|
Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. |
On June 15 2015 10:37 Grizvok wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 09:55 Comogury wrote:
When going normal barracks builds, around when should I add my 4th and 5th, then 6th, 7th, etc.. barracks? Really depends on what you are doing and in what match up you are playing. We need more information. The easy answer is: when your economy dictates you add these extra production facilities. There is more than just one "normal barracks builds." That's called bio and it can be done dozens of ways.
How many can you support off 1, 2, 3 bases while still getting upgrades and factory/starport units? I'm just looking for generally how many you should have.
|
How many can you support off 1, 2, 3 bases while still getting upgrades and factory/starport units? I'm just looking for generally how many you should have.
Off 1 base you are generally more concerned with expanding than building more rax. With 2 bases 5 rax is the cap - but often players stick with 3 until they get their 3rd CC. 8 rax is the common amount for 3 bases, with more only being added if you have a bank. Really feel free to add extra production to spend your money, but 5/8 rax for 2/3 bases is a good guideline.
|
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4)
|
On June 16 2015 20:04 Pnissen wrote:
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4)
I have the same vetos. The other maps are all okay imo
|
On June 16 2015 20:26 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 20:04 Pnissen wrote:
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4) I have the same vetos. The other maps are all okay imo
Ok did you put any thought into why u did those vetoes and whats your league if I may ask?
|
On June 16 2015 20:31 Pnissen wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 20:26 Charoisaur wrote:On June 16 2015 20:04 Pnissen wrote:
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4) I have the same vetos. The other maps are all okay imo Ok did you put any thought into why u did those vetoes and whats your league if I may ask?
backdoor rock immortal allins on expedition lost are pretty broken and ling/zealot runbys in general are extremely annoying.
So hard to constantly run between between your third and your main to deflect the harass.
Inferno pools is just a terrible map which most players have voted. I'm master terran.
|
On June 16 2015 20:56 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 20:31 Pnissen wrote:On June 16 2015 20:26 Charoisaur wrote:On June 16 2015 20:04 Pnissen wrote:
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4) I have the same vetos. The other maps are all okay imo Ok did you put any thought into why u did those vetoes and whats your league if I may ask? backdoor rock immortal allins on expedition lost are pretty broken and ling/zealot runbys in general are extremely annoying. So hard to constantly run between between your third and your main to deflect the harass. Inferno pools is just a terrible map which most players have voted. I'm master terran.
Ok cool Im masters too. Looking at my map stats Echo LE is my worst not counting the vetoed maps with 43 % win rate. Cactus Valley being the only other map in the negative with 46%. I'll probably just keep the 2 vetoed and pay attention to why Im loosing on Echo.
|
On June 16 2015 21:08 Pnissen wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 20:56 Charoisaur wrote:On June 16 2015 20:31 Pnissen wrote:On June 16 2015 20:26 Charoisaur wrote:On June 16 2015 20:04 Pnissen wrote:
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4) I have the same vetos. The other maps are all okay imo Ok did you put any thought into why u did those vetoes and whats your league if I may ask? backdoor rock immortal allins on expedition lost are pretty broken and ling/zealot runbys in general are extremely annoying. So hard to constantly run between between your third and your main to deflect the harass. Inferno pools is just a terrible map which most players have voted. I'm master terran. Ok cool Im masters too. Looking at my map stats Echo LE is my worst not counting the vetoed maps with 43 % win rate. Cactus Valley being the only other map in the negative with 46%. I'll probably just keep the 2 vetoed and pay attention to why Im loosing on Echo.
I'm only diamond, but I keep Expedition Lost even if I don't do my usual builds on it. For Z I go wether :
- proxy reaper with rax lifted inside the main Sorry vs Curious in SPL round 2
- 1 rax expand into quick third CC into mech (mech is surprisingly good on this map) Maru vs Life SPL round 2 playofff
- or even CC first into standard bio Dream vs Life SPL round 3
These builds are actually very fun to play and powerful which is a good reason to me to not veto EL. vs P on the other hand, aside the immortal bust, the map is totally ok cause it's at least as hard for the protoss to defend harrass than it is for the terran (the map is played much less by protoss in SPL, I would guess that it is often vetoed by protosses on the ladder too)
About Echo I also don't like it because of the base set up and that dead space behind the 4th where muta can just snipe everything for free, but also because it's very linear and repetitive to play, and I'm usually not good when I'm bored 
|
Hi I posted this here a while ago but no one responded. Could someone answer my questions pls?
