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On December 27 2018 03:45 M3funkyb1 wrote:
Hi. What's the best way to cost efficiently handle mass widow mine, hellion? Mass spine crawler, with hydras mixed in seems to work -ok- but I can't ever get out on the map. Brood lords also work -okay- but if I am ever out of position they just walk 30 widow mines underneath my brood lords and kill them. Also, hydras out of position are melted by the hellions.
Thanks in advance.
mass roach ravager should absolutely shit on it, what's your mmr?
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On January 07 2019 00:51 AngelicFruitcake wrote:
Hi all,
Haven't been playing for about 8 months. I was a low-level platinum zerg last I checked. Just wanted to know if there's been any major changes in the meta since I last played? I was in the middle of working out some kinks in my mechanics so I usually tried to do fairly simple strategies. I just want to know if there's any new tricks people are using that I should be on the lookout for, or if the balance patches have changed anything major in the early/mid game.
The meta changed yeah.
1/1/1 is the standard opener for T, but of course at platium you will still see some 2/1/1. There is also the BC build that is totatlly new (but not sure if it's played in platium).
The change is mutas are viable now on ZvT vs bio.
On ZvP, honestly the things havent't changed much. Mass chargelots/archons/immortal is still really popular. Sometimes mass phoenix and drop archons. Skytoss is still a thing.
ZvZ is more mutas heavy now.
But on platium, you must focus on learning standard builds (go on sc2cast to see the latest replays), and how to scout and react depending on what the other is doing.
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On January 09 2019 02:46 Tyrhanius wrote:
The meta changed yeah.
1/1/1 is the standard opener for T, but of course at platium you will still see some 2/1/1. There is also the BC build that is totatlly new (but not sure if it's played in platium).
The change is mutas are viable now on ZvT vs bio.
On ZvP, honestly the things havent't changed much. Mass chargelots/archons/immortal is still really popular. Sometimes mass phoenix and drop archons. Skytoss is still a thing.
ZvZ is more mutas heavy now.
But on platium, you must focus on learning standard builds (go on sc2cast to see the latest replays), and how to scout and react depending on what the other is doing.
Thanks! I am trying to focus on scouting, reactions and timings. I was doing reasonably well, but sometimes when I've been gone a while I just get whacked with new concepts. Good to know about mutas, I was ready to give up on them. Does that mean ling/bling/muta in ZvT works against bio now or are mutas more of a complement? I think I ran into the BC build and lost, but that was probably because I only thought it was regular air. Also, I really don't know the new maps.
Is it still useful to go for hydras in ZvZ or are they getting massacred by mutas?
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On January 12 2019 06:29 AngelicFruitcake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2019 02:46 Tyrhanius wrote:
The meta changed yeah.
1/1/1 is the standard opener for T, but of course at platium you will still see some 2/1/1. There is also the BC build that is totatlly new (but not sure if it's played in platium).
The change is mutas are viable now on ZvT vs bio.
On ZvP, honestly the things havent't changed much. Mass chargelots/archons/immortal is still really popular. Sometimes mass phoenix and drop archons. Skytoss is still a thing.
ZvZ is more mutas heavy now.
But on platium, you must focus on learning standard builds (go on sc2cast to see the latest replays), and how to scout and react depending on what the other is doing. Thanks! I am trying to focus on scouting, reactions and timings. I was doing reasonably well, but sometimes when I've been gone a while I just get whacked with new concepts. Good to know about mutas, I was ready to give up on them. Does that mean ling/bling/muta in ZvT works against bio now or are mutas more of a complement? I think I ran into the BC build and lost, but that was probably because I only thought it was regular air. Also, I really don't know the new maps. Is it still useful to go for hydras in ZvZ or are they getting massacred by mutas? midgame hydra vs muta interaction hasn't really changed much. if you're playing roach/hydra and you're even or behind against muta you want to be defending and teching to hydra/infestor, then trying to win with a big 2/2 push. you add infestors to counter speed banelings. same as its been since heart of the swarm
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How are mutas better vs Bio now?
