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@Slashiepie
Sure the right software can solve this problem, but it would hurt TheCore's accessibility. First of all it would surely mean tournament bans, which would make it impossible to really hit the pro scene. Secondly, you're asking every user to own the right mouse with the right sofware, else some kind of 3. party software, that can do that without the right mouse, would need to be part of the installation of TheCore.
Of course a ladder version of TheCore with rapid fire, mouse attack move and all that stuff could be nice, but it would require a lot of resources from the development team, as attack move on a mouse button would redefine where many abilities were pressed.
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I agree with Ninjury for most points but I'll see if binding my period key to create control groups is a good idea and leave everything else the same.
Edit: I meant to say use period key for creating cam and alt for creating groups
Edit 2: am I crazy or Blizzard only allows certain keys like alt, ctl, and shift for modifier functions. Wow that's lame
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Btw: I might have been better suited for stimming/abilities and then shift queuing orders.. now you have to move the thumb twice. There are other little nuances to this, such as medivacs shift click boosting on a location, the solution for speed i guess is that the index has to come to use the abilities and the thumb taps shift, but depending on the group being recalled this is not necessarily better.
Now try that with the Cgs that are to the right of 0.
I think these are the things i meant with not optimal for Terran, we need to shift command tanks, mines, drops, units so that they arrive somewhere and stay put, as well as cloaks decloaks combined with retreats... I seemed better for that since you had no trouble using shift..
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Ok another thing to consider: boxing a shitload of scvs/workers for building the gas is not the pinnacle of microskill but if you're used to do it insanely fast and you fail the timing for any reason you will now have a load of lazy scvs doing nothing, i don't know if anyone is having this kind of blunders, but i'm just throwing it out there.
Btw guys how hard would it be for you to implement usage of the windows and fn buttons, i feel like removing them is indeed a good initial plan, but it also feels like a waste of 2 excellent buttons to me.. i'm sure they could be used for other purposes,i 'm about to experiment binding shift and browse subgroups to each one.
Any master/gm terran using the Core actually posts here? im really curious as to how they are actually using their CGS.
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On June 12 2013 04:53 Slashiepie wrote:
Ok another thing to consider: boxing a shitload of scvs/workers for building the gas is not the pinnacle of microskill but if you're used to do it insanely fast and you fail the timing for any reason you will now have a load of lazy scvs doing nothing, i don't know if anyone is having this kind of blunders, but i'm just throwing it out there.
Btw guys how hard would it be for you to implement usage of the windows and fn buttons, i feel like removing them is indeed a good initial plan, but it also feels like a waste of 2 excellent buttons to me.. i'm sure they could be used for other purposes,i 'm about to experiment binding shift and browse subgroups to each one.
Any master/gm terran using the Core actually posts here? im really curious as to how they are actually using their CGS.
I don't main as Terran but I do have a Masters Terran account. For me, my CGs depend entirely on the unit comp (I use RRM 0.6.1 for reference).
MMMVG:
9- MM
0- Medivacs
Minus- Ghosts
[- Vikings
Marine/tank:
9- Marines + medivacs
0- Tanks
Mech:
9- All ground units
0- All flying units
Then I use P for CCs + upgrades, O for all unit producing structures, and L, ;, and . for drops (if I gives drops CGs at all, usually I forget).
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On June 12 2013 05:06 JDub wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2013 04:53 Slashiepie wrote:
Ok another thing to consider: boxing a shitload of scvs/workers for building the gas is not the pinnacle of microskill but if you're used to do it insanely fast and you fail the timing for any reason you will now have a load of lazy scvs doing nothing, i don't know if anyone is having this kind of blunders, but i'm just throwing it out there.
Btw guys how hard would it be for you to implement usage of the windows and fn buttons, i feel like removing them is indeed a good initial plan, but it also feels like a waste of 2 excellent buttons to me.. i'm sure they could be used for other purposes,i 'm about to experiment binding shift and browse subgroups to each one.
Any master/gm terran using the Core actually posts here? im really curious as to how they are actually using their CGS.
I don't main as Terran but I do have a Masters Terran account. For me, my CGs depend entirely on the unit comp (I use RRM 0.6.1 for reference). MMMVG: 9- MM 0- Medivacs Minus- Ghosts [- Vikings Marine/tank: 9- Marines + medivacs 0- Tanks Mech: 9- All ground units 0- All flying units Then I use P for CCs + upgrades, O for all unit producing structures, and L, ;, and . for drops (if I gives drops CGs at all, usually I forget).
