EPTThe Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 287
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Empirimancer
Canada1024 Posts
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
Second question: In PvZ, I really am not a big fan of the sentry/immortal opening to get a 3rd base. Aside from all the early pressure I could do early with 8:00 4-gates or like 10:00 blink stalker or stargate opening, how would I achieve the ability to constantly trade with zerg while establishing a 3rd? When I played terran, I preferred a lot of MMM pressure to help me secure expansions and get upgrades out, etc, but I'm finding it difficult to find a good transition to taking a fast 3rd without going through immortal/sentry and becoming utterly defensive and passive. Thoughts on how I could play out an aggressive midgame after FFE? | ||
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AirbladeOrange
United States2574 Posts
On July 15 2012 15:14 SC2John wrote: I've recently switched from terran to protoss and I have some things that I just don't understand about protoss yet. First and foremost among them, I'm not entirely sure how to spend chronoboost effectively. For a long time playing terran, I didn't understand how MULES worked...then I just realized I should treat them like larva injects and never miss them and my economy would make sense. But for protoss, chronoboost still eludes me. I find very often that I have 1-2 nexuses with full energy just sitting around, but I don't have any upgrades in the making or important units to use it on at that moment in time. Should I be chronoboosting gateways or probes while attacking? I'm just not clear where the line of "use it when" lies. The most important thing is that you are spending it. Once you are good at remembering to spend it then focus on chronoboosting priorities. If you feel safe and want to boost your economy then chrono probes. If you're attacking or defending chrono warpgates. If you're sitting back and getting upgrades from the forge or tech ones, chrono those. Certain builds call for specific uses of chrono, at least in the early game. If you're following such a build then take note of how players use it and use it that way. Don't drive yourself crazy over it. Just use common sense and check out how other people use it. | ||
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
On July 15 2012 15:14 SC2John wrote: Second question: In PvZ, I really am not a big fan of the sentry/immortal opening to get a 3rd base. Aside from all the early pressure I could do early with 8:00 4-gates or like 10:00 blink stalker or stargate opening, how would I achieve the ability to constantly trade with zerg while establishing a 3rd? When I played terran, I preferred a lot of MMM pressure to help me secure expansions and get upgrades out, etc, but I'm finding it difficult to find a good transition to taking a fast 3rd without going through immortal/sentry and becoming utterly defensive and passive. Thoughts on how I could play out an aggressive midgame after FFE? Adonminus had an interesting variant of the Yuffie build that may be what you are after: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=315275 If not, Monk had a thread which compiled the main and current macro PvZ to 3rd builds. Search for it on TL, or if you go back in this thread a couple of pages, you'll be certain to come across it. | ||
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 15 2012 17:01 aZealot wrote: Adonminus had an interesting variant of the Yuffie build that may be what you are after: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=315275 If not, Monk had a thread which compiled the main and current macro PvZ to 3rd builds. Search for it on TL, or if you go back in this thread a couple of pages, you'll be certain to come across it. Thanks a lot, this is exactly what I'm looking for. It essentially answers my question: "What is a good followup to early 4-gate in order to keep up pressure?" and that is +2 blink stalkers.  | ||
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ZeromuS
Canada13430 Posts
On July 16 2012 00:01 SC2John wrote: Thanks a lot, this is exactly what I'm looking for. It essentially answers my question: "What is a good followup to early 4-gate in order to keep up pressure?" and that is +2 blink stalkers. Personally, I like the robot immortal prism all in bett er as a follow up. Though I see now that you don't want a robot build,but tbh its currently the most stable way to expan. If you do a lot of damage with the zealot 4 gateyou can all in and not provide Zerg a chance to come back. If you expand off the robot you can use a warp prism to scout spire or infestation pit whole keeping them at home. Ifthey aren't pushing your wall, you can get the third to kick in. If they decide to attack with a lot of roach ling, good offs and good sum city will let you do a lot of damage with your prism. | ||
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 16 2012 00:13 ZeromuS wrote: Personally, I like the robot immortal prism all in bett er as a follow up. Though I see now that you don't want a robot build,but tbh its currently the most stable way to expan. If you do a lot of damage with the zealot 4 gateyou can all in and not provide Zerg a chance to come back. If you expand off the robot you can use a warp prism to scout spire or infestation pit whole keeping them at home. Ifthey aren't pushing your wall, you can get the third to kick in. If they decide to attack with a lot of roach ling, good offs and good sum city will let you do a lot of damage with your prism. Well, if I can get this general 4-gate into blink stalkers build down, I think a good followup is adding in a really early warp prism and doing multipronged attacks with blink stalker/zealots, defending at home with a handful of sentries + cannons. The only thing I'm worried about is not being able to trade effectively...but with good micro, stalkers/zealots with +2 SHOULD be able to trade effectively against roach/ling, right? | ||
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Abusion
United Kingdom184 Posts
On July 15 2012 11:02 Drowsy wrote: How do you deal with the TSLRevival response to a 10:30 immortal or blink stalker attack? Basically what he does is abandon his third, box his units, and send them straight to your natural, and they get there right before your units are attacking his third hatch. I'm brainstorming and I just don't see a way to deal with this effectively. For the sake of argument, let's say the map is daybreak and we have a warp prism available. It depends how many roaches and lings there are. If it's his whole army I would warp in a couple of sentry's by my ramp and save all my probes from the nat and then delay him by my wall then go up the ramp and keep forcefielding him off. You can destroy his nat and main and then go round and kill his army. However, its a lot harder with a blink stalker all-in than a immortal one. It's hard but doable. | ||
Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
On July 16 2012 00:58 SC2John wrote: Well, if I can get this general 4-gate into blink stalkers build down, I think a good followup is adding in a really early warp prism and doing multipronged attacks with blink stalker/zealots, defending at home with a handful of sentries + cannons. The only thing I'm worried about is not being able to trade effectively...but with good micro, stalkers/zealots with +2 SHOULD be able to trade effectively against roach/ling, right? Without forcefields it's really hard once his roach speed or even infestors are up, plus speedlings can easily lock down your blink stalkers. These days it's kinda hard to be in the zerg's face playing aggressively without going allin during the midgame, it's either 2 base timing or passive third base. You can crank up the harass once zerg takes a 4th and/or tech to hive. | ||
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Quochobao
United States350 Posts
The problem is all units mix up together, all fighting but not targeting the optimal target. I tried putting stalkers on a different control group, but when T just a move his vikings with his bio, my stalkers have to get into the front (instead of staying to the side), replicating the problem. Can anyone give me pointers of what micro to do during battles? | ||
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boi11
United States2 Posts
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aLmosTeu
Germany101 Posts
On July 16 2012 04:33 boi11 wrote: I have a very had time stoping rauder/rines rushes any help :D well thats very unspecific, forcefields, charge and immortals often help but i dont know what exactly your problem is ^^ | ||
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McTeazy
Canada297 Posts
On July 16 2012 03:59 Quochobao wrote: Any tips regarding microing against MMM? I always find myself watching the battle even though I shouldn't .... The problem is all units mix up together, all fighting but not targeting the optimal target. I tried putting stalkers on a different control group, but when T just a move his vikings with his bio, my stalkers have to get into the front (instead of staying to the side), replicating the problem. Can anyone give me pointers of what micro to do during battles? You a-move. try to flank with zealots or templar. That's about it. Try to zone the vikings with your stalkers. You don't need your stalkers to shoot the bio ball, just position them between the vikings and colossi. Shift attack click through the vikings if you think there's few enough to kill before they kill your collosi. I like to move my stalkers way ahead of my army because a lot of terrans think they're hot shit and fly their vikings around alone. You want to soften them up as much as possible and with blink you can always safely escape. Also, look for an opportunity to storm vikings when they clump up after the terran focusses your colossus. Often times you can kill them all and put them in a position where they're short either vikings or medivacs. Seriously though if you can get a warp prism or proxy pylon behind his army and warp in a round of zealots to deny kiting you will absolutely rofl stomp his army. (assuming you have done splash still alive). | ||
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boi11
United States2 Posts
On July 16 2012 04:57 Tommyyy wrote: well thats very unspecific, forcefields, charge and immortals often help but i dont know what exactly your problem is ^^ I mean that they would get 4 barracks and mass up a massive amout of them | ||
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elctrc_wzrd
Canada61 Posts
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stardin
Israel88 Posts
Thanks <3 You're welcome gl | ||
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Shaddar
675 Posts
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stardin
Israel88 Posts
I have a very had time stoping rauder/rines rushes any help :D Prepare yourself to the 7 minute push, thats usually when it comes. You have to cut his army with a force field on the ramp. Make sure to have an immortal if he has marauders. | ||
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stardin
Israel88 Posts
Any tips regarding microing against MMM? I always find myself watching the battle even though I shouldn't .... The problem is all units mix up together, all fighting but not targeting the optimal target. I tried putting stalkers on a different control group, but when T just a move his vikings with his bio, my stalkers have to get into the front (instead of staying to the side), replicating the problem. Can anyone give me pointers of what micro to do during battles? Put zealots stalkers colossus and immortals in the same group, templars(if you have) on another. In fights, use your stalkers in the front to shoot only the vikings, while the colossi target the MM while using forcefields to keep them from reaching your colossi. Its a trade - stalkers for vikings, and you try to have as many colossi remaining as possible. If you are facing a lot of marauders, immortals are a must have. If his army consists of more than 50% marauders, you should have a higher immortal count than colossi. | ||
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Mr.Bimbles
Iceland457 Posts
On July 13 2012 11:21 Mr.Bimbles wrote: PvP I'm diamond. PvP, basically I suck at it. -.- First If a guy does a good 4g, I can't beat it. Second, in plat I always made robo and just massed immortals gateway units and that got me up to diamond. Now I see multiple casters say doing twilight something into early robo is really normal play, it just seems like a lot of tech. I don't know what to do lol... I like get blink or something, try and do something with it... derp I just lose to everything... I like don't want to do just some robo something, I wan't to do the same as the pro players, but I don't know how!!! What to make at what time or what to do after I get what I'm going after... Third Like give me some knowledge about PvP when to expand or so (etc)... I am like 95% self taught player, so there is a lot of stuff I don't know, that I maybe should know... I didn't get get an answer for my questions  | ||
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