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On March 15 2012 08:24 MoLite wrote:
Hey guys I'm a rank #1 Plat, so close to Diamond. My MMR is Mid-Diamond, but when I get matched with Zergs I instantly lose all my games.
TvZ:
When the Zerg gets 15 hatch I go for Reactor Helion Expand, after I have 4 helions what do I transition into because when the Zerg get's roaches I end up with only marines in my base and so I can't defend it.
- I also go for a Three Tank Push, but it is instantly shut down by Zerglings/Banelings.
I don't know what's wrong is it my approach or macro?
TvT:
I go for a 1 rax FE into Marine Rush or Two Rax Bio. Easy win usually. Don't have a lot of Terran Matchups though.
TvP:
How do I practice harrassing? I am always so anxious in dropping. How can I make them most effective? What's good build orders when the P gets fast storms, what's a good way to transition into ghosts without drainging money on two base. I mean how many Barracks should I have on a saturated 2 base.I usually win against protoss but what's a good alternative to 1 rax gasless FE and 2 Rax Pressure?
I really need help against Zerg.
Thanks!
vZ: Like others have said, keep the hellions alive as long as possible to spot a third, count roaches, and spot pushes. Ideally you also want to be denying creep and roasting any exposed lings at the edge of creep.
vP:
I'd almost practice harassment vZ to practice for vP. The only difference is warpins for protoss. You have to threaten drops, even if you can't land them, so he invests army or minerals to static defense. If you're in, kill the probes and determine what is most valuable thing you can kill (I tend to do a 16 marine so I can kill some probes and pick 1 tech building like a forge or support bay). After, pick up and leave safely. It isn't worth a few probes and some reaction for 10 supply of marines and a medivac.
When P is going fast storms, IE off of 1 or 2 base, you have to respond with academy+moebius reactor ASAP. You'll be cutting into starport gas funding but don't cut your upgrades to make ghosts. Ideally you should be on 5 rax on 2 base saturated with 3/4 techlabs and the others reactored (depends on preference). Get 3-5 ghosts out to stockpile energy and try and grab cloak. If you can rush up to his army without the possibility of a robo unit and snipe off all the templar, you win that engage easily. In this situation you need to expand while you're pushing out with ghosts and not let the protoss grab a greedy 3rd or catch up in upgrades because storm+HT is so gas heavy they can't afford it until they cut gas units (stalkers/HT).
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is there any way of predicting how many mutas zerg can have at particular moment? the guides say I should add turrets as mutaball grows, not 8 at once. in this game I scanned almost completed spire at 11:18 and one minute later 18 mutas brought havoc to my base. should I suspect more mutas because of somewhat later spire?
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Suspect more mutas depending on his gas. Lair+Spire (well, lair plus anything) always takes four gases and gas is the limiting factor of zerg tech. If you have seen a lot of roaches and banelings on the field, the muta/infestor ball will be small. If you haven't seen any gas units on the field the gassy units will come all at once and pack a punch.
Lateness has nothing to do with it, although it can help determine how much gas a zerg has available to him minute-by-minute. a 6 base zerg on 12 gas can make a metric F'ton of mutas at once but a 4 gas 2 base can only make like 10 every few minutes assuming no gas is being put to other tech or upgrades.
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I have some questions about pushes in vZ and vP.
vZ - When does my first push come? I use the three CC reactor hellion opening. Do I push at 2/2? Or with 8 tanks? Do I stack my tanks XX
X
XX
or XX XX
X
for a battle? At what point am I trying to end the game?
vP The point is to keep Protoss on three bases right? Do I try to engage his army before his second tech path (HT after Colossi/Colossi after HT)? Should I kite in major battles (80+ supply)? What are some good engagement points?
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On March 15 2012 18:24 iNViCiOUZ wrote:It's funny how people refuse to try new things. Only because it is not the "standard" it is shit and nobody should even try to make it usefull. But when they do they are talking shit. (oh hi Idra!) Tanks can be usefull for securing a early third base for example on entombed valley (MMA vs Socke @ IEM WC http://www.esl-world.net/masters/season6/hanover/sc2/groupstage/download/26109747/)Watch Naama's stream how he crushes thorugh the korean ladder with tanks. He contains the protoss with tanks & bunkers while taking a third and reinforce with MMM +Vikings/Ghosts Tanks are just not explored in the tvp matchup. But there were also times where nobody used ghosts vs zerg or zerg sad infestors are crap units... MAYBE the tank will take this place in tvp
Thanks for sharing!
