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The Terran Help Me Thread - Page 440

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions.
dynwar7
Profile Joined May 2011
1983 Posts
January 31 2013 02:06 GMT
#8781
On January 30 2013 23:56 kollin wrote:
As in taking your natural behind it, or a third base?


Natural
Regarding the imbalance, hilarious to see Zergs defending themselves....
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
January 31 2013 08:21 GMT
#8782
On January 31 2013 05:04 Raisa wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2013 01:22 mokumoku wrote:
okay, whenever protoss goes into high templar storms i lose the game.
i scout it so i know it comes, have my ghosts out but i just can't control the ghosts with my army.

any tips on controlling ghosts/grouping them on hotkeys etc.
my army control with ghosts is literally disgusting.


Have MMM on 1, ghosts on 2 and vikings on 3. (or vikings on 2 and ghosts on 3, whatever you like. I'm used to have spellcasters on 2.)

You want to be able to stutterstep and stim without too much of a hassle. If you stutterstep with MMMV on a single hotkey, your vikings won't fire a single shot.


Any tips on how to learn multitasking, controlling and engaging with 3 groups (with 1 spellcastergroup) better. Im somewhat older then most players and i find it hard to master, any tips how i learn to do that better? Just the 1.MMM 2.Ghost 3.Air.

Grandpa over and out
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Cortza
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
South Africa328 Posts
January 31 2013 10:06 GMT
#8783
On January 31 2013 00:35 gkshriram wrote:
This is more a general question than a Terran specific one.

Just started playing a month ago, and have been practicing a lot against V.Hard AI. The problem is this puts you in a very defensive mindset, as it always all-ins, and it is better to defend the wave, and counter attack.

But in a real game, I get way too far ahead before I attack. The last game I only pushed forward and won when I was was 160 to 80 supply wise ahead. And when I try 4v4's it seems like I am being too defensive and turtly even though, when I see the replays I had the largest army by a considerable distance.

The multi tasking trainer and practice against AI seem to have given me a bit of a mechanical edge at the lower levels, but I cant quite get the pushing forward and attacking mentality. Is there someway to practice that? Or some tips as to how to gain map control and attack?

Basically, is this something you should explicitly work on. Or do all players start a bit turtly and then when they are confident with their basic mechanics become more aggressive over time?


I have also been plagued by this mentality. Something about defending and THEN countering is more reassuring, like you now have a good reason to attack, since it's proven he has a smaller army (assuming you held). Attacks in general are more subtle. You have to learn a timing and learn where to probe your opponent. Then it's down to micro and more complex stuff.
Bwall
Profile Joined July 2011
Sweden145 Posts
January 31 2013 13:38 GMT
#8784
On January 31 2013 17:21 govie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2013 05:04 Raisa wrote:
On January 31 2013 01:22 mokumoku wrote:
okay, whenever protoss goes into high templar storms i lose the game.
i scout it so i know it comes, have my ghosts out but i just can't control the ghosts with my army.

any tips on controlling ghosts/grouping them on hotkeys etc.
my army control with ghosts is literally disgusting.


Have MMM on 1, ghosts on 2 and vikings on 3. (or vikings on 2 and ghosts on 3, whatever you like. I'm used to have spellcasters on 2.)

You want to be able to stutterstep and stim without too much of a hassle. If you stutterstep with MMMV on a single hotkey, your vikings won't fire a single shot.


Any tips on how to learn multitasking, controlling and engaging with 3 groups (with 1 spellcastergroup) better. Im somewhat older then most players and i find it hard to master, any tips how i learn to do that better? Just the 1.MMM 2.Ghost 3.Air.

Grandpa over and out


"Dargleins multitasking trainer" is very good for this(it's on the EU server, don't know about the others). It's really just about practice a lot and after a while it'll feel normal.
dynwar7
Profile Joined May 2011
1983 Posts
January 31 2013 14:04 GMT
#8785
Anyone got replays of high level match of TvT bio vs mech, where the bio transitions to sky and wins?
Regarding the imbalance, hilarious to see Zergs defending themselves....
HanSomPa
Profile Joined December 2012
United States87 Posts
January 31 2013 15:20 GMT
#8786
On January 31 2013 19:06 Cortza wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2013 00:35 gkshriram wrote:
This is more a general question than a Terran specific one.

Just started playing a month ago, and have been practicing a lot against V.Hard AI. The problem is this puts you in a very defensive mindset, as it always all-ins, and it is better to defend the wave, and counter attack.

But in a real game, I get way too far ahead before I attack. The last game I only pushed forward and won when I was was 160 to 80 supply wise ahead. And when I try 4v4's it seems like I am being too defensive and turtly even though, when I see the replays I had the largest army by a considerable distance.