Nice, will give it a try, im having a hard time decidng where i want what, and ghosts on L just don't feel right.
By the way guys: I think i hit the jackpot, function and windows can be CG1 and 2 meaning CC and Production facilities respectively, this frees up P and O for actual units, but now i want my H for hold back!
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@Slashie
It is faster to click an scv on one side of the minerals and build a refinery, and then repeat for the other side. It doesn't take too long to train, maybe an hour or so.
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On June 12 2013 04:53 Slashiepie wrote:
Ok another thing to consider: boxing a shitload of scvs/workers for building the gas is not the pinnacle of microskill but if you're used to do it insanely fast and you fail the timing for any reason you will now have a load of lazy scvs doing nothing, i don't know if anyone is having this kind of blunders, but i'm just throwing it out there.
Btw guys how hard would it be for you to implement usage of the windows and fn buttons, i feel like removing them is indeed a good initial plan, but it also feels like a waste of 2 excellent buttons to me.. i'm sure they could be used for other purposes,i 'm about to experiment binding shift and browse subgroups to each one.
Any master/gm terran using the Core actually posts here? im really curious as to how they are actually using their CGS.
I do the exact same thing when building refineries, and yes, I accidentally halt my SCVs when I fail to hit the build basic button correctly. Its frustrating and it happens too often, but I think the solution lies with changing my habits. E.g. small boxes or single clicking my SCVs when I want to build a refinery.
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On June 12 2013 05:28 JaKaTaK wrote:
@Slashie
It is faster to click an scv on one side of the minerals and build a refinery, and then repeat for the other side. It doesn't take too long to train, maybe an hour or so.
Jak: Do you mean faster for a person to execute or less wasted time by the SCVs moving to the gas?
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I'm not a Master terran now but I was before using the core last season. Now I'm diamond trying to get back to master. My hotkey setups are very alternative. I use
p for Command Centers
i for my whole army
o for special units like ghosts/widow mines
8 for special units like medivacs and vikings
L for special units like marauders/marines
9 and 0 are for drops
- is for upgrades
K is for production facilities.
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Regarding workers screwing up when making refineries:
If K is "hold position", the workers will not show up as idle, and you have to actually box them and right click. If K is "stop", the workers show up as idle and you can ctrl+idle workers (7 in TRM I believe).
Personally, I have "stop" on K and "hold position" on 8.
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On June 12 2013 05:41 lailaiwd wrote:
I'm not a Master terran now but I was before using the core last season. Now I'm diamond trying to get back to master. My hotkey setups are very alternative. I use
p for Command Centers
i for my whole army
o for special units like ghosts/widow mines
8 for special units like medivacs and vikings
L for special units like marauders/marines
9 and 0 are for drops
- is for upgrades
K is for production facilities.
Helps if you say what layout you are using. TRL?
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@Smack
I mean less wasted time from SCVs moving to gas, and increased efficiency. As well as overall time from start to finish. So, there are 2 players in identical situations, one trained in box method, one trained in single click, the single click player will have his/her refineries down faster than the box player every time, even if the box players total execution time is less.
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On June 12 2013 05:47 Borskey wrote:
Regarding workers screwing up when making refineries:
If K is "hold position", the workers will not show up as idle, and you have to actually box them and right click. If K is "stop", the workers show up as idle and you can ctrl+idle workers (7 in TRM I believe).
Personally, I have "stop" on K and "hold position" on 8.
Interesting, I hadn't thought of that. I had considered swapping them for kiting. I feel that stop is better than halt and K scores as faster than 8. I'm not a fan of click-move then attack-move for kiting as I feel its more error prone.
At this point I haven't modified the core, but maybe I'll experiment with that.
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On June 12 2013 06:20 JaKaTaK wrote:
@Smack
I mean less wasted time from SCVs moving to gas, and increased efficiency. As well as overall time from start to finish. So, there are 2 players in identical situations, one trained in box method, one trained in single click, the single click player will have his/her refineries down faster than the box player every time, even if the box players total execution time is less.
Gotcha. Time to practice a new technique. 
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On June 12 2013 06:20 JaKaTaK wrote:
@Smack
I mean less wasted time from SCVs moving to gas, and increased efficiency. As well as overall time from start to finish. So, there are 2 players in identical situations, one trained in box method, one trained in single click, the single click player will have his/her refineries down faster than the box player every time, even if the box players total execution time is less.