On people talking about tanks soaking your gas. Yes they do, thats why you need to cut gas on other fronts.. like marauders.
Im rolling with pure rine into rine/tank into some sort of skyterran in tvp as it is now. Skyterran is still pretty blurry but its starting to work out pretty awesome now. Especially since all P sees tanks and are like "LOLOL zealot/archon/immortal that shit" .. yeh I heard those units are good vs air..
Cheers
Dan
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On March 16 2012 01:47 dotDash wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 18:24 iNViCiOUZ wrote:It's funny how people refuse to try new things. Only because it is not the "standard" it is shit and nobody should even try to make it usefull. But when they do they are talking shit. (oh hi Idra!) Tanks can be usefull for securing a early third base for example on entombed valley (MMA vs Socke @ IEM WC http://www.esl-world.net/masters/season6/hanover/sc2/groupstage/download/26109747/)Watch Naama's stream how he crushes thorugh the korean ladder with tanks. He contains the protoss with tanks & bunkers while taking a third and reinforce with MMM +Vikings/Ghosts Tanks are just not explored in the tvp matchup. But there were also times where nobody used ghosts vs zerg or zerg sad infestors are crap units... MAYBE the tank will take this place in tvp Thanks for sharing! On people talking about tanks soaking your gas. Yes they do, thats why you need to cut gas on other fronts.. like marauders. Im rolling with pure rine into rine/tank into some sort of skyterran in tvp as it is now. Skyterran is still pretty blurry but its starting to work out pretty awesome now. Especially since all P sees tanks and are like "LOLOL zealot/archon/immortal that shit" .. yeh I heard those units are good vs air.. Cheers Dan
That's so weird because when I play, I usually float a lot of gas...
I don't stop tank production either. I actually have a healthy amount of tanks on the field at any given time x.x
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I'm getting so frustrated by TvP because I feel it is the most unforgiving matchup of the 3. If at any point you lose any part of your army carelessly, it feels like you will auto-lose. It just feels like there isn't enough of a defender's advantage in this matchup.
Anyway, general complaints aside, does anybody have any new builds for me to try? I'm willing to consider anything at this point. I've done 1 rax CC builds up to mid masters, and then I hit a point where protoss are able to defend drops without taking damage (especially on certain maps where they can turtle on 3 bases very easily). Every time I play a long macro game, I'm ahead in resources and army by 25%, but I still lose cuz if 2 storms get off somehow, I lose. (And don't tell me to dodge storms, NOBODY dodges storms, even the highest caliber players get nailed by storms and lose cuz of it). Then I tried doing some wonky 2 base marine/tank/bunker timing attack which seems to work only once -- but never again (cuz zealot sentry immortal >> marine/tank).
So can anybody recommend me anything TvP that doesn't lead to mmmgv? I'm so sick of how fragile bio is against templar.
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On March 16 2012 01:51 MaV_gGSC wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 01:47 dotDash wrote:On March 15 2012 18:24 iNViCiOUZ wrote:It's funny how people refuse to try new things. Only because it is not the "standard" it is shit and nobody should even try to make it usefull. But when they do they are talking shit. (oh hi Idra!) Tanks can be usefull for securing a early third base for example on entombed valley (MMA vs Socke @ IEM WC http://www.esl-world.net/masters/season6/hanover/sc2/groupstage/download/26109747/)Watch Naama's stream how he crushes thorugh the korean ladder with tanks. He contains the protoss with tanks & bunkers while taking a third and reinforce with MMM +Vikings/Ghosts Tanks are just not explored in the tvp matchup. But there were also times where nobody used ghosts vs zerg or zerg sad infestors are crap units... MAYBE the tank will take this place in tvp Thanks for sharing! On people talking about tanks soaking your gas. Yes they do, thats why you need to cut gas on other fronts.. like marauders. Im rolling with pure rine into rine/tank into some sort of skyterran in tvp as it is now. Skyterran is still pretty blurry but its starting to work out pretty awesome now. Especially since all P sees tanks and are like "LOLOL zealot/archon/immortal that shit" .. yeh I heard those units are good vs air.. Cheers Dan That's so weird because when I play, I usually float a lot of gas... I don't stop tank production either. I actually have a healthy amount of tanks on the field at any given time x.x
That is sort of true aswell when you think about it. As long as you aint getting those tanks too early it shouldnt be a problem to get upgrades and other things aswell. Just look at the popular delayed tanks in TvZ right now. You can easily squeeze in upgrades with that one, actually even early upgrades. .. and this is sort of how I play it out aswell.
