Hi guys, during SCBW times, Liquipedia was such a great resource for build orders - all mainstream progaming builds with their variations, as well as the more unorthodox up to cheese builds, were listed.
For SC2, Liquipedia still looks bleak :-/
Only a small amount has found its way into Liquipedia; and half of the BOs there are outdated, and/or only suited for the casual player.
So: If everyone of you could contribute one build, we could change this in the blink of an eye.
But please: Only add progamer builds; or if the builds are your own, only those that are really well thought through, and will stand up to Diamond level play, or, preferrably, better.
As always, it is a great help if you can link to a VOD shwocasing the build, and give information on build adaptation, if available.
Liquipedia is dead in every aspect other than tournament results and player profiles (the latter can still be outdated) When I first started out in Starcraft which was at the start of Heart of the Swarm I was avidly trying to learn how to get better. The first site I stumbled upon was Liquipedia which to my dismay was mostly outdated, I took a further look around the site and found the section of "stub" builds, now these varied from very informed and current builds to the most illiterate rabble about a build they "made" and is "very good".
I feel as if it died because of the awkward formatting the amount of effort you've got to put into a build and the fact the moderators or any sign of life on the site appears to be active.
If there's anyway I can help contribute to Liquipedia I sure would, but not until I get assurances that my effort wouldn't fall on deaf ears and end up as a stub build because the moderators of Liquipedia didn't take notice.
LoTV isn't out for another whole year or perhaps even longer so why even put that on the radar. The fact of the matter is Liquipedia is not doing well for itself and it needs an overhaul, people are willing to do so.
SC2 Toastie I've seen some of the mega guides on Liquipedia, as long as there's a link to it on the Liquipedia page that should be enough to get the message out? It also promoted TL to people who are new and just searched for a build order.
There's not much we can do until a moderator for the site confirms they exist and that things we do won't be consigned to the abyss.
Liquipedia needs to show a sign of life, but the idea is based off users creating and consuming content. Nobody creates because they feel like everything is outsated. We need some frontrunners to start from scratch and make the site a valuable resource again: that'll generate more users and thus more content. It's a selffulfilling prophecy kinda problem.
Toastie, we need the moderators to confirm. Pholon the person you supposedly have to contact has retired from Liquipedia so we're stumped until they can find a new person to take over.
I would be more than happy if that's fine by them, but I'm sure they want someone who has posted more than I have (had another account before this but changed my name on Bnet)
Imbabuilds isn't that up to date either and when you search Sc2 [insert race here] builds it comes up with Liquipedia first.
You can do all of it yourselves guys. Liquipedia is from the community to the community. Contributions don't have to be huge as in alone writing a guide for every variation of a gateway expansion ever seen. Even opening a one of this outdated BO pages and starting to update it bit by bit, along the guidelines of course helps everyone. And nets you those shiny coins which I know you all want.
For example this page http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Aggressive_Pool_First could look a lot better if someone just changed the outdated map recommendations to those used nowadays, and maybe some mention of MSC stopping all the fun of zerg cheesing.
I started about a year ago with really tiny edits here and there, and now I've netted some four-digit number of edits already. Just give it a try
EDIT: Ovid below, I think adding new builds is very very good, but for starting one's LP editing it might be tiresome and demanding. I at least found it really fun to help here and there rather than grabbing a big chunk of editing instantly (actually I still have some GSL music track lists unfinished, but at least they've progressed a bit) . And no, I've not written whole guides, but I have made some tournament pages from scratch though.
Oukka, that's very interesting have you made any full guides though? Just because updating ones here and there is very good but new builds are out and we can't just keep it with things like 14/14 and 6-12 Pools (In very low depth might I add)
I would gladly consume. back in summer 2012 when I was still in bronze i was constantly looking on liquipedia, but ever since HOTS nobody has added new proper BO's for me to look to when i'm stuck in a rut .
I would really like for it to become a thumbnail on my browser bar again .
I think a lot of people are put off writing guides by the Team Liquid's high standards (back in 2010 the strategy section was constantly bombarded with new guides until they tightened up the rules).
One possible idea would be to create a place in Liquidpedia for people to create guides (similar to Dota 2) and then they can incrementally improve over time. We'd also need some sort of ranking system to let the best ones float to the top and get featured.
Here's a fun 2v2 WOL guide I made ages ago but I'd never add it to Liquidpedia because it wasn't tested enough. + Show Spoiler +
'A punch to the back of the head that can cause injury or death.'
