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[G] TheCore - Advanced Keyboard Layout - Page 308

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Coffey
Profile Joined November 2013
United States15 Posts
January 08 2014 05:02 GMT
#6141
KonungrJoe ,
I currently use the orbweaver for ZRM and it works fine. You have 20 buttons on the main pad, 3 thumb modifier buttons. I ended up going with "Ctrl" on the thumb button on my mouse as a modifier. With the Orbweaver, it's possible to use the 8 directional pad as a button, but it's more difficult to hit two buttons, such as "Ctrl+shift" with one thumb on the orbweaver due to it's nature. You can kind of mash the D-pad left, and the top thumb button at the same time if you prefer, but here is my layout with the Orbweaver and ZRM. Works great for me, it will take some getting used to, but it's well worth it. It feels more natural to me vs TheCore on a keyboard, but not everyone can afford a $130 toy just to try it out.
So for the main part of the pad, you have buttons 1-20
1 = 6
2 = 7
3 = 8
4 = 9
5 = -

6 = y
7 = u
8 = i
9 = o
10 = p

11 = h
12 = j
13 = k
14 = l
15 = ; (semicolon)

16 = n
17 = m
18 = , (comma)
19 = . (period)
20 = /

Now you have three additional buttons.
The top button = shift
the 8 directional pad = alt (bind all 8 directional buttons to "alt") That way just pushing it any direction will be "alt".
the bottom thumb button = space (believe it is that by default)

Important to bind "Ctrl" to your mouse to where it's easily accessible. If not, you may have to modify the orbweaver layout to your liking.

This however, is only half of the equation, because now you need the key layout for SC2 for each of the commands.
I pretty much downloaded ZRM and modified it so that it would fit the orbweaver better. So go with the defaults that ZRM comes with, and that layout will be fine. I changed "Set camera" 4 - 7 to buttons 16 through 19 on the orbweaver. Also note that in the normal layout, you require the modifier "alt" to SET a camera position, and "Shift" to GO TO that position. So you would use the 8 directional pad (alt) and buttons 12-19 (excluding button 15) to set 7 different camera locations. You would use the top thumb button "Shift" and the same exact buttons 12-19 on the orbweaver, to recall those positions.

So the equivalent of how it would be on a keyboard, would be:

alt+j = SET camera position 1
alt+k = SET camera position 2
alt+l = SET camera position 3
alt+n = SET camera position 4
alt+m = SET camera position 5
alt+, = SET camera position 6
alt+. = SET camera position 7

This translates to the Orbweaver buttons as:
directional pad+ button 12 = SET camera position 1
directional pad+ button 13 = SET camera position 2
directional pad+ button 14 = SET camera position 3
directional pad+ button 16 = SET camera position 4
directional pad+ button 17 = SET camera position 5
directional pad+ button 18 = SET camera position 6
directional pad+ button 19 = SET camera position 7

Note that I really only use 6 or 7 control groups with this game pad, so if you want to use more than that, you'll need to do some modifying on your own.

My control groups are close to the same as the default ZRM.
p = control group 1 (hatcheries)
shift+p = control group 2 (queens for injecting)
; = control group 3 (anything)
l = control group 4 (anything)
9 = control group 5 (anything)
- = control group 6 (anything)

You'll notice, instead of using 0 (zero), I use the next button over to the right. - (minus) on button 5 of the orbweaver. This is because control group 6 cannot be set by pressing Ctrl+shift+0. So I just took Ctrl+shift+0 out of my sc2 layout, and use - (minus).
I do use a 7th control group on my mouse (scroll wheel click). I keep it isolated there usually for scouting ovies, or temporary stuff that I don't want to confuse with the rest of my army, hatcheries, etc.

So that's the most important parts, everything else is almost the same if I remember correctly. Oh, I changed Idle worker to "shift+6" I think by default it might be "shift+7" but this is just personal preference stuff. I find it easier to hit the button on the top left corner of my keypad for idle workers. So to select ALL idle workers, you would hit "Ctrl" on the mouse with your right thumb, "Shift" with your left thumb on the orbweaver, and 6 (button 1) on the keypad. It feels nice when you get the hang of it, and it's fast. Two thumbs are faster than one. I personally don't use Subgroup menus too much, but I'm a noob.. so take all of this with a grain of salt. You could easily just put your side mouse buttons back as subgroup up and down.