Im currently opening in thorzain fashion with a lot of rines and double vac push into biomech + banshees while I slowly crawl towards more air. The tanks help me not die until I get air and once I get air I usually wtfpwn the P .
The style open up a lot of harass potential while staying alive with tanks.. while getting early expos with a finishing touch of a devastating air armada that will most probably go up against some kind of zealot/archon/HT/immortal mix.
Cheers
Dan
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Hello Terran brothers
Can anyone show me how to drop trick with Medivac ? I mean droping all units from Medivac while its still moving and make a line of rines/rauders/etc. Is it proper micro or sth ?
Thanks
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On March 16 2012 03:35 foxj wrote:
Hello Terran brothers
Can anyone show me how to drop trick with Medivac ? I mean droping all units from Medivac while its still moving and make a line of rines/rauders/etc. Is it proper micro or sth ?
Thanks
Give the Medivac a regular move command and then press "D" (or whatever you have as your drop-keybind) and click on the Medivac.
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On March 15 2012 20:46 neomisbahk1 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 17:55 neomisbahk1 wrote:Hey Guys! I'm a Bronze level player who started SC2 from the beginning about 2-3 weeks ago so i'm like completely new. I used to be terrible and hated my gameplay, but now I feel like i'm getting better. Could you give me any tips that you think will help my gameplay? Also when can I expect a promotion? I'm probably not better than other bronze players, but I just need a goal to set. Thanks for all your help in advance =D. Heres a replay of a game I just did: http://sc2rep.com/replays/(T)BigD_vs_(P)OKENTARO/18738Any tips at all will help, as I pretty much know nothing of starcraft =D. another replay just in case: http://sc2rep.com/replays/(Z)Doraya_vs_(T)BigD/18746
What should we analyze there? it's a timing push from one base against a not scouting zerg. both of your games are < 10 minutes (I don't watch the xel naga one.. ) Both are games that you won. Soo yeah you did pretty well win both games but there is nothing to anaylze.
Post a game > 15 minutes, and you lose so there is something to analyze.
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On March 15 2012 17:55 neomisbahk1 wrote:Hey Guys! I'm a Bronze level player who started SC2 from the beginning about 2-3 weeks ago so i'm like completely new. I used to be terrible and hated my gameplay, but now I feel like i'm getting better. Could you give me any tips that you think will help my gameplay? Also when can I expect a promotion? I'm probably not better than other bronze players, but I just need a goal to set. Thanks for all your help in advance =D. Heres a replay of a game I just did: http://sc2rep.com/replays/(T)BigD_vs_(P)OKENTARO/18738Any tips at all will help, as I pretty much know nothing of starcraft =D.
+ Show Spoiler +
Watch this series and the other videos by this guy. One of the best casters/ analyzers out there, as well as Day[9].
Anyway, one thing that is really important for me to learn; if you are not doing something, don't look at it. As in, if you are just going to A-move with your army (something quite normal for a bronze leaguer), don't bother watching it. Use queues, will help you out-multitask them SO much.
EDIT: Added spoiler.
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No one who can help me with my little anti cheese problem? 
+ Show Spoiler +In TVP when you do gasless fe into 3 rax, what's the best way to deal with a blink stalker allin? I saw a fast second gas, no robo or gateways. I didn't dare float my cc out so I decided to bunker up my ramp. His push hit at like 7:30 with a ton of b stalkers.
He picked off my tech lab so I coulnd get stim out. He then did blink micro while I was a moving my stuff into his army. He didn't lost much while I did. He proceeded to pick off things and he was able to just kill me after a couple of blink ''harassment''.
So, you do gasless fe into 3 rax and you're wondering what he's up to after not seeing him expand and building a fast second gas. What do you do to possibly scout this with gasless fe and how do you deal with a big b stalk ball? I remember a game between MC and MVP where MVP pulled his workers. Maybe it's something like that?
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On March 16 2012 04:46 Bojas wrote:No one who can help me with my little anti cheese problem? + Show Spoiler +In TVP when you do gasless fe into 3 rax, what's the best way to deal with a blink stalker allin? I saw a fast second gas, no robo or gateways. I didn't dare float my cc out so I decided to bunker up my ramp. His push hit at like 7:30 with a ton of b stalkers.