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On January 14 2019 00:27 GGzerG wrote:
How are mutas better vs Bio now?
Thors were nerfed, you now need more than one thor to handle any amount of mutas.
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On January 14 2019 01:47 InfCereal wrote:Thors were nerfed, you now need more than one thor to handle any amount of mutas.
Hmm....I see, I haven't played SC2 in a long time, thinking of playing again.
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This Battlecruiser build and mass oracle build is really stupid, just good scouting and mass queen / early hydra vs BC , and good scouting / good amount of queens / spore / rush to hydra as well? Nydus as a counter? What do you guys think.
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How do you counter the canon rush/shieldbattery/immortal proxy ? I've 0% winrates vs that strats, i need vod/replay to show me how to beat that.
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Thank a lot. I was doing a bit like that but there are some subilities like no inject.mass queen for only transfusion or the proxy hatch to force canon i didn't know.
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On January 20 2019 23:39 GGzerG wrote:
This Battlecruiser build and mass oracle build is really stupid, just good scouting and mass queen / early hydra vs BC , and good scouting / good amount of queens / spore / rush to hydra as well? Nydus as a counter? What do you guys think.
I just open 2 Base Spire every ZvT since early HotS.
Never had any Issues with the BC's
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On January 25 2019 16:03 Railgan wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2019 23:39 GGzerG wrote:
This Battlecruiser build and mass oracle build is really stupid, just good scouting and mass queen / early hydra vs BC , and good scouting / good amount of queens / spore / rush to hydra as well? Nydus as a counter? What do you guys think. I just open 2 Base Spire every ZvT since early HotS. Never had any Issues with the BC's
Do you go for Mutas then or for Corrupters? At what time is your Spire done usually?
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Okay, fellow Zerglings.
How do you prepare/scout/beat those pesky Protoss 2-base all-ins, which seem to be in fashion again ?
Sometimes they even go for 3rd and that is not of course all-in any more, but they are actually ahead in economy too.
Imo its very hard to scout/determine, when they move out, especially if they dedicate to killing lings outside base/killing overlords for scout. They can push at 5 mins or then at 8 mins. If I prepare for 5 mins push, Im terribly behind if he doesnt come. And sometimes even if I make only units, they use warp prism and warp 8 adepts to my main while attacking 3rd. There are so many ways for him to attack and scout what I am doing. I just feel completely lost at the matchup atm.
So basically: How to survive against Protoss for 10 minutes. I cant seem to do so atm. Diamond 3, 3500sh MMR.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
On February 02 2019 00:05 Starcloud wrote:
Okay, fellow Zerglings.
How do you prepare/scout/beat those pesky Protoss 2-base all-ins, which seem to be in fashion again ?
Sometimes they even go for 3rd and that is not of course all-in any more, but they are actually ahead in economy too.
Imo its very hard to scout/determine, when they move out, especially if they dedicate to killing lings outside base/killing overlords for scout. They can push at 5 mins or then at 8 mins. If I prepare for 5 mins push, Im terribly behind if he doesnt come. And sometimes even if I make only units, they use warp prism and warp 8 adepts to my main while attacking 3rd. There are so many ways for him to attack and scout what I am doing. I just feel completely lost at the matchup atm.
So basically: How to survive against Protoss for 10 minutes. I cant seem to do so atm. Diamond 3, 3500sh MMR.
Well we've got WCS and GSL starting again so I'm just going to watch every zerg game and shamelessly steal builds.
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On February 02 2019 00:05 Starcloud wrote:
Okay, fellow Zerglings.
How do you prepare/scout/beat those pesky Protoss 2-base all-ins, which seem to be in fashion again ?
Sometimes they even go for 3rd and that is not of course all-in any more, but they are actually ahead in economy too.
