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On July 04 2013 07:40 slowbacontron wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2013 04:37 ToMa380Te wrote:
I cannot find any hints on this. So I will just ask here:
Is TheCore allowed in tournaments? In which tournaments is it illegal to use TheCore? DreamHack? GSL? TheCore is made to be entirely tournament legal. In fact, JaKaTaK doesn't go anywhere near the boundaries of layout restrictions anymore in order to minimize this risk. E: just looked at the banners, really great job teuthida!
Thank you kindly, Sir.
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Well, now OP looks 100x better than before.
Good job!
BTW
What about putting rapid fire on ctrl+build basic key? It would require to remap skills to this button, but I think the benefits are pretty hefty in this one.
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@Czarnodziej
As slowbacontron said, TheCore is made to be entirely tournament legal, and there are obviously some doubts about rapid fire's tournament legality. You are free to make whatever changes you wish to your own TheCore layout, and I'm sure we would all be happy to hear what you find out during your tinkering with TheCore 
slowbacontron's post: + Show Spoiler +On July 04 2013 07:40 slowbacontron wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2013 04:37 ToMa380Te wrote:
I cannot find any hints on this. So I will just ask here:
Is TheCore allowed in tournaments? In which tournaments is it illegal to use TheCore? DreamHack? GSL? TheCore is made to be entirely tournament legal. In fact, JaKaTaK doesn't go anywhere near the boundaries of layout restrictions anymore in order to minimize this risk.
@JaK
Why doesn't Ghosts use the Build Basic button on non-zerg layouts? They are recalled with the index, so it shouldn't cause too many problems, aside from recalling index finger CGs after using a spell.
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That is pretty cool. Quite the dedication to an optimal hotkey setup!
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I love this layout, thank you for this
If I use a TRM one should I set my medivacs to Ctrl+0 together with my marine/marauder/tech lab or should I only set them to the suggested army control group [Ctrl+;]?
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On July 08 2013 06:16 neko453 wrote:I love this layout, thank you for this If I use a TRM one should I set my medivacs to Ctrl+0 together with my marine/marauder/tech lab or should I only set them to the suggested army control group [Ctrl+;]?
Neko, it is ideal to have them separate, that way when you move your bio ball around the medivacs can heal them (like when kiting or stutter-stepping). Otherwise the medivacs won't heal very efficiently.
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@Beedebdoo
nice catch on the Ghost, we can definitely improve that!
@everyone
gtlovar has been working on this project for a long ass time now and has been emailing/updating me as it comes along. It is really fucking cool :D
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I'm not sure what I should write above these questions, so I'll just write this.
- Google's spreadsheet supports comments in the individual cell. The cell gets a little mark, and when you mouse over it, you can read the comment. Would it be possible to comment on cells like Army(Terran) and Ranged(Protoss) under suggested CGs to explain what excactly is meant? (What units goes to this CG?)
- As to the question above: What excactly goes into the Army CG for Terran? As I understand it, it's everything except Harass, Ghosts, Tanks, Widow Mines, and Vikings.
- It might just be me, but I recall that you (JaK) have stated that the CGs are sorted from fastest to press, to slowest to press. -(2) for medium layouts has 3rd place, but is rated as the 7th easiest to press CG on the Archives. Why is that?
- Why is Select Builder banished to the far reaches of the nether? Isn't it faster than box selecting? U is free for P, R, and TRM. For Zerg layouts, I'm not as keen, but N and . are free.
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I want to know if some1 binding a Lab or let's say spawning pool, so they can start an upgrade with a hotkey? If so to what hotkey(s)?
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What changes are you guys considering for the next version? I have again fully adapted to the current version of the core and could give feedback on the new tweaks before you release it ^^.
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On July 08 2013 18:24 Guileful wrote:
I want to know if some1 binding a Lab or let's say spawning pool, so they can start an upgrade with a hotkey? If so to what hotkey(s)?
I bind all upgrade buildings to P(CC).
You can remove the tech labs/spawning pool from the CG when you're done with the updates.
Realistically speaking, you will have your CC's, Engi Bays, Armory(ies) and maybe some Ghost academies late game  .
I feel like upgrades don't really need their own CG.
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@Slashie
Always post your feedback here! It helps us a lot. (as always post your version # and acronym)
We plan on:
bringing in the keys on the hatchery for upgrades, and queen building.
fixing some inconsistencies brought up by Beedebdoo (I haven't been writing them down and will have to go backwards through the thread comments, this was an unwise decision)
removing / (the thumb key) from production, as you press production keys more than once which is not efficient for the thumb key.
I think that's it...
@Beedebdoo
1. Excellent Idea! Will do :D
2. Yes, that is correct.
3. I'll take a look at this when I'm doing the update.
4. It is not faster than box selecting unless you happened to already be selecting the building at the time. I suppose we could put it back in, but I'm not seeing a strong case for it
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Hey hey, starting in on 0.7.3 today. As of now the zerg changes are going in. I don't see any reason not to put them in. Best way to keep up aside from subscribing this thread is through youtube.com/thejakatakshow
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On July 08 2013 17:00 Beedebdoo wrote:I'm not sure what I should write above these questions, so I'll just write this. - Google's spreadsheet supports comments in the individual cell. The cell gets a little mark, and when you mouse over it, you can read the comment. Would it be possible to comment on cells like Army(Terran) and Ranged(Protoss) under suggested CGs to explain what excactly is meant? (What units goes to this CG?)
