EPTI am playing the Bomber 1rax FE build (into 3rax>starport>5rax)
Replays:
http://drop.sc/267242
http://drop.sc/267241
http://drop.sc/267240
I am gold btw, nearly plat but after that loss streak got a bit of a hill to climb again...
The Terran Help Me Thread - Page 385
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Marathi
298 Posts
I am playing the Bomber 1rax FE build (into 3rax>starport>5rax) Replays: http://drop.sc/267242 http://drop.sc/267241 http://drop.sc/267240 I am gold btw, nearly plat but after that loss streak got a bit of a hill to climb again... | ||
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Liszt
Austria86 Posts
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Marathi
298 Posts
On October 24 2012 05:32 Liszt wrote: Hey guys can someone link me the the Blue flame hellion build that MVP used in the GSL finals? I tried looking for it but couldn't find it. Thanks Someone posted in the past few pages, have a look through them | ||
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Qibla
Australia343 Posts
I was planning a 1 rax fe/ He placed a pylon on my cliff next to my wall off. I immediately sent 3 scv's to attack it while he moved his probe around my main. He then placed 2 cannons and another pylon just below the cliff, in range of my depot. I killed the pylon in my main just as my first marine popped out, and placed a second depot to trap in the probe, but I was unable to kill it with pulling all my scv's and my marine. He then used his second probe to sit on my ramp and game was lost. Should I pull more? How do you kill the probe against someone with good micro, I tried stutter step but probe was too fast? Anything else I should do? | ||
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Therapist.
United States207 Posts
On October 24 2012 08:43 Qibla wrote: Just lost to a cannon rush on Ohana. Haven't played vs it in a while so was kind of confused on how to defend it. I was planning a 1 rax fe/ He placed a pylon on my cliff next to my wall off. I immediately sent 3 scv's to attack it while he moved his probe around my main. He then placed 2 cannons and another pylon just below the cliff, in range of my depot. I killed the pylon in my main just as my first marine popped out, and placed a second depot to trap in the probe, but I was unable to kill it with pulling all my scv's and my marine. He then used his second probe to sit on my ramp and game was lost. Should I pull more? How do you kill the probe against someone with good micro, I tried stutter step but probe was too fast? Anything else I should do? So I'm confused. He had no cannons in range of your command center? Just your wall off? | ||
Grobyc
Canada18410 Posts
On October 24 2012 08:43 Qibla wrote: Just lost to a cannon rush on Ohana. Haven't played vs it in a while so was kind of confused on how to defend it. I was planning a 1 rax fe/ He placed a pylon on my cliff next to my wall off. I immediately sent 3 scv's to attack it while he moved his probe around my main. He then placed 2 cannons and another pylon just below the cliff, in range of my depot. I killed the pylon in my main just as my first marine popped out, and placed a second depot to trap in the probe, but I was unable to kill it with pulling all my scv's and my marine. He then used his second probe to sit on my ramp and game was lost. Should I pull more? How do you kill the probe against someone with good micro, I tried stutter step but probe was too fast? Anything else I should do? I find it's best to just accept the fact that you're going to lose your first depot (you should see his cannons before you need to build a second depot), and then build a bunker at the top of your ramp. Not the very top, but build the bunker 2-3 matrix's behind your barracks and keep your barracks alive long enough to get 2 marines out to go in your bunker. Then you can lift your barracks, land it behind the wall after sac'ing the depot, and just hold the bunker so that he can't push in further. Then you can follow up however you like. If you've already started your CC, it's probably best to just finish it and bust out with a 2-3rax (marauders included), or if you haven't then you can 2-3 rax bust, put the CC down, or banshee followup. I find it's useless to try to get a second naked rax down asap. The cannons start finishing before your second rax is of any use.I always always always fortify with a bunker and fall back if he cannons like that. I'm not a fan of pulling SCVs really unless he's actually cannoning inside your main really close. | ||
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Liszt
Austria86 Posts
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mokumoku