However, imagine the following scenario: you have just completed your 3rd base, and you are defending a drop in your main and an attack at your natural, and you need to start building the refineries at your 3rd base asap. In this case, the box method would be preferable, in my opinion.
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@Ninjury_J
Thank you so much for the reply, I still haven't gotten everything working in terms of camera / injects.
First things first though. Creating a group and adding to a group has left me with a couple of questions.
Could you describe how you add to an existing group for the following two scenarios:
add 1 single unit to an existing group
add several units to an existing group
Something is simply not right here.
I created a command group and then tried adding to that group holding down Ctrl which doesnt work, even though it should have taken the role of shift. Somehow holding down shift still adds to a command group as it has always done??
Next I tried adding to an existing command group by holding down Ctrl + Shift, clicking the units to add, and then press the key for the command group. This works fine, except if you are making a box around the units to add and that box starts over one of your buildings, in which case the building will be added to the selection, or if your box starts over a unit, in which case all units of that type within the screen will be added to the selection (property of Ctrl). Is it suppose to work like that? I mean in that case I honestly find the old adding more powerful since it doesnt have those weaknesses.
Learning these keys is breaking my mind, but I'm sick and tired of the grid layout so might aswell give it a shot :-)
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Anyone has a pre-6.3 version of the core ? Any version where browsing through subgroups wasn't done with the mouse?
I cant see the benefits of having main abilities moved from I to - , to the guys using it like that.. tell me you actually find it better tto shift queue abilities with that ?
I've tested a lot of versions of the Core, all i want is my old 6.2 or sth liek that back, :'(
Creating my own version is driving me mad.
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On June 12 2013 07:19 Daewon wrote:
I created a command group and then tried adding to that group holding down Ctrl which doesnt work, even though it should have taken the role of shift. Somehow holding down shift still adds to a command group as it has always done??
If that is the case, something is probably wrong with your hotkey file. I can't really help you though, as I don't use the same kind of keyboard you use.
Anyways, if you're Zerg, the best way to be adding units to control groups is egg hotkeying. You shouldn't be making boxes to add units to control groups except for Queens, Overseers, or if you're splitting off a small group for harass.
Egg hotkeying works like this in TheCore: Lets say I'm making roaches, hydralisks, and zerglings. I want my lings to be on ; and my roaches and hydras to both be on L. I use the US ZRM layout. Here's what I do:
Press P (selects hatches)
press O (selects larvae)
Press K, press H (Makes roaches and hydralisks)
Hold ctrl, click on one of the egg wireframes (this selects all the currently morphing roaches and hydralisks)
Press L, let go of ctrl (this adds them to my L control group)
press P (selects hatcheries for me)
press O (selects larvae)
Hold J (makes zerglings)
Hold ctrl, click on egg wireframe, press ;.
This works fine, except if you are making a box around the units to add and that box starts over one of your buildings, in which case the building will be added to the selection
I could be wrong about this, but I was under the impression that if you make a box around units AND a building, it only selects the units. Are you sure this is an issue you are having?
or if your box starts over a unit, in which case all units of that type within the screen will be added to the selection (property of Ctrl).
In this case, you should make the box first and press ctrl+whatever after you've got the units you want selected.
(but again, if you're zerg you should use egg hotkeying 99% of the time).
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On June 12 2013 07:19 Daewon wrote:
@Ninjury_J
Thank you so much for the reply, I still haven't gotten everything working in terms of camera / injects.
First things first though. Creating a group and adding to a group has left me with a couple of questions.
Could you describe how you add to an existing group for the following two scenarios:
add 1 single unit to an existing group
add several units to an existing group
Something is simply not right here.
I created a command group and then tried adding to that group holding down Ctrl which doesnt work, even though it should have taken the role of shift. Somehow holding down shift still adds to a command group as it has always done??
Next I tried adding to an existing command group by holding down Ctrl + Shift, clicking the units to add, and then press the key for the command group. This works fine, except if you are making a box around the units to add and that box starts over one of your buildings, in which case the building will be added to the selection, or if your box starts over a unit, in which case all units of that type within the screen will be added to the selection (property of Ctrl). Is it suppose to work like that? I mean in that case I honestly find the old adding more powerful since it doesnt have those weaknesses.
Learning these keys is breaking my mind, but I'm sick and tired of the grid layout so might aswell give it a shot :-)
This definitely sounds like you're hotkey file is messed up or you're subconsciously doing something wrong even though you think you are doing it correctly. I would start with a re-download and see if its still an issue.
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EPT
