EPTAs Protoss, after TheStaircase would you recommend learning 3-4 standard-safe builds (to defend cheese) as well as 1-3 cheeses? Like, should I learn the four builds on your YT channel and 4gate (I already know 4gate)?
[G] TheStaircase - An Alternative Improvement Method - Pag…
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ObeseZealot
United States5 Posts
As Protoss, after TheStaircase would you recommend learning 3-4 standard-safe builds (to defend cheese) as well as 1-3 cheeses? Like, should I learn the four builds on your YT channel and 4gate (I already know 4gate)? | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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ObeseZealot
United States5 Posts
On JuNe 28 2014 01:40 JaKaTaK wrote: As Protoss I'd say learn a 2 Gas Core expand for all matchups and just vary the # of workers in Gas for w/e you need. Also pick 1 Cheese. 2 gate prOxy/cannon rush/4 gate are all good options. Remeber the key to improvement it reducing variance and increasing repetition. I'm sorry but could you give me an example of a 2 Gas Core expand? I'm doing a bunch of research and I can't figure out which build to pick. Thank you. | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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AzhiDahaka
Canada4 Posts
I'm planning to learn the StairCase for each race as a basic way to get accustomed to how they play and decide which I plan to stick with. I'm doing Terran right now, and it's a lot of fun. I'm in Plat on step #2 (so basic units+gas for upgrades). TvT and TvP aren't a lot of fun, since I have no way to deal with splash damage once it shows up. TvZ is fun though, good opportunity to work on my splits! I'm pretty sure doing this for Zerg will be super hard to actually win games with until the later steps. Anyway, thanks for making this available, I appreciate it! | ||
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OneBaseKing
Afghanistan412 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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UW_Meatshield
6 Posts
I think there's nothing better than getting the basic mechanics down before strategy arrives. Only then can you actually begin to consider strategy. Day9 says it, you've said it, and I've heard about 4 of the pros during their tutoring sessions say it. Props on you, sir. | ||
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OneBaseKing
Afghanistan412 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
It'll work, but I wouldn't spend a whole lot of time on it. Use your own judgement when to move on to the next step and then get into learning one build for each matchup. @UW Glad to help. And I'm especially glad that you're introducing your friends to Starcraft! We need more people like you!! | ||
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Hot_Ice
139 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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arho
2 Posts
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ZedraC
South Africa109 Posts
For some reason, after doing Creep or Die, when I completed my placement matches, I got into silver. 24 hours passed since then, now I have the third rank in silver ladder. The only major problem that I have now is "Spending Skill" and APM. It's like I totally forget what I should be doing 10+ mins in. Anyways, great guide, helped me a lot. I find the same on Zerg Step 1. Since Zerglings are SO cheap, spending all that money is a major problem with the little larva you get. Obviously we have to add a bunch of hatches and macro hatches and injecting queens.... I still want to experiment and see how many macro hatches you need on 3 saturated bases.... Think its at least 3 macro hatches, thus 6 in total injecting hatches. | ||
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arho
2 Posts
On July 25 2014 20:26 ZedraC wrote: I find the same on Zerg Step 1. Since Zerglings are SO cheap, spending all that money is a major problem with the little larva you get. Obviously we have to add a bunch of hatches and macro hatches and injecting queens.... I still want to experiment and see how many macro hatches you need on 3 saturated bases.... Think its at least 3 macro hatches, thus 6 in total injecting hatches. The main problem is that if you want to have a chance, you need a ton of zerglings and you'll end up with empty second hatch since you need to spam zerglings to make sure he really doesn't get enough time to upgrade and kill you (and he eventually will if he doesn't gg early). You'll also end up with a lot of minerals in bank, which is... bad. Still, I think it's really helpful for starters since he wants you to go slowly increase the things that you should "worry" about, that "Don't look at fights" part is also pretty good, he wants you to not forget that you have a base and the production shouldn't really stop. | ||
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DrTrouserPlank
United Kingdom1 Post