Imo its very hard to scout/determine, when they move out, especially if they dedicate to killing lings outside base/killing overlords for scout. They can push at 5 mins or then at 8 mins. If I prepare for 5 mins push, Im terribly behind if he doesnt come. And sometimes even if I make only units, they use warp prism and warp 8 adepts to my main while attacking 3rd. There are so many ways for him to attack and scout what I am doing. I just feel completely lost at the matchup atm.
So basically: How to survive against Protoss for 10 minutes. I cant seem to do so atm. Diamond 3, 3500sh MMR.
This guide on SC2swarm is great :
https://sc2swarm.com/2018/12/11/standard-roach-zvp/
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A few things about me, so you can relate to my question better: After years of SC2 hiatus (didnt really play since 2013), I'm thinking about coming back to the game. My problem is I have missed everything of LotV and even most of HotS. I was a Master player back in WoL and the beginning of HotS, 2017 I played 5 games and got placed into Gold. I watched some pro games, but not enough to understand the Meta or know anything about builds. Heck, I dont even know what many units do exactly or what upgrades there are, but I will catch up to those things on my own, dont worry :D
So my question:
What are good standard build orders (or where can I find them), to get into a standard midgame? I dont wanna play cheesy baneling busts but also I dont wanna play the greediest builds possible, I just want to get into a normal macro midgame and play and learn from there.
I played a few games of Unranked, but people there are just so bad, stuff like 1 base turtle in 3 Thor attack (when I'm close to maxed) isnt really fun to play against, so I guess I have to go back to Ranked. But I dont want to play Ranked with so little game knowledge, I instantly remember my ladder anxiety...
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Unranked and ranked is the same matchmaker. The only difference is you have 2 separate MMRs and the unranked one isn't visible.
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Oh okay, I guess I am in dumpster league then. I guess I play some Ranked to see what league I will get.
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Getting back into the game after about 5+ years away. I just lost a game vs Terran (replay here https://sc2replaystats.com/replay/9835686) where I tried to roach timing them, didn’t see a natural, was confused and fumbled a bit, then decided to continue with the timing and died to hellions killing all my drones before I could make any roaches.
The game actually technically continues for about 5 minutes after he kills all my drones, and I do eventually make some roaches, try to attack and get crushed since the timing is late and he already has tanks and widow mines. But I think it was really over after that first hellion attack.
Q1: would my overlord at 2:40 have seen the CC if it was there? Or would I need to move it further forward and then back up?
Q2: If I saw, how should I have reacted when I didn’t see a natural base?
My thought is make a roach warren immediately to partially wall the ramp, and then start an additional queen and build the third hatch in my natural to make a wall in with my roach warren. Maybe throw down a spine also. My worry about this plan is that it might help with hellions or marines, but doesn’t do anything vs banshees or other air pressure.
At 3:11 my lings check his natural and confirm no CC.
Q3: At this point I know for sure he is doing some kind of 1 base aggression before expanding. How should I react?
It's too late to build my third hatch in the natural, but I could still build a roach warren asap. What I did was start a spore in my base and start more queens. Maybe I should have started some spines? I didn’t want to overreact though.
A bit later at 3:40ish some hellions kill my scouting lings. I don’t see this because may attention wasn’t on the lings.
Q4: When the hellions show up at my base at 4:03 was I just dead, or could i have reacted or microed better to save my drones?
I tried to use queens to block ramp and chase them away, but the ramp wasn’t creeped so they were slow going between main and natural, and when I tried to use the queens blocking my ramp to help vs the hellions, the hellions just rolled into my main.
One immediate change I’ve made to my play was just banning the map. Seems too wide and hard to protect natural from hellions.
Q5: what are good maps to ban as zerg?
Q6: Any other suggestions? Note I know having better macro and crisper timings helps with everything and I’m working on those, but I can’t immediately chose to just have them be better, so I’m looking for changes I can implement immediately as I try to improve those things gradually.
Thanks everyone!
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EPT
