EPTThe Terran Help Me Thread - Page 9
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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themikeman
United States8 Posts
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diaruga11
5 Posts
On August 14 2011 20:09 themikeman wrote: whats a good way to push in tvz? it seems that recently every time i push i get to the edge of creep, go onto creep a little and the huge zerg army comes and demolishes me. besides using like 2-3 scans, is there a way to not get caught unsieged while pushing? A little more information would be helpful, like what your army composition is and what the zerg army composition is. Personally, i like getting hellions just cuz they do so much damage to zerglings, and that's what ends up killing my bioball. Hellions with the added support of marine marauder medivac should be able to get you past masses of zerglings. | ||
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diaruga11
5 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On August 14 2011 20:25 diaruga11 wrote: Another question, does anyone know how to effectively kill cannons without the use of siege tanks, i personally dislike siege tanks because they are so vulnerable to air and when unsieged they are targeted first and end up costing me more minerals and gas than they were worth. If you're up against a protoss player who's got cannons at his front, if he has a small army you can usually overwhelm cannons with Marauders (usually with medivac support) and stim. As a general rule, though, you don't want to attack into statics-- if he's cannoning up the front of his natural, consider taking a fast third, since enough cannons to turn the tide of a battle (3+) is a pretty large investment in something that can't punish you for taking a fast third. Another option for avoiding cannons us dorpships to split up his army, and other tricky terran tricks. Make sure to use scouting and/or scans to keep an eye on what he's doing behind those cannons, too. | ||
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OmegaKnetus
Germany431 Posts
I tried to go mech in tvz for some time now. But I had to learn that only complete retards lose against mech at all. Once they have hive tech out it's gg anyways. I tried to go for something aside the boring marine tank composition, but it doesn't work against zergs superior late game. So I would like to know some "standard" tvz builds that should have a nice timing before infestors, if possible. Just something that keeps zerg small throughout the game. And keeps their drone spam at bay. Thank you in advance | ||
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Kiaro
United States75 Posts
On August 15 2011 07:09 OmegaKnetus wrote: hello, I'm a diamond terran. I tried to go mech in tvz for some time now. But I had to learn that only complete retards lose against mech at all. Once they have hive tech out it's gg anyways. I tried to go for something aside the boring marine tank composition, but it doesn't work against zergs superior late game. So I would like to know some "standard" tvz builds that should have a nice timing before infestors, if possible. Just something that keeps zerg small throughout the game. And keeps their drone spam at bay. Thank you in advance BFH drop or 2 rax, then transition into a marine/tank push at like 9-10 minutes before mutas get out. | ||
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rickybobby
United States405 Posts
The key is scouting things like the zerg's 3rd base and tech to know when you can push and harass. | ||
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benthekid
United States132 Posts
Right now I can get past early-mid game but the longer the games go I just feel like dropping and stuff is moot because they can just reproduce and entire mineral line of drones. Right now I have been focusing on marine tank with either ghost/marauder/thor/viking depending on which tech path they take. Is a slow push with turrets and bunkers the thing to do? And don't say kill them early or 2 rax because I'm trying to improve vs just win games. Also would nuking be a good idea? | ||
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whoopingchow
United States293 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + MMA vs. Nestea in the recent round of 32 Group A games was an incredible instance of how to do this in the mid-game. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On August 16 2011 05:34 benthekid wrote: what are somethings i should focus on late game tvz? Right now I can get past early-mid game but the longer the games go I just feel like dropping and stuff is moot because they can just reproduce and entire mineral line of drones. Right now I have been focusing on marine tank with either ghost/marauder/thor/viking depending on which tech path they take. Is a slow push with turrets and bunkers the thing to do? And don't say kill them early or 2 rax because I'm trying to improve vs just win games. Also would nuking be a good idea? In late game TvZ, you want to try to safely take expos and use drops or other forms of harassment to take out his expo. If he's going for ling/infestor or ling/bling/muta and it's a big map, you can often drop some hellions and roast a mineral line, or keep on pressuring an expo with marines until it falls. You have to go into it knowing that a lot of the marines you drop won't live to see another battle. I don't think you need/want turrets and bunkers in your slow push, mostly because even if you clear out creep it will take too long to reach his base that way. If your AA is lacking, consider adding more marines and thors to your composition, and focus on building up those infrantry attack upgrades so you can kill his units more quickly; marines are your main damage dealers. Nuke harass can be good, but make sure you use it to split his APM so he has to choose between furiously searching for a nuke and microing his army better, etc. Also Nuke Harass needs ghosts. | ||
