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On May 16 2012 01:37 UpooPoo wrote:
I use stop when microing stalkers cause I don't have the micro to maintain a perfect concave while running away. Hitting stop gets me maybe an extra shot or two because the stalkers that are out of the arc come back to shoot instead of staying where they are and doing nothing if they were on hold. Same thing with marines, hydras, colossus, etc.
Also, I would say my default action when I want things to hold still is to use stop because then the AI helps units run away or attack when given the opportunity. When I absolutely want things to hold still (worker wall, keep DTs from getting up ramp, etc) I will use hold position. Otherwise it's always stop.
This is definitely the kind of stuff I'm looking for. The advantage of hold is that a small portion of your army doesn't get aggro'd and run into siege tank fire, etc etc. So, per game, are there more situations where you want the units you aren't paying attention to to be aggro'd or not to be aggro'd, that is the question.
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On May 16 2012 03:27 JaKaTaK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 16 2012 01:37 UpooPoo wrote:
I use stop when microing stalkers cause I don't have the micro to maintain a perfect concave while running away. Hitting stop gets me maybe an extra shot or two because the stalkers that are out of the arc come back to shoot instead of staying where they are and doing nothing if they were on hold. Same thing with marines, hydras, colossus, etc.
Also, I would say my default action when I want things to hold still is to use stop because then the AI helps units run away or attack when given the opportunity. When I absolutely want things to hold still (worker wall, keep DTs from getting up ramp, etc) I will use hold position. Otherwise it's always stop. This is definitely the kind of stuff I'm looking for. The advantage of hold is that a small portion of your army doesn't get aggro'd and run into siege tank fire, etc etc. So, per game, are there more situations where you want the units you aren't paying attention to to be aggro'd or not to be aggro'd, that is the question.
So, in this new layout you guys are creating, are you specifying exactly how armies should be organized into various control groups and specifically which keys activate those groups ? I get that impression from the detail you're hoping to get, which is well beyond simply determining that both 'Stop' and 'Hold Position" are necessary. If the control group composition is 'hard-wired' into the layout, does that lend itself too much into a particular style of play which would hurt the overall ability to use the layout for other styles ?
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On May 16 2012 04:03 Kaitlin wrote:Show nested quote +On May 16 2012 03:27 JaKaTaK wrote:On May 16 2012 01:37 UpooPoo wrote:
I use stop when microing stalkers cause I don't have the micro to maintain a perfect concave while running away. Hitting stop gets me maybe an extra shot or two because the stalkers that are out of the arc come back to shoot instead of staying where they are and doing nothing if they were on hold. Same thing with marines, hydras, colossus, etc.
Also, I would say my default action when I want things to hold still is to use stop because then the AI helps units run away or attack when given the opportunity. When I absolutely want things to hold still (worker wall, keep DTs from getting up ramp, etc) I will use hold position. Otherwise it's always stop. This is definitely the kind of stuff I'm looking for. The advantage of hold is that a small portion of your army doesn't get aggro'd and run into siege tank fire, etc etc. So, per game, are there more situations where you want the units you aren't paying attention to to be aggro'd or not to be aggro'd, that is the question. So, in this new layout you guys are creating, are you specifying exactly how armies should be organized into various control groups and specifically which keys activate those groups ? I get that impression from the detail you're hoping to get, which is well beyond simply determining that both 'Stop' and 'Hold Position" are necessary. If the control group composition is 'hard-wired' into the layout, does that lend itself too much into a particular style of play which would hurt the overall ability to use the layout for other styles ?
Absolutely not. This will be a fairly flexible layout in regards to how you use your control groups. We will obviously be suggesting the way we think it is most efficient to use, but the 10 Control Groups will be as easy to press as possible in balance with the abilities being as easy to press as possible. (2+2 left/right split like JaKaTaK Righty). Using different Control Groups for different functions than we believe to be most efficient is super easy to do.
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Any release date on this new layout? It seems really interesting if the two of you are so excited about it.
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On May 16 2012 04:40 Sennin wrote:
Any release date on this new layout? It seems really interesting if the two of you are so excited about it.
An announcement is planned. Negotiations with iNcontroL to announce exactly when are currently being negotiated...
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I'd like to announce that we've formed a council to discuss when to announce the announcement.
We thought it would be this week. May still be, but we're working of more analyses. Programming takes time.
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Did you just do an announcement of the announcement of the announcement?
