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Reithan
United States360 Posts
On March 19 2013 22:11 c0ldfusion wrote: ling, bane and mutas guys. Fastest zerg army. Spread out your ovies so you get more time to react. Fastest zerg army still slower than medivacs and hellions... | ||
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Reithan
United States360 Posts
ZvT: 5:20 mines at natural + marines into hellbat/thor/tank/mine...what do I do with this? ZvT: 5:20 Hellions at natural into mass hellion/hellbat + drops everywhere...how the...? | ||
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Tikihut
United States10 Posts
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SK
France11 Posts
Former eu diamond now temporary plat in hots. Against FFE and any other kind of FE (In ZvP) I'm opening with a standard 3 bases except i take 2 gas at 5min then 2 more between 6.00 and 6.30. I'm skipping the roach warren except if the opponent is going mass speedlots to get more drones and a quicker hydra den. I kinda skip the macro hatch too because i don't really think it's needed due to the hydra cost and I'm usually kinda good with injects. I can't possibly max at 12 but I've got a force with 15 to 20 range (+later speed) hydra + lots of speedlings with +1 armor soon enough to crush any good'old immortal/sentry all in or expo build. AFAIK it works well and kinda counter any air opening too but being down a rank I'm not sure it can *really* work against diam/master ppl I was usually meeting in WoL. (ofc if i scout a 2 base colo build I will switch to roach / corruptor but it's not really the point here) The general idea for the mid/last game is: - against any ground : uses hydra/ling to kill the P push or fast third while teching to a ultra(2-4) / hydra(0-2) / cracklings / errrr.... flying caster thingy max at around 16 with 4 bases. Using the hydra to harass / delay the toss as much as possible meanwhile. I tend to take my infestation pit *very* early (usually a few seconds after the hydra den) so i can upgrade to T3 asap but i'm not sure it's really safe if the P commit to an all in. - against air : I'm not really sure, i've yet to meet a toss able to use air correctly tbh. Going to infestor / corruptor / ultra (with the kept hydra from initial buildup) and finish the game as quickly as possible or at least contain the P on 3 bases max (the third being delayed as long as possible) while mass expanding for gas myself seems good but it really depends on his air compo. Against mass void i'd get more infestors and hydra and forget about corruptors for example. Can any master/gm give me any pro / cons and things to look for about this opening ? (i can detail things much more and post replay/bo if needed as I am skipping details about upgrades timing and so on to keep things short). | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On March 20 2013 09:35 Tikihut wrote: In late game zvt do you guys prefer transitioning to ultra/ling/viper or ultra/ling/infestor? I see pros using the viper but i see more advantages using the infestor. Any response would be greatly appreciated. imo infestors are better unless they have a high tank count. Then you would want vipers. I find infestors better and then eventually getting both is super good late game zvt. | ||
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Northern_iight
Canada363 Posts
I proceed to 14 pool but before pool even finishes he builds a gateway and cannon. What should I do? Pull drones? turtle and get roach or lings to bust the contain? He cancels the gateway when I pull my 4 drones back and just leaves 2 cannons to disrupt my build while he takes his nat. Masters zerg | ||
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kernel_mode
Russian Federation5 Posts
Link on another replay. ZvT (Veteran AI), I lost again. What I've done wrong? As protoss, I had no problems defeating veteran AI. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/37488240/hots-zerg-veteran-ai.SC2Replay | ||
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Deign85
United States13 Posts
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Savant.GL
Germany502 Posts
On March 21 2013 01:38 Deign85 wrote: I absolutely hate ling bling micro in ZvZ and want to find a way out of this meta. Has anyone tried taking burrow instead of ling speed? Effectively creating baneling mines that can kill off tons of zerglings without the hectic micro. I would think that after a couple of good baneling mines your opponent would eventually have to concede this aggression or risk falling very far behind. I haven't tried this yet, and want to try it later on with a practice partner this evening, but wanted to throw it out there and hear opinions on it. It is basically impossible to be aggressive without ling speed, you have to make banelings and get burrow whilst your opponent can feel happy just droning away because he knows you can't pressure. | ||
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kernel_mode
Russian Federation5 Posts
On March 21 2013 01:32 kernel_mode wrote: Link on another replay. ZvT (Veteran AI), I lost again. What I've done wrong? As protoss, I had no problems defeating veteran AI. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/37488240/hots-zerg-veteran-ai.SC2Replay Managed to win ZvZ veteran AI, but that game was so strange. I don't even know why I won... Replay: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/37488240/hots-zerg-veteran-ai-won.SC2Replay ZvZ, veteran AI -> lost again  Replay: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/37488240/hots-zerg-veteran-ai-loss.SC2Replay It would be great if someone will give me an advice. | ||