Hi I'm a mid-high gold terran. In tvz I always go 14cc into 1-1-1 with reactored hellions and a cloaked banshee. It seems that whenever zergs scout my cc first, they make a bunch of lings and deny my natural while starting a baneling nest. I am able to hold with hellions, marines, and the banshee taking minimal losses but I am forced to play from behind and defensive for fear of a follow-up attack. I usually drop my bunker around 23 supply and only have 2 marines until my hellions pop.
Another issue I've been having is when I'm playing from behind from the situation described above and the zerg goes very baneling heavy while waiting or skipping on upgrades. My standard setup is 5 rax (3 reactor 2 tech lab), reactored factory, reactored starport and I go for a bio mine composition. Later I add on 3 rax and another factory for thors. Some although not all of the times the zerg has very little or no anti-air (aside from queens). I cannot deal with the baneling heavy composition as my splits are decent at best and I have trouble positioning and burrowing my mines(they also send single zerglings to bait mine shots but I'm afraid to unburrow the mines because the zerg could attack and kill the mines). Should I switch to tank production when this happens? What else should I do to counter this?
In tvt, I do innovation's marine hellion expand from imbabuilds. How do I scout a tank drop or a double tank drop if they wall off their base so I can't get in. Should I scan? Also, I always have trouble knowing where the drop is going to land. In my natural, main or they siege up in front on the low ground. I pull scvs but it doesn't always work.
My last question is regarding tvp. I do a reaper expand into a second rax with tech lab for stim, factory, starport for medivacs and then 3 rax(bomber's build on imbabuilds). I push out once I have my (2) medivacs and try to pressure the toss. If I want to do damage to the toss or straight up kill them (because I don't want to play vs. a toss past 3 bases) should I charge the natural and try to kill the army (usually with one or two colossi) or drop and do a two-pronged attack?
Thanks
|
Hi I'm a mid-high gold terran. In tvz I always go 14cc into 1-1-1 with reactored hellions and a cloaked banshee. It seems that whenever zergs scout my cc first, they make a bunch of lings and deny my natural while starting a baneling nest. I am able to hold with hellions, marines, and the banshee taking minimal losses but I am forced to play from behind and defensive for fear of a follow-up attack. I usually drop my bunker around 23 supply and only have 2 marines until my hellions pop.
you aren't really behind when you clear out his lings with minimal losses. Remember the zerg has to sacrifice drones if he invests into many zerglings. Just wait until you have 4-6 hellions and then retake mapcontrol.
Another issue I've been having is when I'm playing from behind from the situation described above and the zerg goes very baneling heavy while waiting or skipping on upgrades. My standard setup is 5 rax (3 reactor 2 tech lab), reactored factory, reactored starport and I go for a bio mine composition. Later I add on 3 rax and another factory for thors. Some although not all of the times the zerg has very little or no anti-air (aside from queens). I cannot deal with the baneling heavy composition as my splits are decent at best and I have trouble positioning and burrowing my mines(they also send single zerglings to bait mine shots but I'm afraid to unburrow the mines because the zerg could attack and kill the mines). Should I switch to tank production when this happens? What else should I do to counter this?
I recommend playing bio hellbat thor. It's easier to micro since you don't have to focus on anything else than splitting and in gold league most players blow up their banelings on the thors. Also zerglings just melt to BF hellbats.
Tanks are generally bad vs zerg because they are so immobile and can be abused by the more mobile ling bane muta compositions. also when he transitions to vipers your tanks become dead supply.
In tvt, I do innovation's marine hellion expand from imbabuilds. How do I scout a tank drop or a double tank drop if they wall off their base so I can't get in. Should I scan? Also, I always have trouble knowing where the drop is going to land. In my natural, main or they siege up in front on the low ground. I pull scvs but it doesn't always work.