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Scila
Canada1849 Posts
Do you/ should you hotkey drops? I see a lot of pros just picking up 4 marauders and making the drop without putting it on a hotkey. It's also really annoying to then select your dropship and 4 marauders, and not be able to stim because the Medivac overrides them. How do you rally air units vs toss? Do you just rally them to a position, or rally them to a unit? Do you/should you hotkey medivacs? Or is it better to just put them on follow on your bio? If you rally vikings to a moving unit, will they attack automatically or do you have to manually tell them to attack when the enemy appears? | ||
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Badfatpanda
United States9719 Posts
On August 15 2011 07:09 OmegaKnetus wrote: hello, I'm a diamond terran. I tried to go mech in tvz for some time now. But I had to learn that only complete retards lose against mech at all. Once they have hive tech out it's gg anyways. I tried to go for something aside the boring marine tank composition, but it doesn't work against zergs superior late game. So I would like to know some "standard" tvz builds that should have a nice timing before infestors, if possible. Just something that keeps zerg small throughout the game. And keeps their drone spam at bay. Thank you in advance Um, hi but no, mech tvz has extreme late game potential. Broods by themselves get demolished by hellion thor if you engage correctly and if he has infestors go 4 rax ghosts as soon as you get your third and always keep 8-15 around in your composition. EMP is a 1 shot wonder against infestor while snipe wrecks broods with no need to waste gas on upgrades to air (snipe is 45 unmitigated damage). Mech thrives late game, lucky hellion attacks only get you so far, keep up with a mech composition if it's something you enjoy and just work on your macro. | ||
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Badfatpanda
United States9719 Posts
On August 16 2011 11:03 Scila wrote: Some unit control questions: Do you/ should you hotkey drops? I see a lot of pros just picking up 4 marauders and making the drop without putting it on a hotkey. It's also really annoying to then select your dropship and 4 marauders, and not be able to stim because the Medivac overrides them. How do you rally air units vs toss? Do you just rally them to a position, or rally them to a unit? Do you/should you hotkey medivacs? Or is it better to just put them on follow on your bio? If you rally vikings to a moving unit, will they attack automatically or do you have to manually tell them to attack when the enemy appears? 1) For the large majority of people who don't have pro level multitasking hotkeying drops will never be a bad thing, if you need hotkey space move over your production hotkeys (takes a while but it's doable). If it means the difference between wasting 4 mara and a dropship and doing damage I'd take the latter. 2) Any rally point has the opportunity to be ran through toss forces so keep an eye out if you can, but I tend to rally toward a static point when I'm not active with my army and rally them to other air units if I'm pushing (as they are faster than bio and will catch up). 3) If you have mv's in a control group with your units they will not heal if you move command the bio, only if you A-move. If that's acceptable, go ahead, there are certain circumstances in which I use it, but the other option is to to highlight the medvac, click M then LEFT click on any bio unit and ta-da it heals and follows it diligently (however if the unit you clicked dies you're SOL) ><. 4) Any unit will engage after it has run its charted rally if you target to a FRIENDLY unit. It will not attack until it has reached the END of its path regardless of how many colossi walk in front of it. However if you rally them only an enemy unit, it will attack once it is in range of whatever it happens to be, but I would strongly advise against that as the effort required to hotkey it on the way is minimal and it'll save you 150/75  | ||
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ComBro1