He picked off my tech lab so I coulnd get stim out. He then did blink micro while I was a moving my stuff into his army. He didn't lost much while I did. He proceeded to pick off things and he was able to just kill me after a couple of blink ''harassment''.
So, you do gasless fe into 3 rax and you're wondering what he's up to after not seeing him expand and building a fast second gas. What do you do to possibly scout this with gasless fe and how do you deal with a big b stalk ball? I remember a game between MC and MVP where MVP pulled his workers. Maybe it's something like that?
If youre gonna do a 3 rax fast expand no gas i would suggest getting ghost before teching up to factory and starport. since most of your army is gonna consist of marines, theyll be extremely difficult to deal with stalkers obviously. in my opinion the best way to counter or rather, the best way to fast expand vs toss is to one gas one rax fast expo. because if you slow down your tech vs a toss its gonna hurt you more than giving you an advantage.
Fuu
DailyGamers
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On March 16 2012 05:03 Fuufuu wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 04:46 Bojas wrote:No one who can help me with my little anti cheese problem? + Show Spoiler +In TVP when you do gasless fe into 3 rax, what's the best way to deal with a blink stalker allin? I saw a fast second gas, no robo or gateways. I didn't dare float my cc out so I decided to bunker up my ramp. His push hit at like 7:30 with a ton of b stalkers.
He picked off my tech lab so I coulnd get stim out. He then did blink micro while I was a moving my stuff into his army. He didn't lost much while I did. He proceeded to pick off things and he was able to just kill me after a couple of blink ''harassment''.
So, you do gasless fe into 3 rax and you're wondering what he's up to after not seeing him expand and building a fast second gas. What do you do to possibly scout this with gasless fe and how do you deal with a big b stalk ball? I remember a game between MC and MVP where MVP pulled his workers. Maybe it's something like that? If youre gonna do a 3 rax fast expand no gas i would suggest getting ghost before teching up to factory and starport. since most of your army is gonna consist of marines, theyll be extremely difficult to deal with stalkers obviously. in my opinion the best way to counter or rather, the best way to fast expand vs toss is to one gas one rax fast expo. because if you slow down your tech vs a toss its gonna hurt you more than giving you an advantage. Fuu DailyGamers
To be honest I question this reaction to a blink stalker allin. What is your league if I may ask?
Why is 1 gas 1rax expo superiour to gasless? You don't delay tech all that much, you have earlier starport timings then with marauder expansions and such. Also this isn't relevant to holding a blink stalker allin.
Why do you get ghosts instead of marauders vs a blink stalker allin?
I appreciate that your trying to help but I do not see this help me hold the next time I meet this.
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On March 16 2012 05:07 Bojas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 05:03 Fuufuu wrote:On March 16 2012 04:46 Bojas wrote:No one who can help me with my little anti cheese problem? + Show Spoiler +In TVP when you do gasless fe into 3 rax, what's the best way to deal with a blink stalker allin? I saw a fast second gas, no robo or gateways. I didn't dare float my cc out so I decided to bunker up my ramp. His push hit at like 7:30 with a ton of b stalkers.
He picked off my tech lab so I coulnd get stim out. He then did blink micro while I was a moving my stuff into his army. He didn't lost much while I did. He proceeded to pick off things and he was able to just kill me after a couple of blink ''harassment''.
So, you do gasless fe into 3 rax and you're wondering what he's up to after not seeing him expand and building a fast second gas. What do you do to possibly scout this with gasless fe and how do you deal with a big b stalk ball? I remember a game between MC and MVP where MVP pulled his workers. Maybe it's something like that? If youre gonna do a 3 rax fast expand no gas i would suggest getting ghost before teching up to factory and starport. since most of your army is gonna consist of marines, theyll be extremely difficult to deal with stalkers obviously. in my opinion the best way to counter or rather, the best way to fast expand vs toss is to one gas one rax fast expo. because if you slow down your tech vs a toss its gonna hurt you more than giving you an advantage. Fuu DailyGamers To be honest I question this reaction to a blink stalker allin. What is your league if I may ask? Why is 1 gas 1rax expo superiour to gasless? You don't delay tech all that much, you have earlier starport timings then with marauder expansions and such. Also this isn't relevant to holding a blink stalker allin. Why do you get ghosts instead of marauders vs a blink stalker allin? I appreciate that your trying to help but I do not see this help me hold the next time I meet this.