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Deign85
United States13 Posts
On March 21 2013 01:42 Savant.GL wrote: It is basically impossible to be aggressive without ling speed, you have to make banelings and get burrow whilst your opponent can feel happy just droning away because he knows you can't pressure. Yea, well...my problem is I don't want to pressure. I want to drone up. I just don't like ling baneling crap, so if I can transition out of it before my opponent, doesn't that put me ahead? | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On March 21 2013 02:36 Deign85 wrote: Yea, well...my problem is I don't want to pressure. I want to drone up. I just don't like ling baneling crap, so if I can transition out of it before my opponent, doesn't that put me ahead? Getting burrowed banelings doesn't mean you transition out of the ling/bane phase earlier. Your economy is the biggest driver over whether you can transition out. To that point, burrow doesn't let you drone up any harder than baneling nest by itself. The lack of speed limits your ability to use your excess lings for counterattacks if you get a nice baneling shot off. Outside of gold league you dont see players A-move theirs lings and banes in a big clump. If you watch top level ZvZ you will see banelings split up in pairs and sent to your mineral line and move zerglings in afterwards. Do you explode the banelings on their banelings or let them past to get free shots onyour workers. Well hard to kill off a large number of lings when you are forced to trade your burrowed banes for only 2 of theirs. In the end it is still ling/bane wars. Also it is a really big assumption to think that a big baneling blast will stop ling/bane agression. It might, or It could force them double down and allin harder since they know they are behind. | ||
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Deign85
United States13 Posts
On March 21 2013 04:15 MstrJinbo wrote: Getting burrowed banelings doesn't mean you transition out of the ling/bane phase earlier. Your economy is the biggest driver over whether you can transition out. To that point, burrow doesn't let you drone up any harder than baneling nest by itself. The lack of speed limits your ability to use your excess lings for counterattacks if you get a nice baneling shot off. Outside of gold league you dont see players A-move theirs lings and banes in a big clump. If you watch top level ZvZ you will see banelings split up in pairs and sent to your mineral line and move zerglings in afterwards. Do you explode the banelings on their banelings or let them past to get free shots onyour workers. Well hard to kill off a large number of lings when you are forced to trade your burrowed banes for only 2 of theirs. In the end it is still ling/bane wars. Also it is a really big assumption to think that a big baneling blast will stop ling/bane agression. It might, or It could force them double down and allin harder since they know they are behind. I suppose this is all true. I just wanted to try and find a way to have more effective baneling blasts so that I don't need to create as many lings and therefore be able to create more drones and econ harder. | ||
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Essau
United States47 Posts
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Diddywhop
United States42 Posts
On March 21 2013 05:36 Essau wrote: What's the proper army comp to deal with mid game immortal/storm pushes? I had roach/hydra/swarm hosts but got crushed.... wasn't even close and we both were 2/1 upgrades. I was 24 army supply ahead. Thats not a horrible composition to have there. It might of been controlled wrong. Do you have the replay? Might of needed more swarm hosts? I'd like to see the replay. I was a zerg who struggled with Immortal pushes in WOL. I find swarm hosts make my life so much easier in that regard. | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On March 21 2013 05:36 Essau wrote: What's the proper army comp to deal with mid game immortal/storm pushes? I had roach/hydra/swarm hosts but got crushed.... wasn't even close and we both were 2/1 upgrades. I was 24 army supply ahead. You must have messed up your control. Swarmhost/roach/hydra deals with storm/immortal really really well. It's like the best counter to it (other then broods obviously). Make sure to keep swarmhosts back and to spread your units when engaging so that he can't storm everything, pull back so storm doesn't kill your roach/hydra and swarmhosts should do a lot of damage. Make sure you have 12-14 swarmhosts, if you only had 5-7 I can understand why you lost the engagement. | ||
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frontstab
Canada51 Posts
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Diddywhop
United States42 Posts
I find that I don't really play with a build order (past basic mu openings) and go off feel. Is that hurting me? If not, do you guys have any suggestions? I will submit replays when I get off work. I haven't noticed much of a skill gap from the leap to high diamond to masters, until I start playing top 25s. After that, the leap is somewhat considerable. I hear it even gets worse when you get closer to top 8. Thanks | ||
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ZebraT
United Kingdom11 Posts
Replays: http://drop.sc/311754 & http://drop.sc/311755 | ||
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