80 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On August 16 2011 11:03 Scila wrote: Some unit control questions: Do you/ should you hotkey drops? I see a lot of pros just picking up 4 marauders and making the drop without putting it on a hotkey. It's also really annoying to then select your dropship and 4 marauders, and not be able to stim because the Medivac overrides them. How do you rally air units vs toss? Do you just rally them to a position, or rally them to a unit? Do you/should you hotkey medivacs? Or is it better to just put them on follow on your bio? If you rally vikings to a moving unit, will they attack automatically or do you have to manually tell them to attack when the enemy appears? I normally hotkey my medivac once there are dudes in it to guide it via minimap to its location. If you find difficulty in selecting just the bio without the dropship, consider just dragging a box over the whole lot of them then hitting "TAB" to highlight the Marauders. Then you can stim. It takes an extra button press but always works. Against toss, I set a waypointed rally point (if i'm out on the field). I rally everything to a xel naga tower then shift-click it through a bunch of marauders. This way, it'll follow my army but if I lose all 3 marauders that are being rallied to, my reinforcements still rally closeby. I don't hotkey my medivacs seperately; setting them to follow or grouping them with your bio will keep them close by regardless, and if you DO want to micro them seperately, they're easy to grab with cntrl+click since they are over your army anyways. Once the vikings have reached the unit they're rallied to, they will automatically attack nearby units. Against Colossi though you probably want to micro anyways. | ||
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scFranco
United States127 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On August 18 2011 02:54 scFranco wrote: Hey guys, I've been struggling in TvZ, and marine tank makes me want to gouge my eyes out. Are there any non-marine tank builds that are also easy on the mechanics? Basically, no. All TvZ builds require a lot of mechanics and micro; in general, in most matchups, if your opponent has superior mechanics to you, he will win. In TvZ in particular, due to the high speed of zerg units coupled with the high firepower and splash damage on both sides, both the zerg and the terran players need solid mechanics. If it's marine-splitting that's causing you trouble, you may want to go for some sort of hellion/thor attack, which, while vulnerable to roaches and to an extent magic-box mutalisks, is quite effective against the standard ling/bling/muta. What in particular about the matchup is causing you trouble? Maybe with the right style of practice you can get more into the hang of it. | ||
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scFranco
United States127 Posts
On August 18 2011 03:00 Blazinghand wrote: Basically, no. All TvZ builds require a lot of mechanics and micro; in general, in most matchups, if your opponent has superior mechanics to you, he will win. In TvZ in particular, due to the high speed of zerg units coupled with the high firepower and splash damage on both sides, both the zerg and the terran players need solid mechanics. If it's marine-splitting that's causing you trouble, you may want to go for some sort of hellion/thor attack, which, while vulnerable to roaches and to an extent magic-box mutalisks, is quite effective against the standard ling/bling/muta. What in particular about the matchup is causing you trouble? Maybe with the right style of practice you can get more into the hang of it. Basically, I open up with a standard 8 min 3 tank push to secure my natural, and I try to constantly be dropping him, but he always just seems to have more shit than me. I know my macro is not good, but I don't reallly know how many buildings is enough before it's just a matter of me not constantly producing | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On August 18 2011 03:03 scFranco wrote: Basically, I open up with a standard 8 min 3 tank push to secure my natural, and I try to constantly be dropping him, but he always just seems to have more shit than me. I know my macro is not good, but I don't reallly know how many buildings is enough before it's just a matter of me not constantly producing Hm, if you're taking your natural at 8 minutes it's going to be very hard to keep up with the Zerg player, since they usually fast expand. I think that sort of play is fine if he delays his expansion, but if you see him making a really fast hatchery at his natural you might want to expand a little earlier. Having your natural up sooner will give you a LOT more income to work with, and more marines/tanks. You can do a push off of 2 bases to stop him from getting his 3rd and you should have enough production to handle it okay. There are usually 2 builds I think about as good economical but aggressive TvZ openers:  2 Rax Pressure FE is awesome on short rush distance maps or maps with cramped chokes. You basically make a bunch of marines at the start, then make your CC (in base) and start taking your gasses. Your goal is to run around and kill overlords and zerglings (and maybe even drones), and retreat when he gets zergling speed.Reactor Hellion Expand this build expos a bit slower than the 2 rax pressure FE but provides you with a lot of hellions (and a factory) that put a huge amount of pressure on zerg and sometimes straight-up win. You use your hellions aggressively to kill zerglings and drones until he has enough crawlers or roaches that it's not possible any more.By putting on this early pressure, you force zerg to stop droning, and let you get up a fast expansion and make a strong 2-base attack. | ||
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MrArarat
Argentina132 Posts
Thanks for everyone's tips. | ||
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