If you play another race, that's ok too because although I've been saying "ZRM" this whole time, this game pad layout has the same exact keyboard keys mapped to it. So it's compatible with any races layout utilizing "TheCore" with a medium or small hand. Your home keys for your left hand on the orbweaver are the same for example:
Index finger : P
Eff you finger: O
Ring finger: I
Pinky Finger: J

so this translates to the orbweaver as:

Index finger: 10
Eff you finger: 9
Ring finger: 8
Pinky finger: 12

I know this doesn't feel normal, as you probably feel that your hand should be resting somewhere in the middle of the pad, rather than the right side. It may feel like your thumb is cramped, if that's the case. Adjust the orbweaver by extending the thumb controls. It has a button if you flip it over, it will slide out and adjust for larger hands. But, the reason this is, TheCore utilizes the pinky a lot, so you will be using all of the pad. The only way to get around this, is to redesign your layout altogether and scrap TheCore off the table.

I hope this helped at least a little, if you prefer a picture of my desk layout to get a mental idea of how I play Sc2:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7531202/photo.jpg

My advice to you learning new layouts, and getting used to the Orbweaver.

1. Be patient
2. Search for the map called "Hotkey trainer" and bookmark it. (this goes for everyone using "TheCore"
3. Don't swap keymaps and back to the keyboard every other day, this will instill old and bad habits when swapping to Orbweaver. I struggled for 2 weeks stuck using habits from both standard grid, and "TheCore" on the orbweaver and kept hitting buttons that weren't relevant.

If you want, PM me your email, and I'll attach the hotkey file so you can just throw it into your profile folder instead of manually having to set each command in SC2. As far as the orbweaver config file, I don't think I can share that, but I'll look for it in my appdata folder if I can find it.

Good luck Hope you enjoy the Orbweaver as much as I do, I have yet to meet anyone else who uses one in SC2.

Note* Do not cheat and start binding macros (more than 1 key press) to single keys with your software, this is considered cheating. Keep it to a 1:1 Key to Key ratio.
ReggieDunlop
Profile Joined January 2014
United States1 Post
January 09 2014 03:57 GMT
#6142
I'm running OSX: Mavericks, and after following the old install instructions on this page, I haven't been able to have the game recognize the hotkey set.

What gives?

Thanks!
Beedebdoo
Profile Joined June 2013
130 Posts
January 10 2014 21:53 GMT
#6143
Hey Coffey, great stuff
I would actually like to know yours, and others, opinion on switching layouts during play. As I've heard it, the Orbweaver can swap keymap quickly enough for it to be viable ingame for complex layouts. Do you think this is cheating? Do you have some ideas as to how this could be utilized?

In my opinion, 1 key for 1 action is not violated, but 1 key is effectively changed to 2 keys, meaning 2 actions in one key, but only with the help of a sort of modifier.
QUECOSA
Profile Joined January 2012
17 Posts
January 10 2014 22:31 GMT
#6144
Beedebdoo

I do use 4 macros:

1. enter
glhf
enter

2. enter
gg
enter

3. enter
/cheer
enter

4. enter
/dance
enter

Of course, this are harmless macros

I dont think command macros are useful in sc2 cause after all you have to click/target where/who to place that command.



Coffey
Profile Joined November 2013
United States15 Posts
January 11 2014 02:30 GMT
#6145
It's harmless to swap layouts during gameplay, not cheating. Since of course you are using less keys than a full size keyboard, it's completely understandable with the limited amount of buttons on the orbweaver. It can be utilized very easily actually. Just choose the 8 directional pad to change between layouts. It technically has 8 layouts per profile, so just think of that as layers for the orbweaver.
I only use Layer 1, and accomplish everything I need to with it. If you do use multiple layouts, ask yourself, do you NEED more than 1 layout? because think of swapping layouts as downtime, it's the same type of downtime you experience using the grid when you have to temporarily take your hand off of the keyboard to hit the buttons out of reach, 7-10 for example. The action of swapping layouts itself accomplishes nothing in the game and takes a second to change. What happens when you need your layout with your control groups and you're on the second layout? Just seems like it would complicate things even further, especially with the possibility of confusing yourself thinking.. "which layer are my hatcheries on?" etc. If you do use more than one layer, build in redundancy so that you can continue to macro / micro with your primary control groups for hatch's, buildings, queens, etc.
As far as cheating is concerned, it's not. It's completely fine to shift layouts during gameplay as long as one keypress = one remapped keypress. Personally, I would try to stick to one if at all possible, more necessarily doesn't translate to better when it comes to speed and efficiency in Starcraft 2. In fact, it seems with SC2, less = more. As in, the less keys you have to use, the more efficient you can operate, which the core really emulates.
Beedebdoo
Profile Joined June 2013
130 Posts
January 11 2014 07:16 GMT
#6146
@QUECOSA
Indeed, those are harmless macros
I disagree with macros not being useful, you can effectively make every ability smart cast with it, by adding a left click at the end of a single key press macro.