Overview
Inspired by 2Vs2Lukking's Falcon Punch 2v2 Guide, I decided to invent a resource sharing build of my own. After much experimentation and failure (resource sharing builds are extremely fragile!), I settled on the idea of highly upgraded bio in a double terran team; as its viable in all match ups and scales well thoughout the game. One player is responsible for holding off early aggression while the other techs as hard as possible; once resource trading is enabled, the defending player feeds all resources to the teching player and then concentrates purely on macro and helping to micro marine drops.
Summary
Fastest possible upgraded bio with medivacs
One player feeding at 5 minutes, with shared control
Bunker and marines for early defence against rushes
Get Combat Shield first to hold off attacks at 5.30
Stim timed to complete with first medivacs
Do economic and tech damage via drops when 1/1 is complete
Trade as much as possible, bio is stronger in smaller engagements
Kill move when 3/3 completes with maxed army
Feeder Role
Build order Wall off the ramp with Depot and Barracks to ensure their scout is denied. While the Barracks is building, send an SCV to scout (and check proxy locations). Build at least 3 marines for early game defence. Depending on scouting information, build bunkers and extra marines. Build an in base Command Centre and take both gas if opponents are teching or expanding. Constantly scout for expansions or early aggression. Hotkey SCVs for bunker repair if needed. Cut SCVs at 41 on 2 bases (16 patches * 2 + 3 gas * 3), or 30 on 1 base (8 patches * 3 + 2 gas * 3) Begin feeding at 5 minutes (keep the resource window open and use the scroll bar to send resources faster).
Approximately 500 minerals and 200 gas if 1 rax fe
900 minerals, 100 gas if 1 rax, 3 marines, 2 depots, scout, 1 bunker, 1 gas (delayed) and 23 supply
700 minerals, 300 gas if 1 rax, 1 gas, 4 marines, 3 depots ,1 bunker and 27 supply
Start marine production at 5 minute mark. Make Starport when Factory completes (use the same SCV). Make reactor on Factory and swap when Starport completes. Make Armoury when upgrades are at 90/160 (approx 50% complete). Combat Shield completes at 5.30 minutes. Add additional barracks when expansions are taken or there are excess resources. If the income feed is erratic, add tech labs and reactors to catch up with production. 1/1 completes at 7:20 minutes. Stimpack completes at 8:20 minutes 2/2 completes at 10.30 minutes. 3/3 completes at 14 minutes.
Additonal Notes
If map has a wide ramp, the Builder should help wall off but ensure that the tech lab is not exposed. If early tier 1 rush, delay barracks and add additional bunkers. Use the Factory to create add ons. Stop SCV production at 26 for optimal saturation. If minerals are almost mined out, add SCVs to army and sack them (to allow a stronger overall army). If the initial scout SCV was denied, add a Reaper to the build, this may delay the Factory slightly. Add Concussive Shells upgrade if Marauders are added. Upon army reaching max, add reactors and tech labs to all naked barracks.
Opening Game Adjustments
DT rush: Build a turret at ramp and save scans.
Greedy play: Pull SCVs, build offensive bunkers and attack with whole army.
Baneling bust: Make at least 4 marines, extra bunkers and spread marines.
Marine rush: Make at least 4 marines and mass repair the bunker.
Tank rush: Pull scvs, flank from 2 sides and away from chokes.
Early 4 gate: Make at least 4 marines and extra bunkers
Cloak Banshee rush: Build a turret in the mineral lines and save scans.
HTs, Infestors, Archons: Add Marauders, Ghosts and extra Medivacs.
DTs, Phoenix: Add Ghosts.
Late Game Adjustments
Bio player transitions into fully upgraded Sky Terran or Ghost Medivac. Feeder transitions into Mech. Build extra Orbital Commands and sack SCVs for a larger army.
Yeah it's a shame, but the Strategy section of Liquipedia has become outdated. The truth is, the LP content is decided by what the contributors want to put effort in. The focus has pretty much shifted to tournament and player pages. As SC2Toastie said, we need a group of dedicated people to make the Strategy section valuable again. Currently, the updates mainly come from the TL Strategy featured builds, that have been converted to the Liquipedia format.
Anyway, we'll take any help, even if it's just fixing a typo, or adding an small explanation for a build. If you have ideas for a better layout, but you are not Liquipedia-savvy, then you're welcome to make propositions.