157 Posts
On October 24 2012 04:56 Marathi wrote: Just lost 4 games vs Protoss in a row, 3 of them were back-to-back losses to 3gate robo (2 games with proxy robo) I know I made some mistakes with pulling my scvs, and one game I send them back to mine and he snipes my last bunker which I just managed to save, but what other flaws am I making? I am playing the Bomber 1rax FE build (into 3rax>starport>5rax) Replays: http://drop.sc/267242 http://drop.sc/267241 http://drop.sc/267240 I am gold btw, nearly plat but after that loss streak got a bit of a hill to climb again... I'm gold, did the exact same build. Was on a winning streak, and then i vs'd this protoss named "Jupiter" and he did the exact same thing you said, proxied robo, made 3 immortals and pushed and killed me before my medivacs came out. Lost to him twice in a row, then the same thing happened right after with another protoss player. We need bunkers on the high ground, make him come up the choke point. make scvs go to the main base and lift up cc into main as well. need a lot of bunkers, i think 6. After you hold it off it's pretty much game. | ||
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ThePianoDentist
United Kingdom698 Posts
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Galaxy345
Luxembourg28 Posts
Is the problem really my micro, or should i focus even more on macro? Or are there other mistakes i made i can focus on? http://drop.sc/267501 Pls note that i worked on my macro quite a while, and got from mid gold to N1 in my Platin division, playing diamonds in like 2 weeks of serious gaming, i know my Tech was a bit late (as well as my Upgrades) and i could have spend my money better and faster, especially during the engagements. I think tho that it wasnt too bad  I want to stick with the Bio play, cause Tanks already annoy me in TvT and i want to play for fun I know it is possible to get good results with Bio so i try hard at getting them. Thanx in advance | ||
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Sianos
580 Posts
On October 24 2012 21:28 ThePianoDentist wrote: what are peoples thoughts on in tvz after going hellion banshee after gasless expo, salvaging your natural bunker whilst building one in your main just as your first two hellions are coming out. when roach and/or bane all-ins come just lifting natural cc, pulling all scvs into main and defending there seems to be free wins versus zerg all-ins nowadays for me. I've never seen any top terrans doing this though The only chance you have to hold zerg allins is to abuse the choke to your main. This buys you time, so that your banshee and hellions on the high ground can deal more damage. You don´t have to lift your oc, because it can buy you even more time if he fires at it. And every game i saw some pro holding a zerg allin, he did the same. | ||
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mokumoku
157 Posts
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AnomalySC2
United States2073 Posts
On October 24 2012 21:28 ThePianoDentist wrote: what are peoples thoughts on in tvz after going hellion banshee after gasless expo, salvaging your natural bunker whilst building one in your main just as your first two hellions are coming out. when roach and/or bane all-ins come just lifting natural cc, pulling all scvs into main and defending there seems to be free wins versus zerg all-ins nowadays for me. I've never seen any top terrans doing this though Hmm? That's more or less the standard response in that exact scenario. | ||
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Demotivated
Netherlands21 Posts
On October 24 2012 04:56 Marathi wrote: Just lost 4 games vs Protoss in a row, 3 of them were back-to-back losses to 3gate robo (2 games with proxy robo) I know I made some mistakes with pulling my scvs, and one game I send them back to mine and he snipes my last bunker which I just managed to save, but what other flaws am I making? I am playing the Bomber 1rax FE build (into 3rax>starport>5rax) Replays: http://drop.sc/267242 http://drop.sc/267241 http://drop.sc/267240 I am gold btw, nearly plat but after that loss streak got a bit of a hill to climb again... on shakura's - don't scout the close position bunker should start @ 0345 (build 1 marine, then your supply depot, then your bunker, that should do it) keep building scv's first gas should start on 4:30, your 2nd gas should start after you start stim (build techlab with first 25g) (this is the rest of the build-atleast how i do it) somewhere around this time start combat shields aswell next 100 g should be for factory next 150 g should be for starport + reactor after building