next hatch in order to incect is the hatch at natural base so this 2nd queen go back and inject the natural. The result is that nothing happens in the main. I often had another situation where I noticed that 2 queens suddenly stay at one hatch, than I injected next round and they start running around again like they are confused :| . So I waste important time. Is there a better methode to avoid this kind of situations ? 2. Timings. For example I remember the 12min max 200/200 roach push. Or the time to fly in with overlord, or taking 3rd. Or even my own gastimings. All this is now totaly useless cause of the new clock.  When scouting with Overlord? I often feel that they are, compared to the faster start (12 worker), to late to scout. One time he already got shot down by Marine on the way to his base because he doesnt went for reaper first. I didnt noticed any highgrounds so far on most of this maps where you can save him.3. How many Worker are the "best" number now ? 60 instead of 80 or what ? 4. Roach/Ravanger is the way to go now ? Everytime I go for Muta, I feel like its more than a big risk than a gamebreaking transition, as long as I dont already have an advantage. I watched streams lately and they decide to switch to ultra in late but I didnt get when its the right moment to do so. Or have to handle with upgrades. Playing R/R with 2/2 rangeupgrades and then at Hive start 1/3 meelee ? So far this game is very confusing. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
2. Drone scout for the earlier timings such as mass reapers. Or carefully move your overlord so it doesn't die to a first marine from barracks. 3. It's unlikely that you will have 80 drones and 4 bases mining before your main starts to run out of the lower mienral fields. there is no "ideal" It depends on how the game plays out. 4. it depends on you play style. | ||
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Vortun
42 Posts
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Nazara
United Kingdom235 Posts
At the end of each cycle I just press s to stop. The only problem occurs if you have a fresh base and no Queen by it. This messes up the Injects completely 2. Yeah maps are bad for leaving Overlords on them. A good time to Overlord scout is around 3:15-3:40, that's what most guides say. Also sending a drone around 13-14 is always good. I normally don't use the clock and base my timings on my tech. For example, in zvz, I scout my opponents base soon after I start my Lair. 3. Number of drones is still the same. You always want to have an equivalent of 3 fully saturated bases at all times. You just need to move drones to new bases a lot more. 4. Personally I never use Ravagers. I play ling/bane/corruptor/infestor zvt or roach/hydra/lurker/corruptor in zvp. Works just fine for me. Muta switches can be good in ZvP, but in ZvT don't bother. Liberators slaughter Mutalisks. | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5458 Posts
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Aelendis
Belgium892 Posts
On December 28 2015 04:48 SoleSteeler wrote: Have there been any good pro games with lurker usage? Honestly they don't feel like they can really turn a game around unless they are part of a super turtle-y zerg. :/ For my part I struggle a lot in ZVZ against lurkers. It's usually mutas into lurkers or roach wars into lurkers. How do you guys deal with lurkers in zvz? Do you just get some lurkers aswell? | ||
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A_needle_jog
Korea (South)699 Posts
On December 28 2015 05:13 Aelendis wrote: For my part I struggle a lot in ZVZ against lurkers. It's usually mutas into lurkers or roach wars into lurkers. How do you guys deal with lurkers in zvz? Do you just get some lurkers aswell? My games hardly ever get to the lurker stages stages :D If they do then I just do the protoss. Build big Army and 10 overseers and A move into it killing it all and claiming a victory. | ||
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ThePastor
New Zealand380 Posts
On December 28 2015 04:48 SoleSteeler wrote: Have there been any good pro games with lurker usage? Honestly they don't feel like they can really turn a game around unless they are part of a super turtle-y zerg. :/ Life used Lurkers in his ZvP against Zest (I think it was Zest) in the first round of pre-season. I use them in ZvP with a lot of success. Pressure with Ling/Hydra while lurker den is constructing. Morph hydra into lurkers and then siege up protoss. Works really well on 3rds where toss has millions of buildings everywhere limiting movement. | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5458 Posts
On December 28 2015 05:32 ThePastor wrote: Life used Lurkers in his ZvP against Zest (I think it was Zest) in the first round of pre-season. I use them in ZvP with a lot of success. Pressure with Ling/Hydra while lurker den is constructing. Morph hydra into lurkers and then siege up protoss. Works really well on 3rds where toss has millions of buildings everywhere limiting movement. Found and watched that game, thanks. I like seeing lurkers used offensively... seems somewhat rare, surprisingly! | ||
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DERASTAT
Germany99 Posts
Or other Replays/Vods? second: how many Queens you go in ZvT? i go for fast 3 Queens and then i am a little but cluess aboutthe extra ones | ||
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Merkmerk
United States96 Posts
I'm like 25% against toss, with a 70% win rate in ZVZ and about 55% in ZvT They are completely impregnable early game thanks to how bullshit photon overcharge is right now (can't wait for that nerf) and adepts make zergling drops a complete waste They can pretty much open whatever they want but they usually open phoenix contain which mutas get slaughtered by but corruptors can't chase down, then they do zealot/archon and I'm just trading to stay alive with banelings against zealots and lurker/roach/hydra/infestor/ultra/corruptor I can't mount any kind of offense against their mass expansions and there isn't any composition I've found that actually wins without heavy losses. Just stumped here. (I'm plat) | ||