I myself am a gold level player, so I can't really write a guide, but I'll gladly help anyone to make a good-looking Liquipedia page. Also, you can join #liquipedia IRC channel on quakenet to get some help from the Liquipedia staff and editors.
Liquipedia:StrategyTemplate?action=submit You can find here the template for a strategy page. Copy this text, and paste it in http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/User:Ovid/Sandbox?action=edit#editform Now you can fill the template with the necessary information. You can use the button [Show Preview] to preview the page without having to commit the changes, and [Save page] when you want to save your work. When the page is good enough, contact a staff member or editor, and we will move it out of your user space, and to the Main space, in the Strategy section.
Also, if you see something interesting on a LP page, and you want to put the same thing in your page, click on the edit button on the top of the page, to see the corresponding wikitext.
I'll try to write a more detailed guide for strategy pages in the next few days. In the meantime, here is a video, even if it's old now, it's great to introduce the first steps:
I've always thought that suggesting pro level (especially tournament) build orders for low level ladder players is a poor way to get better.
I'm actually helping a lower level friend get back into 1v1 and so might consider including my builds (even though they are definitely not "what the pros are doing").
I love liquipedia if even for the simple unit, building and tech tree info it contains. I would be willing to pull build orders from some pro replays, but I am a low league player. Is there any way to create pages in a test environment and get some buy in before posting? Maybe as replies to this thread?
even those out dated builds arent that too far out tho, all the way through wol i used a 1/1 roach . . now apparently its jaedongs gasless roach style in hots.Apart from the addition of new units and improved queen(i dont think they are that out of date tho) they are nearly identical. a good polished BO is a good polished BO . . .so just polish, hell even the 14/14 bane bust still works as the opps know ur going to get the expand anyway its nearly free pressure with shit going on behind it now
On October 26 2013 03:38 MonkeyBot wrote: I love liquipedia if even for the simple unit, building and tech tree info it contains. I would be willing to pull build orders from some pro replays, but I am a low league player. Is there any way to create pages in a test environment and get some buy in before posting? Maybe as replies to this thread?
You can create scetches of pages in your own userspace. After you feel you're ready contact staff members and ask for them to move the page into mainspace of liquipedia. They'll also provide you with improvement suggestions and very likely might polish a detail or two themselves if you ask nicely.
My BO is pretty stiff today - went for a run (no shower) not to mention lots heavy lifting and straining. I would say it has a certain marmoset/herring bouquet. More details to come.
The builds on Liquipedia were checked for obsolescence in Wings of Liberty, but not yet for HoTS. Some Wings of Liberty builds still work in HoTS and others don't. Maybe an obsolescence check on old builds would be a good start.
e.g. WonWonWon variations still work (see WCS games against Scarlett).
e.g. Nexus First versus Terran is too risky in HoTS due to widow mines and more common reaper openings.
But please: Only add progamer builds; or if the builds are your own, only those that are really well thought through, and will stand up to Diamond level play, or, preferrably, better.
Hi Guys. I would like to make a suggestion for your consideration.
I am no where near - and will never be - a diamond level player, thus I find some builds just useless and too difficult to execute correctly and I think maybe its a good idea to add some low level builds orders (for Bronze to Gold) in their as well.
The purpose of these builds are (or should be) mainly for learning / practicing mechanics for us lower leagues (especially when you start out). It helped me greatly improving very fast from Bronze to Gold level play once I came across the link below. It may help someone else as well.
The "Gold Build" works very well at lower levels against T and P (my win rate about 80%), not so well vs early aggression zerg though (about 40% win rate).
I do not see a reason why it should be excluded from the strategy section. Anyway - its your decision.
I have not really searched for T and P threads or links like these, but I will as soon as I get bored with Z.
EPT
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/A8gBt.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wzFno.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/1eAIU.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/7C89O.gif)
Combat Shield completes at 5.30 minutes.![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/kTuCT.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/4tJBr.gif)
1/1 completes at 7:20 minutes.![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/HFGx8.gif)
Stimpack completes at 8:20 minutes![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zGmri.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/LZJ0p.gif)
2/2 completes at 10.30 minutes.![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/wBm9h.gif)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/NlNe6.gif)
3/3 completes at 14 minutes.
Liquipedia:StrategyTemplate?action=submit