starport + reactor get 3rd and 4th gas build addons on your rax around 0830-0900 choose to go a 3rd cc or add 2 rax before going 3rd cc. you should know which tech route he is going by 1000-1100 (if colussus go for an extra starport, if archon/zealot go for ghost academy first) add extra rax for 3rd base (3 rax should do it) try to see if he has an idle stalker in front of your base with your first 6-8 marines to snipe it (especially in your league, walk up to first, then start shooting) you even saw the pylon go up, as long as it isnt up you could try to get it down, it stops the pressure. three bunkers to hold of a 3gate robo isn't bad. before warpgate tech is finished you can actually be a bit aggressive with your marines why did you build 2 turrets? the main thing is that you're not executing the build right. check out day9's daily about bomber's 3rax fe! | ||
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SCRedditor
United States57 Posts
For example, I heard the gas timing to scout for zerg is: if he has double gas before 4:00 then he is doing some kind of all-in. Is this correct? Also, I don't know the gas times for protoss. Can someone tell me? | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
On October 24 2012 12:48 Liszt wrote: can someone link me or give me the BO for the proxy maurader rush in tvt? thanks Lol isn't it a bit obvious...? 10 depot 12 rax 13 gas 15 OC 15 tech lab 16 depot Marauder + concussive shells Bring two scvs and challenge the ramp If that fails, when you have three marauders float your rax to the ramp and use the sight and extra range to snipe bunkers/units | ||
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Tactical
United States77 Posts
On October 25 2012 02:22 SCRedditor wrote: Hi, can someone tell me what are the gas timings to scout (in game time). For example, I heard the gas timing to scout for zerg is: if he has double gas before 4:00 then he is doing some kind of all-in. Is this correct? Also, I don't know the gas times for protoss. Can someone tell me? For zerg it's a little different, if they have double gas at 3-4 minutes yes that is a super early 1 base aggro rush, but nobody really goes for that style anymore since the majority of people have figured out how to hold it, and 2/3 base all-in's appear to be much more powerful and harder to stop. If I see gas/pool with my initial scout, I usually scan their main around 6:30 while running an scv by their third into their natural to try to spot any hidden tech, they may have just done a speedling opener to be safe so keep an eye out when they put down their third. If I see completed double geysers and no third, I usually prepare for an all-in just in case. In TvP, if they have both gases completed and mining by around 3:40, it's most likely a dt rush, around 4:15 double gases is about normal for 1 basey play. If there's 1 gas, or double gas but only with 2 probes mining each, they may be going for an expansion before teching. Sneak an scv to their natural around 5:30, if there's no expansion, check their army composition for either robo or stargate units, if none, and there's a really high stalker count it might be a blink/stalker rush. Or if there's very little units, they may have gone for a 4 gate and is worth an earlier scan before warpgate hits. At 7:30 I scan their main, while running another scv into their natural, the information that gives will almost always allow you to prepare properly depending on what you see, if twilight council and no robotics bay, they're probably going for faster templar/archons, and of course if you see the robotics bay you know to produce vikings. If there's no twilight council, or robotics bay, they may be going for an immortal bust, if they have a really high sentry count and an immortal or 2 already, start adding bunkers. In TvT, by 16 supply, no gas, is either 2/4/6 rax scv allin or an expansion. If you kept your SCV alive, you should see whether or not they put down a second gas, and whether or not they dropped a factory. If there's a second gas, it may be blue flame hellions, or cloak banshee, or thor rush which has been coming back a bit lately (still waiting for 1 base battlecruiser again) and occasionally 2 port banshee, or 1/1/1. If there's only 1 gas, is there more than one barracks, or did they plant a factory. It may be a 2/3 rax timing, or a marauder/reaper expand, if there is a factory, it may be no-cloak banshee/expand, or reactor hellion, or marine/hellion elevator. I usually scan with my second 50 energy to figure out their tech choice, while again, running an scv to their natural to check for an expansion and army composition. If you had scouted double gas at around 16-19 supply, and you suspect cloak banshee, add an engineering bay at around 5:15 or so, so that when your second scan hits, you know if you need to add more bunkers, or add turrets. Note, these are just my personal timings on when I like to scout and for what. I think there's another post somewhere that actually lists in detail the timings of specific build orders and when they hit. | ||