The multi tasking trainer and practice against AI seem to have given me a bit of a mechanical edge at the lower levels, but I cant quite get the pushing forward and attacking mentality. Is there someway to practice that? Or some tips as to how to gain map control and attack?

Basically, is this something you should explicitly work on. Or do all players start a bit turtly and then when they are confident with their basic mechanics become more aggressive over time?


I have also been plagued by this mentality. Something about defending and THEN countering is more reassuring, like you now have a good reason to attack, since it's proven he has a smaller army (assuming you held). Attacks in general are more subtle. You have to learn a timing and learn where to probe your opponent. Then it's down to micro and more complex stuff.


This is why good scouting and understanding of game mechanics is important.
He will win who knows when to fight and when not to fight. He will win who knows how to handle both superior and inferior forces.
saaaa
Profile Joined November 2010
Germany419 Posts
January 31 2013 16:28 GMT
#8787
On January 31 2013 06:36 kollin wrote:
TheDwf did some very nice analysis on this in one of the Proleague weekly roundups, I suggest you have a look at that.


hi kollin,

do you have a link for me? can't find it
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
January 31 2013 16:36 GMT
#8788
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=392830#one
PiPaPoh
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
121 Posts
January 31 2013 17:10 GMT
#8789
On January 30 2013 22:03 kollin wrote:
15 minute 3-3 is impossibly fast unless you get double engineering bay at like 3 minutes. 18 minutes is also fairly fast in every matchup other than TvZ.


teja did 3/3 @15min today with a 1rax fe into fast 3rd
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-31 17:23:57
January 31 2013 17:20 GMT
#8790
On February 01 2013 02:10 PiPaPoh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 30 2013 22:03 kollin wrote:
15 minute 3-3 is impossibly fast unless you get double engineering bay at like 3 minutes. 18 minutes is also fairly fast in every matchup other than TvZ.


teja did 3/3 @15min today with a 1rax fe into fast 3rd


035s Building time Eng. bay
160s Infantry Weapons Level 1
190s Infantry Weapons Level 2
220s Infantry Weapons Level 3
-------- +
605 sec = 10min and 5 seconds.

If u start building your double eng. bays before 5 minutes, ur done at 15 min. But, the gascount is so high if u go for duible eng. bays at 5 minutes, ull drop heavily in armysupply because of mist income. Maybe early 3cc build is a must to just get those minerals and turtle like a boss.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
PiPaPoh
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
121 Posts
January 31 2013 17:34 GMT
#8791
He started 3/3 at 15min. But youre right, I see how risky it is to
get early upgrades.
Willzzz
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom774 Posts
January 31 2013 17:52 GMT
#8792
It's considerably less risky if you go single upgrades, at least to start with.

You can easily have 2-0 and a scary number of marines at 11 mins.
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
January 31 2013 17:55 GMT
#8793
But you can have 2-2 and a scary number of marines tanks and medivacs as well as a 4th base at 14 minutes...
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
January 31 2013 18:09 GMT
#8794
On February 01 2013 02:55 kollin wrote:
But you can have 2-2 and a scary number of marines tanks and medivacs as well as a 4th base at 14 minutes...


I agree. Its insane to try 3-3 at 15min.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Willzzz
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom774 Posts
January 31 2013 19:12 GMT
#8795
On February 01 2013 02:55 kollin wrote:
But you can have 2-2 and a scary number of marines tanks and medivacs as well as a 4th base at 14 minutes...


Of course, but it's nice to be able to mix it up once in a while

Your power may grow exponentially but so does your opponents.
llIH
Profile Joined June 2011
Norway2143 Posts
January 31 2013 20:37 GMT
#8796
If I want to get 3CC asap. Is "CC first" then directly CC after the proper way to do it? Or is it common to get a rax between 2nd and 3rd CC?
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
January 31 2013 20:39 GMT
#8797
Well you can go 3CC before rax, but it's pretty fucking ballsy and any competent player will all in you and win. CC rax CC is also fairly ballsy, though against a zerg it's still very much so doable.
Willzzz
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom774 Posts
January 31 2013 20:44 GMT
#8798
3CC is all about the scouting really, after the first CC you need to check your opponent isn't all-inning you. Then you need to prevent him scouting your 3rd CC for as long as possible.
kollin
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom8380 Posts
January 31 2013 20:46 GMT
#8799
If you go 3CC before rax it is blatantly obvious you are doing that though, because you will have 0 marines. Hell, if your opponent does the standard poke in with lings, he will probably be able to deny your natural, that's how unsafe it is.
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
January 31 2013 21:30 GMT
#8800
Just go

cc
rax
cc
bunker
2rax
bunker
etcetc.

Push at +2/+1/stim/combat/medivac/concussive (2 eng. bays eventually) is what your aiming for, so time ur 2nd e.bay and gas accordingly. 2 bunkers i would allways do as u have refund eventually.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
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