If you don't reaper expand you should always scan at the time your second orbital is finished.
Still, it's sometimes hard to tell if he will drop you or not. If you let his drop in you can be in a bad spot but with pulling scvs immediately and trying to kill his forces you should be able to clean his drop out.
My last question is regarding tvp. I do a reaper expand into a second rax with tech lab for stim, factory, starport for medivacs and then 3 rax(bomber's build on imbabuilds). I push out once I have my (2) medivacs and try to pressure the toss. If I want to do damage to the toss or straight up kill them (because I don't want to play vs. a toss past 3 bases) should I charge the natural and try to kill the army (usually with one or two colossi) or drop and do a two-pronged attack?
You should never try to kill his army directly with your stim timing. The goal is to keep him on two bases for as long as possible and trying to do damage where you can. Some multiprong aggression can be good but don't overcommit your army until you have a big advantage.
|
There is one particular TvZ style that I have no idea how to play against. Zergs that skip mutas (or at least delay them) and go mass ling bane after taking their fourth. This just completely shuts down the first push and thus the parade push is basically over. so what do i do if i can identify this? i guess i just stay defensive while doing some drops since there are no mutas yet?
|
You can't really identify it until after it happens, unless you get lucky with a scan or get aggressive with banshees. Take a third and take cost effective trades by doing, as you mentioned, dropping, and using medivac pickup to get free trades.
|
In TvZ Mech how do you pressure the Zerg player? I find that hellion/banshee is easily deflected by queens and a few lings, he can still drone up quite fast and you delay your own third. If you commit to heavier attack lets say hellbat/banshee you can get counter attacked by mass roach and banshees takes forever to kill roaches.
Basically is there any pressure build that forces Zerg to not drone, while still make you safe against counter attacks?
|
I was wondering which maps you guys would recommend vetoing for mostly bio play? At the moment I veto Inferno Pools and Expedition Lost, but I didnt put much thought into it besides that I really dont like playing on them for some reason.
Map pool:
Coda LE (2)
Echo LE (2)
Expedition Lost (2)
Vaani Research Station (2)
Cactus Valley LE (4)
Inferno Pools (4)
Iron Fortress LE (4)
Hi,
I'm a terrbile Terran player but, I veto expedition lost because the minerals are messed up... even with stacking it takes 2+ seconds to put down buildings vses other maps. I keep inferno pools because its a crazy Terran favored map. I veto cactus valley because I don't play mech and it has a lot of chokes that can be abused by protoss and mech players alike. I veto iron fortress because the far away third encourages all ins from zerg which I can hold but its hard to come back in the game when your third is so far and very exposed....
|
In TvZ Mech how do you pressure the Zerg player? I find that hellion/banshee is easily deflected by queens and a few lings, he can still drone up quite fast and you delay your own third. If you commit to heavier attack lets say hellbat/banshee you can get counter attacked by mass roach and banshees takes forever to kill roaches.
Basically is there any pressure build that forces Zerg to not drone, while still make you safe against counter attacks?
Its funny when you are asking this question you gave part of the answer in your opening part of your post.... Your hellbat banshee can deflect and defeat roaches ezily in smaller numbers. Your use of banshees is extremely critical to put pressure on your opponent and make a good scout on what your opponent is actually doing. If you see that your opponent is going roach play and is going for a hard counter roach push back to you #1 you should be looking for those signs when you are aggressive on their side of the map IE roach warren 2 gas and no evo chambers 4 queens at most (2 spreading creep 2 at home) whilst they are taking a 3rd that they don't saturate you should get out tanks and wall off and don't land your third until you have enough tanks / hellbat to deal with the threat without being behind a wall.
EDIT: Your hellbat banshee damage will depend on your control and your multitasking. Sorry needed to add it also depends on your strategy of attack and the timings of how you attack each area IE the 3rd and Main etc....
|
There is one particular TvZ style that I have no idea how to play against. Zergs that skip mutas (or at least delay them) and go mass ling bane after taking their fourth. This just completely shuts down the first push and thus the parade push is basically over. so what do i do if i can identify this? i guess i just stay defensive while doing some drops since there are no mutas yet?
