EPT[G] A Guide to Standard TvP - Page 3
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Notaa
Canada51 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10345 Posts
 (general rules, important thing to scout for, etc.)Very nice, thank you! | ||
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Cortza
South Africa328 Posts
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Glioburd
France1911 Posts
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JudgementxMyuu
Australia53 Posts
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y0su
Finland7871 Posts
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IamSoCrazy
France25 Posts
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monk
United States8476 Posts
You really need to differentiate between the 1 rax tech lab expand and the 1 rax no gas expand more. 1 rax no gas expand has a lot more viable transitions. For example, 1 rax cc into 4 rax no gas, 1 rax cc into 5 rax no gas, 1 rax cc into 3rd cc, 1 rax cc into double gas for either marine tank timings or marine tank banshee timings. I wouldn't call 1 rax naked expand "risky" at all, seeing as it's the standard in TvP. Just bad word choice imo. You say it's risky because of double stalker pressure, but that is only really viable on metal and xelnaga. I can't think of any other maps where a bunker wouldn't cover the entire choke. You say 3 rax tech is unsafe vs immortal pushes, but you shouldn't be committing to 3 rax tech before you rule out a 1 base immortal push. 4 rax or 5 rax "tech" off of tech lab expand isn't standard at all. In fact, I don't ever recall seeing these in a pro game. All of the transitions I named off of 1 rax no gas expand are way more common and "standard". Ghost timing attacks aren't allin at all. You can very easily make a factory behind the attack. Many times the terran will decide not to commit to the attack and just retreat. | ||
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Spitfire
South Africa442 Posts
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nukkuj
Finland403 Posts
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upperbound
United States2300 Posts
On November 29 2011 20:01 NrGmonk wrote: Here are a few comments I have after a brief glance: You really need to differentiate between the 1 rax tech lab expand and the 1 rax no gas expand more. 1 rax no gas expand has a lot more viable transitions. For example, 1 rax cc into 4 rax no gas, 1 rax cc into 5 rax no gas, 1 rax cc into 3rd cc, 1 rax cc into double gas for either marine tank timings or marine tank banshee timings. I wouldn't call 1 rax naked expand "risky" at all, seeing as it's the standard in TvP. Just bad word choice imo. You say it's risky because of double stalker pressure, but that is only really viable on metal and xelnaga. I can't think of any other maps where a bunker wouldn't cover the entire choke. You say 3 rax tech is unsafe vs immortal pushes, but you shouldn't be committing to 3 rax tech before you rule out a 1 base immortal push. 4 rax or 5 rax "tech" off of tech lab expand isn't standard at all. In fact, I don't ever recall seeing these in a pro game. All of the transitions I named off of 1 rax no gas expand are way more common and "standard". Ghost timing attacks aren't allin at all. You can very easily make a factory behind the attack. Many times the terran will decide not to commit to the attack and just retreat. This is true, but 3rd cc is still viable off of tech lab expand, no? | ||
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getdeadplz
United States116 Posts
im not a terran player but i believe something benificial you could add would be what to do in the none standard but fairly common toss builds(I dont believe any immortal play is mentioned for example) tech is scouted. I think you could do this by just having a section saying whitch one of these transitions should work against certain toss builds | ||
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FaKeSC2
Germany78 Posts
Most of the other guides don't really help beyond the low-masters level. | ||
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Hossinaut
United States453 Posts
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
4rax after cc is really bad imo. You shouldn't ever die to that as toss, and afterwards terran is very behind. The best terran style imo is fast upgrades into mmm with ghosts or vikings, as long as you're active on the map and don't lose drops you're in a good position. | ||
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r_con
United States824 Posts
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thoradycus
Malaysia3262 Posts
On November 29 2011 09:09 Froadac wrote: This doesn't seem like a bad little guide. I did learn quite a lot from it, assuming it's accurate We've seen a lot of the koreans (and puma.. and thorzain) go one rax fe into 4 or 5 rax. Push, then expo and take double/triple gas. I've seen it enough it might be "standard". What are your thoughts on this? I havent been watching games that closely but when in the build do they push with the rines? | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25552 Posts
On November 29 2011 09:28 -Aura- wrote: One thing you didn't mention is that the reason why 1 rax marauder fast expand is somewhat unpopular is that it can lose very easily to 3 Gate Void Ray, because you have so few marines early. Cool guide by the way. There's a lot of useful information in the guide, and having read through the replies, I'd like to highlight this comment. The main reason I go for a 1 rax gasless fast expand in my macro-centric TvP is because, and I'm willing to generally assert this, 1 rax concussive marauder FE suffers build order loss to 3 gate Void Ray all-in. You will never have the marines to defend it, and this build is very common on the ladder. That being said, thanks for the effort but into this guide. | ||
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JonB
Sweden325 Posts
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Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
in which cases would you go up to 5-6 raxes before getting 3rd cc???? | ||
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