• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:44
CEST 18:44
KST 01:44
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League36Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.164Rollback Netcode in Brood War1345.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 202624Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0
StarCraft 2
General
Stellar Fest 2 Replay Pack SCII needs to put more weight on strategy and tact Terran AddOns placement No more sc2 streamers on team liquid? Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.16
Tourneys
WORTEX Challenger Series — Open SC2 LAN in Budapes RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
Rollback Netcode in Brood War BW General Discussion Mineral gathering rate (boosted) for each patch Making an Online Broodwar Manager Game [Megathread] Daily Funny Videos
Tourneys
[ASL22] Grand Finals [$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Artificial Intelligence Thread US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
How Much Genes Contribute to…
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 10981 users

[D] Marauder hellbat medivac in TvP - Page 5

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
Ozlo
Profile Joined March 2013
United States30 Posts
April 17 2013 14:57 GMT
#81
Full mech can be exploited too easily by Protoss IMO. Especially if he goes void rays.
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
April 17 2013 15:02 GMT
#82
On April 17 2013 23:57 Ozlo wrote:
Full mech can be exploited too easily by Protoss IMO. Especially if he goes void rays.


Have u seen strelok and krass yesterday... its not that easy like just build voids and bo-win... Mech is really impressive and because of drops, terrans know everything u are doing... they just build a thor and vikings..

I am convinced after the EU qualifier and demu/razer strategy mech video that mech is darn strong and because of hellbat/Wm drops can adjust to toss strategy.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Blamajama
Profile Joined September 2010
156 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-19 12:21:28
April 17 2013 15:17 GMT
#83
If there was ever a clumpy unit, it's void rays, and the javelin missles eat them alive. Obviously we know about heat seekers as it is. Honestly, if it just just deathball vs deathball, it's pretty even. Voidray Tempest or immortal achron has no inherent advantage over Thor/Hellbat/Raven with either Ghost or Viking. And it includes the gas dumps that terran bio lacks. That's my composition on small maps with tight chokes.
Ozlo
Profile Joined March 2013
United States30 Posts
April 19 2013 16:58 GMT
#84
I see your point now that I've watched some of the streylock games. In fact, I plan to use streylocks reaper opening to transition to a fast 3 base bio play. In my opinion though, mech, while powerful, is very vulnerable and slow.
Sircoolguy
Profile Joined May 2012
United States81 Posts
April 19 2013 17:44 GMT
#85
So I have done a marauder hellbat medivac push with stim +1 bio weapons and +1 mech weapons. This has worked out quite well and hits around 11 minutes or so. I get a 15 gas and expand into marines with a widow mine or two mostly to deal with oracles. I end up getting 2 rax with tech labs and start a armory as soon as I stop making widow mines. I also add a reactor on the factory as the armory is being built. Usually I can get a third up at a decent time as well as adding on more rax or an extra factory. The push has won me a few games and the composition has help me hold 3gate robo builds, so it is relatively strong. The trickiest thing for me is to deal with MsC harassment but I usually hold off on the first tech lab until I have 6 marines or so, so it can be dealt with.
Hellbat
Profile Joined June 2013
223 Posts
June 23 2013 08:25 GMT
#86
Thanks for the build OP. I was having a lot of trouble with protoss lately, and I love the fact that with Hellbats+Marauders+Medivacs I can tank storms as opposed to having my army be gibbed when I go with more of a marine heavy army.

Depending on how the game goes, I try to slowly work my way up to skyterran. Banshee/Vikings/Ravens with hellbats as mech shields is quite terrific. However, I usually don't even get the opportunity to do that as the marauder/hellbat/medivacs do a damn good job at killing the protoss
Mayhemia-
Profile Joined February 2011
Finland58 Posts
June 23 2013 10:41 GMT
#87
I am wondering if any mid/highmaster player has time to upload couple of replays for people who want to focus on exact timings and builds? VOD's are only so usefull.
LiLSighKoh
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States588 Posts
June 23 2013 10:48 GMT
#88
On June 23 2013 19:41 Mayhemia- wrote:
I am wondering if any mid/highmaster player has time to upload couple of replays for people who want to focus on exact timings and builds? VOD's are only so usefull.

