EPTThe HotS Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 99
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IronyDK
Denmark142 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On August 16 2013 12:52 IronyDK wrote: I cannoth fathom how to deal with Voidray Templar. Every single composition that beats voidrays I feel get hard countered by templar. And I really feel clueless. Any tips? Swarmhost/hydra/ling/infestor will smash this composition. | ||
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11B
United States188 Posts
I cannoth fathom how to deal with Voidray Templar. Every single composition that beats voidrays I feel get hard countered by templar. And I really feel clueless. Any tips? Try watching eG.Suppy who generally live streams in the 11pm - 2am PST. He uses Muta's a lot and is well known for his "I'm Coming!!" phrase......which is his Muta / storm dance. Oh yea, he's ranked #1 GM on NA server ^^. But yea, I prefer Muta / Ling /Bling (extremely mobile) vs VR/Templar. take 24 supply of VR (6) and 12 Muta and you'll have about 10 Muta left. Lings/Blings do very well against all Protoss ground, including Archons and in most situations trade evenly or slightly ahead of Colossus (pre +3 attack). And always try and throw in some Infestors. They're just too good not to use (in any MU). | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
On August 16 2013 13:20 blade55555 wrote: Swarmhost/hydra/ling/infestor will smash this composition. To give more information : Launch a wave of locusts to pull back the templars Amove with your hydras against the vray, behind the locust line Fungle fungle fungle ^^ | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
1) Extra queen(s) 2) Spine Crawler(s) 3) Banes 4) Roaches | ||
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CivilAnarchy
United States59 Posts
On August 16 2013 20:46 Salivanth wrote: New Zerg here. Can I defend vs. Reaper/Hellion harass with just Speedlings? If not, which combinations of the following are a good way to defend? Note: This is the standard 4-6 hellion + 2 reaper harass that pro Terrans do all the time. 1) Extra queen(s) 2) Spine Crawler(s) 3) Banes 4) Roaches Yea, as long as you open with an extra queen or two to ensure you have creep spread. As long as you only engage them on creep, you'll be able to defeat the push, provided they're not making like 12-14 hellions. You should try to wall-off at your natural with two evos, your double queen, and a bane nest/spinecrawler/whatever. The real threat of that group of hellions is generally the possibility of it running by, and killing a base worth of drones before you know what hit you. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
On August 14 2013 06:21 11B wrote: Completely untrue. The timing works out that you start your 3rd Hat at or just before 6m and start your 5th Queen at around 6:30-6:45.....in time to defend vs 6 Hellions. And 3 Queens IS quite unusual at the pro-scene because the norm is actually 4. The only pro I can really think of, off the top of my head that used 3 Queens is Stephanao. Here's a link I've posted a few times now showcasing Pro level Z vs T executing the build I've just described. Game is Life vs Jjakji in GSL: you saved ZvT for me!!! thanks so much dude!!! its hilarious how T players dont adapt at all and you can just roll them over. whats especially nice is that its in no way all in since your upgrades arent delayed at all. if T holds i get IP with my +2 +2, 4th base + hive and....6-7 SHs (!!) + 3 spines + few ling bling at 4th which lets me hold the 4th while getting some infestors and very few ultras out + keep up with upgrades. | ||
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ReMinD_
Croatia846 Posts
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Defenestrator
400 Posts
On August 17 2013 01:48 ReMinD_ wrote: What is the correct way to respond to 1-base 4-gate play (+ they block your natural with pylon)? Stalkers + sentries and some zealots in the mix. I started off with 14 pool and 15 hatch, scouted it, but still lost. Kill the pylon with 4 lings. Some players take a 3rd immediately once they're pylon-blocked, but I don't like this in case of a 1-base allin, in which case it's very tough to hold. Once you scout gate-first, throw down gas and mine 100 for ling speed. Drone to about 22, and throw down 3 spines at your nat. Scout with 6-8 lings for forward pylons; if you are able to deny the pylon/probe with lings, that basically stops the 4gate. Personally I also like to add a 3rd queen and hold primarily with spine/ling/queen. If they're delaying the attack, once I have about 20ish speedlings I like to add drones and spines. Once you hit like 5-6 spines there is basically no way they can break you unless your spines are poorly positioned. Other notes are make sure he can't just run up your ramp to your main (block with queen/lings; 3rd queen is very helpful for this). You can also use roach/ling to defend, but this is more susceptible to good forcefields. With the advent of HOTS there is also probably some nice roach burrow defense available, but since 4gate is pretty much out of the meta I haven't seen this. | ||
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Marioff