@Coffey
I agree that less keypresses is ideal, it's fundamental to TheCore. That said, I think there are a lot of possibilities, not just splitting up control groups. It also brings up the question: if a key is really far out, is it worth splitting it up to 2 fast keys?
Coffey
Profile Joined November 2013
United States15 Posts
January 11 2014 07:41 GMT
#6147
I would say it depends on how effecient it is, and how comfortable you are executing awkward keystrokes that may be far to reach. However, on the Orbweaver gamepad, nothing is out of reach. At least not with a medium size hand. TheCore in reality is trying to be as specific as possible to meet everyones needs, however, we know that down to each individual, we are all different and have our own preferences to how the layout feels. I'm more comfortable with the least amount of buttons needing to be pressed at a time. like when you start having to press 3 at a time such as two modifiers plus one key, that's about my limit.
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
January 11 2014 17:46 GMT
#6148
I feel that swapping layouts would be like having another modifier. Should be fine for the ToS.
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Beedebdoo
Profile Joined June 2013
130 Posts
January 11 2014 18:22 GMT
#6149
That is a way of looking at it yea. However it doesn't have the limitations of regular mods. That makes a difference because we suddenly have access to fancy modifier ability keys, which are otherwise problematic to come by, if done with hotkey file editing.
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
January 11 2014 18:39 GMT
#6150
Is it a toggle, or does it have to be held down?
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Beedebdoo
Profile Joined June 2013
130 Posts
January 11 2014 18:53 GMT
#6151
Both options are available
SpoogeCoffer
Profile Joined September 2012
New Zealand51 Posts
January 12 2014 06:18 GMT
#6152
It'd be awesome if TheCore supported the StarBow mod as I can see that gaining some serious popularity. Though it looks like a lot of work to do so.
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
January 12 2014 15:46 GMT
#6153
I was thinking the same thing. If I get enough free time I would love to take a stab at it.
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Mar_1910
Profile Joined October 2012
Poland22 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-13 20:39:30
January 13 2014 20:38 GMT
#6154
I resign from TheCore to normal layout after one Year, because:
-it didnt helped me to improve apm (had the same). This was my first goal to change to something new
-problem on many arcade games, campain etc
-problem with playing on laptop

I still love TheCore because:
-I started to use location camera
-had a lot of fun while I was learning it
-I still think that accuracy is better on TheCore then on normal keys

Thanks guys, i came back to normal keys after 50games.
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
January 13 2014 20:59 GMT
#6155
@Mar
50 games is no where near enough to improve apm. It will probably take at least 200 or so. However the quality of your practice plays a huge role in determining improvement, so that number is just an estimate based on feedback.

StarBow
Everyone is talking about it. Who knows how long it will keep up? Either way I've begun working on including Starbow in TheCore. This is a shit ton of work and I have no idea what kind of conflicts will come up as I work this out. In short, this will take some time to complete. So in the meantime I am making a short instructional video on how to work it out yourself. Since you only have to worry about your race and your layout, and do not need to choose what is best for most people, but simply what you prefer, this will be much faster. I hope to have these instructions out to you tomorrow, but don't quote me on it
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
REALRetrO
Profile Joined December 2013
United States15 Posts
January 14 2014 01:33 GMT
#6156
Hey JaKaTaK, I installed The Core(PRM) and i put it in a hotkeys folder in my profile and in starcraft II, it doesnt appear. I really want to try the core out but i don't know what is causing this. I have tried to re download and remake folder and relog, nothing is working. If you can help me out that would be greatly appreciated. :D
(ノ◕ヮ◕)ノ*:・゚✧
slowbacontron
Profile Joined October 2012
United States7722 Posts
January 14 2014 03:03 GMT
#6157
REALRetrO, I don't know the specifics of your problem and this may not help you at all, but make sure the path to your hotkeys folder looks like this. Note that the folder after "StarCraft II" is not "Username.Number", but "Accounts".

If you already did that, maybe you could give some more details!
jjakji fan
REALRetrO
Profile Joined December 2013
United States15 Posts
January 14 2014 03:17 GMT
#6158
slowbacontron THANK YOU, i put it one folder to far xD. Thanks :D
(ノ◕ヮ◕)ノ*:・゚✧
slowbacontron
Profile Joined October 2012
United States7722 Posts
January 14 2014 03:35 GMT
#6159
You're welcome! Have fun with the layout and feel free to ask any further questions you may have!
jjakji fan
Lobotomist
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1541 Posts
January 14 2014 23:20 GMT
#6160
Related to TheCore in Starbow: Does the core work with SC2:BW? Has anyone played around with this?
Teching to hive too quickly isn't just a risk: it's an ultrarisk
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