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SCRedditor
United States57 Posts
On October 25 2012 13:51 Tactical wrote: For zerg it's a little different, if they have double gas at 3-4 minutes yes that is a super early 1 base aggro rush, but nobody really goes for that style anymore since the majority of people have figured out how to hold it, and 2/3 base all-in's appear to be much more powerful and harder to stop. If I see gas/pool with my initial scout, I usually scan their main around 6:30 while running an scv by their third into their natural to try to spot any hidden tech, they may have just done a speedling opener to be safe so keep an eye out when they put down their third. If I see completed double geysers and no third, I usually prepare for an all-in just in case. In TvP, if they have both gases completed and mining by around 3:40, it's most likely a dt rush, around 4:15 double gases is about normal for 1 basey play. If there's 1 gas, or double gas but only with 2 probes mining each, they may be going for an expansion before teching. Sneak an scv to their natural around 5:30, if there's no expansion, check their army composition for either robo or stargate units, if none, and there's a really high stalker count it might be a blink/stalker rush. Or if there's very little units, they may have gone for a 4 gate and is worth an earlier scan before warpgate hits. At 7:30 I scan their main, while running another scv into their natural, the information that gives will almost always allow you to prepare properly depending on what you see, if twilight council and no robotics bay, they're probably going for faster templar/archons, and of course if you see the robotics bay you know to produce vikings. If there's no twilight council, or robotics bay, they may be going for an immortal bust, if they have a really high sentry count and an immortal or 2 already, start adding bunkers. In TvT, by 16 supply, no gas, is either 2/4/6 rax scv allin or an expansion. If you kept your SCV alive, you should see whether or not they put down a second gas, and whether or not they dropped a factory. If there's a second gas, it may be blue flame hellions, or cloak banshee, or thor rush which has been coming back a bit lately (still waiting for 1 base battlecruiser again) and occasionally 2 port banshee, or 1/1/1. If there's only 1 gas, is there more than one barracks, or did they plant a factory. It may be a 2/3 rax timing, or a marauder/reaper expand, if there is a factory, it may be no-cloak banshee/expand, or reactor hellion, or marine/hellion elevator. I usually scan with my second 50 energy to figure out their tech choice, while again, running an scv to their natural to check for an expansion and army composition. If you had scouted double gas at around 16-19 supply, and you suspect cloak banshee, add an engineering bay at around 5:15 or so, so that when your second scan hits, you know if you need to add more bunkers, or add turrets. Note, these are just my personal timings on when I like to scout and for what. I think there's another post somewhere that actually lists in detail the timings of specific build orders and when they hit. Thanks, I always read guides and they say "early gas means..." while not actually saying what "early" means. What I really needed was concrete times, such as "5:00", "6:00" etc. I have a question, what does "see gas/pool with my initial scout" mean? Do you mean gas and pool before hatch or what? And about at what time? My scout arrives at the zergs base at different times depending on map and position so I don't know what time "initial scout" would be. | ||
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Liszt
Austria86 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
On October 25 2012 16:15 Liszt wrote: Like seriously a shitty protoss player attacks me after I 1 rax fe. I had 2 bunkers but can't repair because the he/she/it literally just one force field ON TOP OF MY FUCKing bunker and my scvs can't reach it no matter what. what the fuck do I do? Are we talking one-base or two-base. There's different answers depending on the timing window, but in general you want to focus fire sentries then unload from bunkers | ||
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