I have a problem: Terrans are supposed to be good vs 6 pool right? After reading the player who got to GM using only 6 pool, I myself faced a 6 pooling zerg and lost. Apparently you can manually place 3 lings on a depot to kill it faster than the SCV can build. In my game I had built the depot as soon as I scouted fast pool, and that is exactly what happened to me.
I have one solution below which I observed in Bomber's stream, and one that Jinro did vs Idra long ago. And I myself thought of one. If you have anymore safer strategies to deal with this 'crisis' let me know.
I guess a depot and 2 quick rax at choke would be easy solution to defend the ling rush. Or you can block around the CC, which is trickier, and if they decide to do a roach rush instead it is more risky....
Solutions:
ONE Apparently Pros do not have problem with the 6 pool + drone rush. I saw Bomber stream, and I believe Losira hit him with this rush, so this is how bomber defended it.
1) Run the SCVs to stall the lings and drones from killing the barracks (building first marine), but never truly engage. 2) As the marine is finishing you need to bunch your scvs and then target a mineral patch so the scvs will travel through the zerg units. 3. Then surround the zerg units as the marine pops out.
I think timing is important because I myself have never won 1 marine plus scvs vs drones and lings AND have many SCVs survive (but in the red) like Bomber did.
TWO Jinro vs Idra during one of the old GSL matches, what Jinro did was build a bunker behind mineral line, he also had 2 rax making it easier to produce marines. As the marine is about to pop, he used some scvs to distract the zerglings so that the marine can reach the bunker.
THREE If they sent drones, you can attempt to lock them inside your base. What you do is build a bunker near your base to lure zerglings to attack it instead of barracks, then run your scvs out of the base, build depot that they destroyed, then just raise your other depot and have SCVs repair from outside while lifting orbital command.
I have done this before, but the opponent did not send drones, so could reinforce with more lings.
If you are that short on time, an engineering bay builds at 850/35 hp/s ~ 24.3 hp/s. Zerglings do 7.2 dps (actually less because of building armor), so you need 4. You tell me if 4 can hit at the same time with normal placing.
I read the article on 6 pooling your way to GM and I only saw the drone rush being used against the terran. Here's a few videos on how to defend against it.
As for the 6 pool, I'm not reallly sure. I think you should be able to wall off by the time lings come in? Not sure though because it has not happened to me yet.
On January 03 2012 22:05 Mowr wrote: If you are that short on time, an engineering bay builds at 850/35 hp/s ~ 24.3 hp/s. Zerglings do 7.2 dps (actually less because of building armor), so you need 4. You tell me if 4 can hit at the same time with normal placing.
IIRC you can't place an engi bay where the supply would go and not allow more than 3 zerglings hit it
On January 04 2012 01:17 thesums wrote: Thanks for the help I will have a look, so ebay is a no go?
as i said, if i recall right.... and what i've found to be very useful is scv stacking the natural minerals so you fight the drones with your scvs while ur marine is on top of ramp... since zerglings cant mineral stack 1, maybe 2 (or luckily all of them eheheh) will be stuck on the bottom of the ramp trying to go through zerg's drones!
On January 03 2012 22:05 Mowr wrote: If you are that short on time, an engineering bay builds at 850/35 hp/s ~ 24.3 hp/s. Zerglings do 7.2 dps (actually less because of building armor), so you need 4. You tell me if 4 can hit at the same time with normal placing.
Buildings that are under construction have 0 armor, so zerglings will deal the full 7.2 DPS.
6 pool yes with proper scouting you can wall off, but if you build your depot a little too late and they manually position the lings, they can get 3 on each depot meaning they will get the depot down and you might lose. Usually I do not get 2nd depot that early since i need to build orbital and get marine out. Meaning standard build lings should be able to get to your base before depot goes down....