#1 is identifying this attack if you know it is coming which trying to claim watchtower being active on the map with a drop at the 10:30 min mark you see the spire is late and it looks like they are gearing up for a big attack then the biggest thing depends on the map if you have a wide open area between your third and nat its going to be hard to hold this attack but you have to build 3-4 bunkers and have a couple widow mines and make sure your bunkers are far apart enough so that bane splash doesn't hit more than 1 bunker at a time. If you hold this attack with most of your army in tact you can auto win with a counter attack more times than not
|
So I know it might be funny but how do you stop proxy tempest ? I am top 3 master on eu and I lose to it everytime. I stop the first oracle and then what ? It can be really though to know if he's producing more voidrays, going for blink or teching to tempest.
Also if I go factory into mines, the oracle just detects them and its 0% cost efficient.
And if I go 3 rax, I find myself unable to reach the tempest and the protoss is just free to shoot at me with revelation.
I feel bad because it's like everyone is saying it's a bad strategy but i don't know how to stop it.
|
If it makes you feel any better, Classic recent beat Dream with it. So it's not only you ! ;-)
I have no idea how to beat it. Maybe try to get vikings out, and with repair you can nibble at the tempests without losing your vikings ? I don't know really...
On June 21 2015 21:53 Nesnow wrote:
So I know it might be funny but how do you stop proxy tempest ? I am top 3 master on eu and I lose to it everytime. I stop the first oracle and then what ? It can be really though to know if he's producing more voidrays, going for blink or teching to tempest.
Also if I go factory into mines, the oracle just detects them and its 0% cost efficient.
And if I go 3 rax, I find myself unable to reach the tempest and the protoss is just free to shoot at me with revelation.
I feel bad because it's like everyone is saying it's a bad strategy but i don't know how to stop it.
|
On June 22 2015 01:39 LoneYoShi wrote:If it makes you feel any better, Classic recent beat Dream with it. So it's not only you ! ;-) I have no idea how to beat it. Maybe try to get vikings out, and with repair you can nibble at the tempests without losing your vikings ? I don't know really... Show nested quote +On June 21 2015 21:53 Nesnow wrote:
So I know it might be funny but how do you stop proxy tempest ? I am top 3 master on eu and I lose to it everytime. I stop the first oracle and then what ? It can be really though to know if he's producing more voidrays, going for blink or teching to tempest.
Also if I go factory into mines, the oracle just detects them and its 0% cost efficient.
And if I go 3 rax, I find myself unable to reach the tempest and the protoss is just free to shoot at me with revelation.
I feel bad because it's like everyone is saying it's a bad strategy but i don't know how to stop it.
When I see Rotti lose to it on stream, it's against Terrans who accept taking losses but just delay until stim and medivacs and then just float their main away little by little and take random bases across the map. Because once you have stim and medivacs, Protoss can never kill your army, he can never kill one of your bases if it's not very close to him, and he can never easily take more than 1 base because he has only tempests.
Of course, the problem with doing the above is it's very difficult to judge how much is worth spending to delay the tempests without over committing or under committing. and letting Protoss kill you.
|
So I know it might be funny but how do you stop proxy tempest ? I am top 3 master on eu and I lose to it everytime. I stop the first oracle and then what ? It can be really though to know if he's producing more voidrays, going for blink or teching to tempest.
Also if I go factory into mines, the oracle just detects them and its 0% cost efficient.
And if I go 3 rax, I find myself unable to reach the tempest and the protoss is just free to shoot at me with revelation.
I feel bad because it's like everyone is saying it's a bad strategy but i don't know how to stop it.
I've had a GM do this to me but he kept me pinned with it though I was able to get out vikings and Stimmed marines by the time I had Stimmed marines he already had 2 colo. Game didn't end well LOL He was to cost efficient in trades in the beginning to where I couldn't break out at any point. So the game spiraled out of control. My only thought was to get Ravens afterward like 1-2 and try to get some type of critical mass of vikings / marines and marauder but nothing working per say hahaha
Edit: If anyone does have really good advice on this I would definitely like to know as well
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