There is VOD of Thorzain using this comp TvP in the 2nd group stage of Dreamhack. I forget who it was against but you should go look around for the dreamhack vod
"Want some? Go get some!"
bypLy
Profile Joined June 2013
757 Posts
June 23 2013 11:28 GMT
#89
On April 17 2013 23:57 Ozlo wrote:
Full mech can be exploited too easily by Protoss IMO. Especially if he goes void rays.


agree, if toss scouts fast its very difficult to do this strat
SalvationII
Profile Joined January 2013
Germany25 Posts
June 23 2013 12:03 GMT
#90
As a high master Protoss, I hate to tell you this, but PLAY IT.
Its so Strong, you need 3 Storms to actually kill smth in this army combo and you can open up with hellbat drops, which are non the less the most efficient way to drop any race.
Mayhemia-
Profile Joined February 2011
Finland58 Posts
June 23 2013 16:41 GMT
#91
On June 23 2013 19:48 LiLSighKoh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 23 2013 19:41 Mayhemia- wrote:
I am wondering if any mid/highmaster player has time to upload couple of replays for people who want to focus on exact timings and builds? VOD's are only so usefull.

There is VOD of Thorzain using this comp TvP in the 2nd group stage of Dreamhack. I forget who it was against but you should go look around for the dreamhack vod


Been there done that, it's against Elfi, and the game is rather awkward imo.
Iron_
Profile Joined April 2010
United States389 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-28 21:41:17
July 28 2013 21:40 GMT
#92
I've been playing this comp since around when this thread started. A few things I've noticed over around 60 ish games. Also, please note that I play more aggressively then roll into this comp (marine drop with hellions threatening, into this comp). This is certainly more robust and easier to use than the traditional mmm.

1) Vs templar first, which usually was the bane of my existence, this strat is very good. Many storms are needed to kill this army. You can perpetually delay his 3rd and just wait outside his nat for him to come fight you.

2) You DO need vikings, but you don't need as many. 4-6 is great. The maraders can help snipe the colossus, and the vikings finish them off.

3) This combo is easier to use mainly because you don't have to spam your marines around like a chicken with it's head cut off during every single engagement.

4) Add a second starport with reactor blind once your third is set up. This way, you can easily mass up some vikings to counter any airtoss shenanigans. Vikings fare decently vs void rays.

5) If they do get the dreaded colossus/storm combo, you still need to engage only in very open areas with a huge surround. If he gets to this revert to the typical drop 2 places etc, but don't engage directly.

6) The counter the this strat is ARCHONS. They MASH hellbats because of the bio tag, and hellbats and maraders don't do jack shit damage to them. It is for this reason that I am not going to start adding ghosts to my combo (previously I just kept them off 3 base, but I'd like to start getting ghosts involved).

7) Ghosts are more intuitive to use in this combo, because you already have a unit that does not stim (Hellbat). So you are only stimming marauders. Not sure exactly why, it just makes it a little easier to use the ghosts.

The bottom line is I'm having a lot more fun playing this combo, because my army is not automatically totally inferior to the protoss army. That always really bothered me and honestly almost made me leave the game.
teuthida
Profile Joined March 2013
United States104 Posts
July 28 2013 23:05 GMT
#93
Those who use this build, I assume you get blue flame after the hellbat nerf. Where do you fit that in timing wise in this build?
Iron_
Profile Joined April 2010
United States389 Posts
July 28 2013 23:30 GMT
#94
Hey Teuthida, Yes blue flame is needed but does not need to be prioritized. My rule of thumb is, get up the infostructure and start your third, then get blue flame. Prioritize +1/+1 and stim ahead of blue flame for sure. Regular hellbats do fine vs the smaller number of zealots you see in the early part of the mid game. You only need blue flame once the zealot counts starts to rise in the later part of the mid game -> late game.
teuthida
Profile Joined March 2013
United States104 Posts
July 28 2013 23:42 GMT
#95
On July 29 2013 08:30 Iron_ wrote:
Hey Teuthida, Yes blue flame is needed but does not need to be prioritized. My rule of thumb is, get up the infostructure and start your third, then get blue flame. Prioritize +1/+1 and stim ahead of blue flame for sure. Regular hellbats do fine vs the smaller number of zealots you see in the early part of the mid game. You only need blue flame once the zealot counts starts to rise in the later part of the mid game -> late game.