But as I said in previous post that bomber held it off with scv good surround micro. AND the opponent brought drones too and he held it
On January 04 2012 01:17 thesums wrote: Thanks for the help I will have a look, so ebay is a no go?
as i said, if i recall right.... and what i've found to be very useful is scv stacking the natural minerals so you fight the drones with your scvs while ur marine is on top of ramp... since zerglings cant mineral stack 1, maybe 2 (or luckily all of them eheheh) will be stuck on the bottom of the ramp trying to go through zerg's drones!
Bomber kind of did this, but the drones and lings were already in base when he pulled it off.
6 pool is autowin unless you screw up your micro with your scvs/initial marine(s). if lings somehow get in just run scvs until your marine is about to pop and surround it immediately.
I played against plat - diamonds yet, but most of the time they mess up by sending fast drone. If I see drone comming to my base too early I would be a bit on alert and send some scv in front of my base to see if anything cheesy is comming in. Or just put some really early second depot. I never lost against zergling rush before, but I guess i never met some amazing rusher yet.
cut scv, cancle orbital, build bunk near minerals, lift and move barracks to main hugging a side of the bunker. pull scv's to allow this to happen, if they pull drones too split forces and just delay till bunker is up and marine is inside, mass repair once this is in place.
bunker wont work, it takes way too long to build. the only reason 6 pool is even slightly viable against terran is because bunker and barracks build time have been nerfed heavily, and for this reason even scouted proxy 2 gate works against terran. But yeah bunker as a distraction could work very well.
i think what about cancel orbital and build barracks? would that be able to build faster than lings can kill it? Obviously the bomber style of surround as marine pop would be the best, but it seems difficult to pull, and you need to wait for right amount of scvs. 1 scv makes huge difference.
But if you are saying auto win for terran check out the 6 pool to GM thread, you will see that even pro players like TLO cannot hold this. I repeat that if you do a standard build with normal scout time you will probably just lose...since your depot will start just as you see the lings, which the lings will kill so no repair for you. Unless you plan to always open with quick 2 rax, which the zergs are so good at holding now.
start your depot at 14 and dont finish it, scout with that scv and it helps in finishing the depot in time to repair right before it dies. pull 3 scvs and you're good
this doesnt set you back a lot for standard play and i always do it anyway because it denies scouting, and you can even do it when getting 13 gas and lots of people will assume its gasless (you need to cut half an scv's production time if getting 13gas)
cancel the depot and build a rax instead as soon as you see the lings. Someone above said that most zerg can hold a 2rax. But that becomes a lot harder if they have 6 pooled. A terran could pull off a marine scv all in after a failed 6 pull pretty easily.
If you are having troubles with the supply depo going down, why not make another building behind it? Sure, it might not make the best wall, but if you delay long enough for either the marine to come out and go to a bunker near your minerals, or buildings to finish (allowing you to repair), you should be fine.
@LAN I believe you cannot build 1 building behind it, you might need a lot of buildings lol or there will be gaps.
@Demise Building a rax would be good strategy provided that the lings cannot kill it faster, of course if they 6 pooled, you can do anything and still be ahead assuming you do not die XD. But what I mean is 11/11 Rax type of quick 2 raxes, it is almost a pre-emptive measure which is not good if they do not cheese >< unless you want to cheese.
@Aristole If I can do it....but sometimes the zerg is good at preventing that. You see they have all their attention on my base, so technically they should be able to prevent me from getting the marine to the bunker or stop it from getting up.
The other solution would be super early scout. But this can put you behind because early game each SCV is important. I guess if you scout as you make supply depot you can easily defend 6 pool. If you defend it....hehe 6 rax time all the way! Need your own cheese to rub it in their face.
I do not encounter this often, but it appears that when it does happen I lose....As a Terran player I am not so good vs this cheese especially. Sometimes I lose to 1 base roach but I hold that much better strangely, and bane bust is easiest to hold for some reason. The 1 base Banes.
Or you could watch MKP's stream to see how he use 1 single marine and 6 SCVs to hold it w/o losing anything lol micro is the key, wall-off ASAP and pull your units.
EPT
my 2cents