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ThePastor
New Zealand380 Posts
On December 28 2015 09:56 SoleSteeler wrote: Found and watched that game, thanks. I like seeing lurkers used offensively... seems somewhat rare, surprisingly! I have been doing this in ZvP since I watched that with great success. Whenever I don't get cheesed out because of my bad scouting I win That is at diamond on KR server | ||
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ThePastor
New Zealand380 Posts
On December 28 2015 10:06 DERASTAT wrote: With my Goal of reaching Masters "soon", anybody now wich Vods from the gsl feature Roach ravager makro opener(the normal infestor/ultra transition with a fast 4rth) so i can copy some builds, i looked some up. Most of them seems to go Muta or get Massed Reapert :D. Or other Replays/Vods? second: how many Queens you go in ZvT? i go for fast 3 Queens and then i am a little but cluess aboutthe extra ones Just find Snute or Solar's ZvT. They both do roach/ravager with great success. | ||
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A_needle_jog
Korea (South)699 Posts
On December 28 2015 10:22 Merkmerk wrote: What the hell are we supposed to do against protoss? I'm like 25% against toss, with a 70% win rate in ZVZ and about 55% in ZvT They are completely impregnable early game thanks to how bullshit photon overcharge is right now (can't wait for that nerf) and adepts make zergling drops a complete waste They can pretty much open whatever they want but they usually open phoenix contain which mutas get slaughtered by but corruptors can't chase down, then they do zealot/archon and I'm just trading to stay alive with banelings against zealots and lurker/roach/hydra/infestor/ultra/corruptor I can't mount any kind of offense against their mass expansions and there isn't any composition I've found that actually wins without heavy losses. Just stumped here. (I'm plat) I feel you. Playing starcraft 2 right now as a Zerg feels like walking on thin ice. When I miss one inject or lose 3 drones then I feel like I am so far behind I can't even win anymore. Even when I perfectly defend harass like Liberator, Adepts, Reaper I still don't feel like I am ahead. Things that are strong against Protoss : - Mutalisks / Muta switch - Zergling drops with overlord. - Overwhelming amount of early game lings to contest third base for Protoss - Lurker - Broodlords I think the key is in the right scouting. Some Protoss players play super ultra greedy and they have a strong army in like 7-8 minutes of the game with Archons, Charge Zealots, High Templar, Immortals and Stalkers. Those guys you have to use zerglings in the early-mid game heavily to counter their greed. Phoenix are very strong I agree. I find them to be very problematic too. For that I have no real answer yet. Maybe Nydus with queens roaches and zerglings. Zerg in LOTV needs perfect execution and every single unit is valuable. In prior expansions you could lose a couple of units when you had great economy and macro, but with LOTV they nerfed zerg macro so hard that Terran and especially Protoss are basically always on the same worker count even if you drone greedy. ZvP is exhausting. Yesterday or the day before that can't remember I played a game where I went for Corruptor to counter the phoenixes and droned heavily then transitions into Corruptor/Broodlord/Roaches. It worked pretty well and I won. Though I think the Protoss could've won if he had attacked me at the right time. - play hard - never forget injects - drone when you can - scout with zerglings and overlords - punish them if they play greedy - don't max 200/200 useless Units like Roaches if you have the time to tech and go better units - don't sacrifice units if you can somehow save them, because every unit counts in LOTV for Zerg. - try to spread creep as far as possible to see when they are coming. Gives you extra time to react! I know it is a lot and Zerg needs lots of APM, but it is manageable Hope it helps !  | ||
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IcemanAsi
Israel681 Posts
http://ggtracker.com/matches/6351292 Terran is meching with Thor-Liberator and I went for Ultra-Ling, I tried handling the liberators with corruptors but they got demolished. Should I have gone for Vipers? I lose a huge chunk of lings to a mine at 12:00, I wonder if that could have been the swing moment. | ||
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A_needle_jog
Korea (South)699 Posts
On December 28 2015 21:51 IcemanAsi wrote: Had a very tough ZvT game and I wanted to hear any advice: http://ggtracker.com/matches/6351292 Terran is meching with Thor-Liberator and I went for Ultra-Ling, I tried handling the liberators with corruptors but they got demolished. Should I have gone for Vipers? I lose a huge chunk of lings to a mine at 12:00, I wonder if that could have been the swing moment. Against mech you have to exploit terran being immobile. Zergling run bys, harass, nydus is the key. Take out their production facilities and slowly close the game with corruptor/broodlords/infestor/zerling. | ||
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IcemanAsi
Israel681 Posts
On December 28 2015 22:09 A_needle_jog wrote: Against mech you have to exploit terran being immobile. Zergling run bys, harass, nydus is the key. Take out their production facilities and slowly close the game with corruptor/broodlords/infestor/zerling. Didn't think about attacking the production facilities, I have to admit that still sounds kinda odd, taking out a few factories, those aren't really expensive or take long to produce, annoying sure, but doesn't sound crippling. My air just got melted by the liberators. I'm guessing Vipers are the answer but my caster micro is horrendous. | ||
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