- As to the question above: What excactly goes into the Army CG for Terran? As I understand it, it's everything except Harass, Ghosts, Tanks, Widow Mines, and Vikings.
- It might just be me, but I recall that you (JaK) have stated that the CGs are sorted from fastest to press, to slowest to press. -(2) for medium layouts has 3rd place, but is rated as the 7th easiest to press CG on the Archives. Why is that?
- Why is Select Builder banished to the far reaches of the nether? Isn't it faster than box selecting? U is free for P, R, and TRM. For Zerg layouts, I'm not as keen, but N and . are free.
Concerning #3 The order in game is based on the suggested CGs, the order in the doc is based on keyscore
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@Plans for next update
Glad to hear you're starting up the next patch :D
Will the mouse + modifier keys make it through? There are 12 of them, counting left, right, and the two side mouse buttons. So many good keys.
@Select Builder key
I looked at it for a bit now. I see a lot of advantages, but they are very situational. For example, it's easier to Select Builder than to click/box an SCV, if the building is surrounded by other units. But when are you ever going to cancel/halt a heavily defended building? Perhaps for bunker rushes.
Edit:
On July 09 2013 00:55 JaKaTaK wrote:
Concerning #3 The order in game is based on the suggested CGs, the order in the doc is based on keyscore I'm not sure what you mean. What I understand is that they're in the order that they're used, but I can't see myself getting Widow Mines before I get an army, or a harass for that matter. If -(2) is meant for worker scouts early game it makes more sense. Is that the case?
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@Beedebdoo
I don't remember finding anything that was advantageous for using the new modifiers (I also don't think there are 12). Can you remind me of the best ideas?
EDIT:
PTR Changes are up on the archives, haven't started to create the files yet. On to Zerg.
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The 12 free mouse + modifier keys
+ Show Spoiler +Left-click + Alt
Right-click + Ctrl
Right-click + Ctrl + Shift
Right-click + Alt
Foward mouse button + every modifier (4)
Back mouse button + every modifier (4)
Every modifier: Alt, Ctrl, Shift, Ctrl + Shift.
We can easily count middle mouse button as 4 extra buttons, but that key's quality is heavily dependent of mouse. Scroll wheel is a nono key because it isn't tabbed like very other key.
Replacing the worst CG with mouse clicks
It's prone to error if ctrl is part of recall, because you can unintentionally add what's in this CG to other CGs if you spam it. Therefore, it's best served, if recall is shift + side mouse button. Recalling queens with Side mouse button + Shift on non-zerg layouts could prove advantageous.
Recalling/setting free-cameras for Creep spread on zerg layouts
There are a lot of different buttons in play when a full creep spread sequence is initiated. Some of that load could be moved to the mouse. I'm dabbling with a concrete example, which I will get up soon(tm)
Alternatively setting up free cameras with alt + left and right click on non-zerg layouts
By no means an overwhelming achivement, especially since it can be done with the camera keys themselves. A slight improvement nonetheless.
Mod + mouse will likely not whoop the stage, but it can do the little things.
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Okay, so running into a bit of an annoyance. If anyone can figure this out it would be of tremendous help:
WTF do these hotkeys do?:
BattleRage/Khraxus
Charge/Khraxus
EDIT:
@Beedebdoo
I don't think these changes will yield any results. Will you test them personally for me and come back with your experience? (anyone else willing to test would be helpful)
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I spent a lot of time tinkering around with the mod+mouse commands a while ago and here's what I found:- Anything on the Command Cards cannot be legally bound to any mouse buttons (you guys probably know this).
- Mouse buttons (with or without using modifier keys), can only be legally bound to Global bindings.
- Mapping nearly any command to Left or Right Click, regardless of its use, is very, very shaky. I for one, will be staying farrrrr away from these bindings until we somehow gain control over how mod keys behave without the use of tournament-banned solutions.. It can feel cool to do things with mods+ Left Click and Right Click, but one easy slip-up and you're either issuing a command you don't want (even queuing them when using Shift as a mod), changing rallies or sending units places by accident. A lot of bad things can happen.
- Middle Mouse button is the shit! It's on tons of mice these days, and it benefits from the numerous mod+ mouse click combinations. There are no hard-coded commands to stumble with (such as Ctrl/Shift+Left or Right Click behaviour). MMB is a harm-free key that should not cause accidents. I recommend taking advantage of this as much as possible.
- If you've got them, side mouse buttons work great as well. I personally stay away from using them, but if one were to use mod+mouse bindings, know that the side buttons are safe, just like MMB.
I'm sure most of that isn't revolutionary info, but it's important to note that mod+ Left and Right Click bindings are recipes for disaster. MMB and side buttons are fine.
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EPT