I am improving my spending and managing to be low on minerals a lot of the time; building and saturating new command centers and minimising supply cappage. The problem comes when I hit my supply limit and then my banked minerals skyrockets and throws my average off a lot. For example, at 18min I had about 900 minerals having hit the supply cap a little earlier; at 23 minutes (when the game ended) I had 6500. My collection rate was about 1600/minute. I am playing against the AI and I usually allow myself to amass a decent force before I send them off, partly so that I'm not rushing the AI and it gg's before I've even started to expand and actually spend enough to get a decent idea of how I'm doing. Maybe I am waiting too long and should send them off earlier to help keep some supply available so that I can continue to spend on units etc. | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
Just attack earlier, an 23 minute game is well beyond average. To avoid your problem, just attack before you get maxed, or leave the game when you get maxed and make a little challenge for yourself to see the fastest time you can get maxed on each map | ||
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Socup
190 Posts
Is it correct to assume that the steps 1-6 after ggtracker and the benchmarks to meet or exceed belong within those steps, such as meeting certain league benchmarks after completing a game of "click attack only on the minimap"? | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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Socup
190 Posts
I've got a question about the base saturation badges, though. ForGG is a GM player, but his base saturation badges are often bronze because gameplay doesn't work like 10 minute no rush. Is it just meant to track how efficiently you can saturate if you have no pressure or timing attack builds going? On July 27 2014 19:24 DrTrouserPlank wrote: I'm really having trouble getting my spending skill to go up much as far a rank goes in step 1 and it's basically for the following reason. I am improving my spending and managing to be low on minerals a lot of the time; building and saturating new command centers and minimising supply cappage. The problem comes when I hit my supply limit and then my banked minerals skyrockets and throws my average off a lot. For example, at 18min I had about 900 minerals having hit the supply cap a little earlier; at 23 minutes (when the game ended) I had 6500. My collection rate was about 1600/minute. I am playing against the AI and I usually allow myself to amass a decent force before I send them off, partly so that I'm not rushing the AI and it gg's before I've even started to expand and actually spend enough to get a decent idea of how I'm doing. Maybe I am waiting too long and should send them off earlier to help keep some supply available so that I can continue to spend on units etc. I think it's less about what you get as a badge and more about mechanically learning how to macro well. But if it were me and I needed the badge I want, I'd hit sooner and get the game over, or I'd build more production buildings, more hatch/nex/CC, more (redundant) supply depots, etc. If the goal is to manage your money after maxing, then you want to start making more stuff so that you're safer from counter attacks (via supply block or lost production buildings/lost CCs, etc), or so that you can remax faster after an army wipe. It's basically baseline stuff. I don't know if any of you have played the Armored Core series, but its giant robots that you use about 20 different stats per arm/leg/jetpack/engine/radiator/etc and attempt to "build order" a mech out of. Pretty fun game for a min/max type of person, and basically a system of building to counter specific other builds, etc, like sc2. Anyway, in one of the last PS2 versions, Nine Breaker, they had a massive battery of tests you could run. From Simple Fire Control System selection to target quickly and accurately, to shooting through moving targets or moving while shooting, and then additional layers of complex control and fire behavior. The point of that system happens to be how pretty much everything is learned "well". You break all of the goals down into specific little blocks, learn that block until you have a thorough skill in it, and then go to the next block. In doing that, you can put it all together in the end to simultaneously perform all the complex actions you need to win. The Staircase basically seems like this. It's smart, and it's realistic if you want to get better. Pro's play the micro/marine split arcade for a good reason. Staircase seems like it can also give a good foundation for understanding build orders and why they work (or dont sometimes). When you practice spending money, if you have the wrong facilities to spend your income with, you can float upwards in gas or minerals. A build order is designed to maximize units or tech for a goal, while minimizing excess that is wasted time and economic losses comparable to your opponent who is able to perfectly spend it all. | ||
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