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I'd like to further announce that we've just announced the announcement of the announcement and will be working around the clock until we can make said announcement. We just jumped from 750ish to 2192 pro tournament replays being compiled for data in order to make this setup as efficient as we can make it. We're not going to release a beta test version if there are things we already know we want to change, but just haven't got to yet. When the changes that remain require testing to decide, the beta will be released. Understand that Voltaire is writing programs so that we can have the best tools to get this layout as excellent as possible. We really appreciate all of your interest and patience. See you soon :D
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Can someone tell me how could I self-modify only specific keys?
For example, I would like my space button to be for selecting High Templars in group and comma button for Zealots.
Thanks in advance.
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All you have to do is make your changes in-game :D just download Darkgrid and put it in its proper place. Then load up the game, go to options>hotkeys and make the changes you want :D
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Waiting for this announcement.
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On May 16 2012 09:40 JaKaTaK wrote:
All you have to do is make your changes in-game :D just download Darkgrid and put it in its proper place. Then load up the game, go to options>hotkeys and make the changes you want :D
Can't I do it without Darkgrid? I mean I don't want Darkgrid settings - only to change these two hotkeys and that's it.
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You can modify the hotkeys for any layout in the hotkeys section of the menu. In order to "select templar in a group", you need to assign all the templar to a seperate control group when setting your main army control group. It's not automatic, you have to do it manually.
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What's your backgrounds, Jaka and Foxy? You both seem pretty hardcore about keyboard efficiency. Seems almost like you've studied it.
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On May 16 2012 11:11 Natespank wrote:
What's your backgrounds, Jaka and Foxy? You both seem pretty hardcore about keyboard efficiency. Seems almost like you've studied it.
I'll let Foxy speak for himself of course. I studied music in college. I majored in voice, but I played a lot of guitar before that, and still do, took a swing at piano, drums and a few other instruments as well. Really I'm just an efficiency enthusiast and a puzzle solver. Grew up gaming in a style my friend calls "min-maxing" Spent hours figuring out the perfect GF setup for 3 characters in Final Fantasy VIII, grinding out a 30 hour save file that starts you will all the cards and items you need to get 300 of the highest level magics as soon as you get the refine ability so that I could play through the game without any grinding. Worked on making the highest DPS D&D 3.5 character instead of actually role playing. That kind of stuff. As soon as I saw LiquidNonY talk about using F and D for phoenix harass I realized there was a new puzzle to solve and cracked into it as soon as I could. I love doing this kind of stuff and I'm excited that this time more people than just me will be able to benefit from what we're trying to do. :D
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On May 16 2012 11:04 FoxyMayhem wrote:
You can modify the hotkeys for any layout in the hotkeys section of the menu. In order to "select templar in a group", you need to assign all the templar to a seperate control group when setting your main army control group. It's not automatic, you have to do it manually.
thx
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My parents let me take a ton of stuff apart as a kid, and I'd usually sit up watching NOVA on PBS every night. I always love asking "why" and "how" (a trait from my mother). When you ask those questions, you begin to see the thoughts of designers -- their goals, criteria, priorities, sacrifices, like you're designing it with them. This lead to imitation, and eventually "can I do better".
The answer turned out to be "yes" often enough to keep it fun, and if a try failed there was only 2 possible outcomes: 1) learn even more design from why it performs worse, or 2) see what a stellar design the original was and take notes. As far as those questions are concerned, both outcomes are success.
I had severe wrist problems, and I liked Starcraft 2, but the issues really limited my play. It's funny, because when LiquidNonY mentioned putting control groups on F and D, it broke my mind out of the broodwar control scheme box. And just like JaK, I started finding ways to improve the design. I researched ergonomics, alternative keyboard layouts, and Scrooge McDuck'ed into the puzzle.
So yeah, huge thanks to NonY!
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When did NonY make that comment about D & F ?
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On May 16 2012 17:38 Kaitlin wrote:
When did NonY make that comment about D & F ?
On State of the Game. The patch to customize keys hit in january of 2011 so it had to be after that, but there are a whole lot of episodes of SotG, I tried to find it one time, but to no avail. I would really like to know which episode it is so I can watch it again :D Someone find it and report back here!!!
EDIT: The patch to customize hotkeys hit on the PTR before january! So it may be slightly before Jan 2011!
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On May 16 2012 23:27 JaKaTaK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 16 2012 17:38 Kaitlin wrote:
When did NonY make that comment about D & F ? On State of the Game. The patch to customize keys hit in january of 2011 so it had to be after that, but there are a whole lot of episodes of SotG, I tried to find it one time, but to no avail. I would really like to know which episode it is so I can watch it again :D Someone find it and report back here!!! EDIT: The patch to customize hotkeys hit on the PTR before january! So it may be slightly before Jan 2011!
... and here I thought I was the first to completely change the hotkeys lol... Although I don't know how extensively he changed his 
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EPT