I agree.
When I face blink stalkers when I FE (I don't gasless tho) You bunker your main, and your front. I bunker the main around where they might blink up, and around my production. From there, get stim, medics, and just survive. Never be afraid to pull SCVs to force a blink out. If you get lucky, scan and kill the OB, and he can no longer blink in until another OB is there.
Pretty much you need to bunker your main once or twice. That's what I do, at least.
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Holy Shit fast all go watch qxc play against white-ra (http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/qxc)
Late game terran with speed reapers alot of Raven and mariners!
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On March 16 2012 04:46 Bojas wrote:No one who can help me with my little anti cheese problem?
You need to pull scv.s in the early stage of his rush because you are still really marine heavy. It's fine to lose some because 2 orbitals crush his econ anyway.
Concussive shields is by far the best upgrade you can get from tech lab if you are facing blink. It finishes fast and you can kill couple stalkers when he's trying to retreat from your base before he can blink.
When you realize that he's going for blink adding 4th rax might help you produce marauders and your not so fucked if he snipes one tech lab.
Generally camp in your base until you get your marauder count up. Try to kill his obs. Also you need to be aware that he can follow blink with dt.s quite easily. Once you have stim and good bio ball you can move out and kill him / deny his expansion while teching up to medivacs.
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On March 16 2012 05:20 iNViCiOUZ wrote:
Holy Shit fast all go watch qxc play against white-ra (http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/qxc)
Late game terran with speed reapers alot of Raven and mariners!
ThorZain uses reapers v. Protoss late game as well.
I think Reapers have a two-pronged benefit in late game:
1) Harass/Deny Expansions
2) Counter Chargelots, which as we know don't have a great counter as Terran.
I like the idea, but am not keen if this will be a lasting change against Protoss.
I was able to beat a high GM Protoss player late game (310k score each player), by PFing and mass turreting the middle, getting +2 armor and +1 range, massing ghosts, marine/medivac, and vikings. Then I massed OCs, depleted all the bases on my side of the map, and forced him to engage as I nuked/dropped his expos. Meanwhile I set up 4 starports and started pumping out BCs, which I concomitantly upgraded to 3/3 while holding the middle.
What ensued was pretty hilarious as he could do nothing against this set up. He would trade his army down for very little supply of my army as he clearly had no idea how to deal with this. (Clearly the reverse of what we normally experience as Terran).
Of course I can think of plenty of things he could have done to counter this.
However, he ended up trying for a fleeting of carriers with mothership. Turns out yamagun and 3/3 BCs, as well as my pack of stimmed marines, pretty much decimate that.
Point being: I think Terran has to keep planting static defenses in the late game. Even a good player like myself tends to float tons of money late game. The solution is to drop tons of CCs at a crucial choke point and defend from that point. As long as you have vikings and ghosts, it's surprisingly difficult for toss to break the position.
I know it requires a lot of babysitting to build PFs and it's time consuming to plant them, but this way, if you're anything like me in TvP late game, you don't get rolled after you lose that one big engagement.
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On March 16 2012 03:57 iNViCiOUZ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 20:46 neomisbahk1 wrote:On March 15 2012 17:55 neomisbahk1 wrote:Hey Guys! I'm a Bronze level player who started SC2 from the beginning about 2-3 weeks ago so i'm like completely new. I used to be terrible and hated my gameplay, but now I feel like i'm getting better. Could you give me any tips that you think will help my gameplay? Also when can I expect a promotion? I'm probably not better than other bronze players, but I just need a goal to set. Thanks for all your help in advance =D. Heres a replay of a game I just did: http://sc2rep.com/replays/(T)BigD_vs_(P)OKENTARO/18738Any tips at all will help, as I pretty much know nothing of starcraft =D. another replay just in case: http://sc2rep.com/replays/(Z)Doraya_vs_(T)BigD/18746 What should we analyze there? it's a timing push from one base against a not scouting zerg. both of your games are < 10 minutes (I don't watch the xel naga one.. ) Both are games that you won. Soo yeah you did pretty well win both games but there is nothing to anaylze. Post a game > 15 minutes, and you lose so there is something to analyze.
sorry didn't realize =]. Heres 2 more replays of me losing, if youre still interested ofc:
http://sc2rep.com/replays/(Z)Derpin_vs_(T)BigD/18761
http://sc2rep.com/replays/(T)BigD_vs_(P)Adross/18760
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EPT