Thanks! I'll give this a shot. TvP is my hardest match up so I'm hoping this helps.
tomsKa
Profile Joined July 2012
United States39 Posts
July 29 2013 00:41 GMT
#96
By +1/+1 do you mean infantry weapons and vehicle plating or infantry armor and weapon ups?
Yolo SCV pulls too stronk
Iron_
Profile Joined April 2010
United States389 Posts
July 29 2013 02:31 GMT
#97
I was referring to infantry. Blue flame and +1 armor both happen right about the same time for me, after infostructure is all up already. You really only NEED blue flame once he has chargelots and has over 15 or so, which doesn't happen until at least mid game, maybe mid-late game.
Iron_
Profile Joined April 2010
United States389 Posts
July 29 2013 02:40 GMT
#98
Also, just FYI, my infostructure in mid game is:

4 tech lab rax
1 tech lab factory (for blue flame)
1 reactor factory
1 reactor starport

Then into late game I end up with

8 tech lab rax (I am going to start adding a ghost academy so these are great for ghosts too)
1 tech lab factory
2 reactor factory
2 reactor starport

That info structure is more than you can support if your macro is perfect, but most people are not named Innovation and miss half a round here and there. The extra buildings also help a lot if you trade heavily while maxed and need to pop out a bunch of units fast.

If I do max and end up playing with fire into the late late game, I try to get up another 4-6 rax and 1-2 factory so that I can remax much faster. My goal with this strat though, is to stop his third from ever getting up, so most of my games end before 20 minutes or so.
tomsKa
Profile Joined July 2012
United States39 Posts
July 29 2013 02:45 GMT
#99
Do you really want that many hellbats in your army or do you drop them a lot? And in general how do you deny the third with this comp...

Also don't you want some marine production?
Yolo SCV pulls too stronk
Iron_
Profile Joined April 2010
United States389 Posts
July 29 2013 23:44 GMT
#100
Yes you need a high Hellbat production. One of the main reasons for this, is that they are on the front line with a lower range, so every time you trade you lose more hellbats than marauders. You must be able to replace the hellbats and keep a good hellbat count or zealots will just a move you.

I build zero marines after the opening. This saves combat shield (100/100), and the hellbats are there for the zealots. The only reason for marines at all in mmm is for the zealots anyway. Why make a small pack of units that die instantly to a storm?

Depending on your opening, you either deny the third with brute force, or by dropping the main and sniping it with marauders. I've come to really enjoy 4 marauder drops. They kill buildings quite fast and the toss must respond to it. Also, since it's only 4 units they drop a lot faster than the 8 marines so they can get to work quicker, giving the toss a bit less time to respond.

Depending on the map, you can also simply run in with marauders, snipe the third, and run. If my early harass puts me ahead I literally just camp his nat with my army in a nice concave.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Monday Night Weeklies
01:00
#67
RotterdaM468
TaKeTV 234
TKL 205
IndyStarCraft 167
SteadfastSC95
BRAT_OK 88
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 468
ByuN 256
TKL 205
IndyStarCraft 167
SteadfastSC 95
BRAT_OK 88
Codebar 86
UpATreeSC 77
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 31830
Calm 2273
Shuttle 2203
Jaedong 1503
EffOrt 498
Mini 375
Horang2 366
Soulkey 342
Rush 292
ZerO 269
[ Show more ]
BeSt 196
Soma 165
firebathero 150
ProTech122
Mong 112
hero 95
sorry 74
Killer 72
Barracks 65
Zeus 62
Creator 30
Sexy 27
Terrorterran 25
Trap 23
Hm[arnc] 20
HiyA 19
ToSsGirL 18
soO 16
yabsab 15
scan(afreeca) 13
Sacsri 12
Dota 2
Fuzer 153
Counter-Strike
pashabiceps640
Other Games
B2W.Neo1210
Beastyqt701
Hui .177
Liquid`VortiX157
C9.Mang0141
KnowMe133
QueenE71
ZerO(Twitch)14
fpsfer 1
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV928
League of Legends
• Nemesis5203
• TFBlade307
Other Games
• Shiphtur654
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
18h 16m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 7h
The PondCast
1d 17h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 18h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
2 days
FEL
4 days
FEL
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 22
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
IPSL Winter 2026-27
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Acropolis #5 - GSC
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.