9 Posts
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11B
United States188 Posts
1. Greed and most optimal: Hatch first 2. Safer: Pool first > Expand 3. Super safe Pool > gas > RW (4-5) > expand With 1 and 2 I prefer to wall off (with 3 you just make roaches/minimal spine to defend as needed while droning), drone drone drone, and at around 6:45-6:50 take 4x gas. The gas timing works so that I'm almost at 2 base mineral saturation when I start them (counting drones morphing from eggs). I like to have 17-18 drones mining per base (plus max gas saturaion). 1st 100g into lair > next 250g into +1/1 > next 100g into Roach speed > and attack with 1/1 and speed somewhere around 110 supply( usually around 32 roaches). Some important timings to keep in mind. A 14 gas, 14 pool > speed > bling opening will have right around 8-10 speedlings to harass you right around 5:00s and the next inject cycle of lings will finish around the same time Blings are available. This means around 5:40 - 5:50s you could be facing 3-5 Blings and 12-16 speedlings. On wide ramp maps (3 evo's 2 Queens to block) it's important to place a creep tumor down at your natural 1st (actually, probably best on maps like Bel'Shir (sp?) too) so your creep spreads in time to wall. Once walled you're free to drone to max saturation. Of course, if they aren't going early aggression just drone up w/out the wall. If they opt for a delayed attack with lings/blings just wall up when you see them coming. Oh yea, I prefer 3 Initial Queens (all before reaching 28 supply) to help defend and block ramps. Plus, Queens are very good and targeting and dealing with Blings in cases that you don't get your wall quite up. And your 3rd base?? Hummmm, off the top of my head, with 17 drones mineral saturation on 2 bases, by the time you hit your 1/1 and about 110 supply you should be floating around 300-500 minerals > so, expand then. Anyways, that's how I prefer to open and play roaches in z vs z. I'd be curious to here others builds and strategy. | ||
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emathey
10 Posts
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11B
United States188 Posts
if T holds i get IP with my +2 +2, 4th base + hive and....6-7 SHs (!!) + 3 spines + few ling bling at 4th which lets me hold the 4th while getting some infestors and very few ultras out + keep up with upgrades. Glad you liked the link! I'll have to try your late game version some time. Seems pretty cool. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
On August 17 2013 07:10 Marioff wrote: How to play mass roaches in ZvZ? (when 3rd and how many drones?) either do a fast 3rd base style: 15p 16h or 15h 16p with 17g 17 ovi as opening first 100 gas lingspeed or banenest depending on opponents opening 2x queens 1 spine once saturated + lingspeed finishes take a 3rd, get +1 +1 and lair. dont saturate 3rd but build pure units once on 2 base saturation. or i think it was snute who goes 2 base fast +1 +1 with RW, 2x evo + queen wall off after opening gasless with 3 or 4 queens +1 spine. with that style you delay your 3rd quite a bit but will be ahead in upgrades. vs mutas you will need to have 2-3 ovis over your 3rd base to poop creep and build spores on them since it often wont be finished. On August 17 2013 14:58 11B wrote: Glad you liked the link! I'll have to try your late game version some time. Seems pretty cool. only try it on small maps like belshir though. on whirldwind you cant do this. i prefer to go just ling bane muta with some infestors on big maps since even ultras are horrible without queen support and mass kiting. i still dont get why people go so ultra heavy lategame TvZ. 3 mines = 6 supply = ultra and damagewise even without splash the mines almost kill the ultra. ultras without transfuses are bad imo so on big maps just go 20-30 mutas + some infestors instead of SHs into ultras. | ||
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DarKcS
Australia1237 Posts
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Destruktor
Spain60 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On August 17 2013 20:10 Destruktor wrote: Hey guys! Can I stop mass voids with hidras + infestors ( to FG)? Or maybe another composition? Thanks in advanced Hydra/swarmhost/ultra/infestor is really strong versus that kind of play, or just hydra/swarmhost/infestor. | ||
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Kisezik
Australia70 Posts
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willstertben
427 Posts
On August 17 2013 23:44 Kisezik wrote: is it okay to drone scout in zvp nowadays so you can 15 hatch vs a gate expand or nexus first? otherwise throw down a 15 pool versus a forge exp? i think its a great idea to drone scout in both zvp and zvt in hots, cause you can exploit some things with 3 hatch before pool and won't die vs proxies. | ||
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Mvrio
689 Posts
my question is whats a build order to get there or better yet how do I keep myself safe enough to rush to hydra and be able to pull out with a good enough sized army until a push from P comes. also when would a immo/sentry push timing come? or any other typical P push? | ||
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