EPThttp://drop.sc/165816
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The Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 226
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. | ||
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elctrc_wzrd
Canada61 Posts
http://drop.sc/165816 http://drop.sc/165815 http://drop.sc/165814 | ||
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xmikeyy17x
United States92 Posts
I ladder everyday but i only get matched up to pvps. pvz i just get rolled. i tried everything. 2 base timings, all ins. airtoss. i can't seem to get an edge over the zerg. And for pvt. my god, the ladder has to be broken because i only see one terran a day if im lucky. just straight pvps and pvzs. i know someone will ask for replays but im not asking for what im doing wrong. i wanna know what the majority master league protoss are doing now. If you can provide a replay/vod. it'd be much appreciated. | ||
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
On April 24 2012 11:16 xmikeyy17x wrote: what are current metagames for pvz and pvt now? I ladder everyday but i only get matched up to pvps. pvz i just get rolled. i tried everything. 2 base timings, all ins. airtoss. i can't seem to get an edge over the zerg. And for pvt. my god, the ladder has to be broken because i only see one terran a day if im lucky. just straight pvps and pvzs. i know someone will ask for replays but im not asking for what im doing wrong. i wanna know what the majority master league protoss are doing now. If you can provide a replay/vod. it'd be much appreciated. PvT metagame is mass zealots with charge. | ||
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Mikelius
Germany517 Posts
http://drop.sc/165886 Basically I was gearing up for a 2 colo with range push after I saw the quick third and mass roach style. However I couldn't really find a good attack angle seeing as how the Zerg has so many points to flank my army from the natural and the third. Since I couldn't do any real damage I expanded and sort of continued my upgrades but I started to feel more and more behind. Then I got a really late Motheship (I had maxed by instinct and didn't leave the supply to get it in time) and just died a slow death to roach/brood lord. I'm basically trying to figure out what I could have done (and being at my level with relatively slow apm certainly doesn't help) but I have very little experience with PvZ late game. I usually either kill or die trying a Zerg before I get a 4th base up. | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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Yaki
France4234 Posts
I do the MC 1 gate FE but I still die to it. Here is a replay http://drop.sc/166043. Thanks | ||
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Edde05
Sweden4 Posts
I'm a silver protoss, and I need help just improving my overall game. I don't really know where to start though :/ I obviously have a LOT of things i need to work on, but I need help identifying those things, how i should correct them, and in which order I should correct them  Here are some of my replays: http://drop.sc/166079 http://drop.sc/166080 http://drop.sc/166081 Would be VERY thankful if someone would take a look at them | ||
monk
United States8476 Posts
On April 25 2012 00:35 Yaki wrote: Hi I'm a master protoss and recently I've been struggling and dying a lot against 2 rax in PvT. I do the MC 1 gate FE but I still die to it. Here is a replay http://drop.sc/166043. Thanks Your biggest mistake was not pulling probes. I usually pull around 4-5 probes vs a 2 rax that brings 2 scvs. Your cb allocation was a tiny bit off. Thus, your 4th stalker was late. If you confirm 100% 2 rax, I would start my 3rd stalker before adding gates. With the last 2 adjustments, you can get your 4th stalker 10 seconds before you did in your replay. Then, pull ~4 probes and mineral walk them/attack move them into your enemy before the bunker gets even close to finishing. The strength of the MC 1 gate is how many units you can get out of 1 gateway. Use your ramp. You can get 1 round of free hits. If you're confident with your control, leave stalker in the middle of the map to kite if your opponent puts his marines/scvs too far up. This also allows you to get a sense of his timing. Target marauders with stalkers. Then, you can just kite marines. | ||
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garsh0p
United States30 Posts
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Random_Guy09
Canada1010 Posts
 ) I won but I think just barely because my second obs was really late and he ended up taking my main (yes sad i know T_T) and didnt capitolize on it and because of how much he invested. Was going an old 3 gate robo build but for some reason I just stepped away from it and am kind of lost on a good macro BO. I was able to do the 3 gate robo opening pretty well in the past but didnt know a proper transition out of it. Anyways here's the replay of me almost losing to DT rush. (if you can call it that) http://drop.sc/166375 Any relevent and constructive criticism accepted. :D Edit: Failed to spell criticism right :/ | ||
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elctrc_wzrd
Canada61 Posts
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SkyBlaze
Canada191 Posts
On April 25 2012 04:06 garsh0p wrote: Does anyone have a replay of the +1 zealot/void timing in PvZ, or a standard build order for it? Open with standard forge expand, then: 20 Gas, Gas 26 Core 28 +1 Attack 32 Pylon, Warpgate 35 Pylon, Zealot 38 Stargate (Chrono Boost Warpgate and the Zealot, all before this was on probes) Zealot (stop zealots at 42 for a bit) 46 Gate, Gate, Gate (Chrono Boost Warpgate and Zealot) Pylon, Zealot 48 Voidray 51 Gas, Gas +1 Armor there you go =p | ||
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Kovaz
Canada233 Posts
On April 24 2012 10:47 elctrc_wzrd wrote: Hello all, Diamond Toss here having difficulty winning PvZ I'm doing an ffe into air and getting my third around 10:30. I seem to do ok till about late mid game where im losing control of the game and basically getting controlled by zerg till i am broke any tips? Here are some replays. I feel as though I am playing to the best of my understanding of the matchup, but it just sirals out of control at mid late game even sooner if I'm not fully understanding what is happening. Is it my macro? My decisions? Should I use a build with some kind of pressure on his third base? By the way I got this build from the day9 newbie Tuesday PvZ build he last showed. Thanks! http://drop.sc/165816 http://drop.sc/165815 http://drop.sc/165814 Just watched through the first game, your probe production was not great. I went into a game vs. AI to see what kind of probe production I was able to pull off with a similar build. Keep in mind I'm also in diamond, and I got supply blocked and was far from perfect in my game. At 12 minutes, you had 51 probes, I managed 66 and could easily have broke 70. You really cut probes for long periods of time past about the 8 minute mark. At 15 minutes, when you pushed out, you had 57 probes. I managed to get 86, which is too many, but you should easily be able to get the 70-75 you want on 3 base. Watching your game, it felt like you were starved for money the whole time. Just work on constantly producing probes and you'll find you have way more army to work with. It's much easier to win when you're not 100 supply down at 13 minutes. A good timing to shoot for is to hit 17 minutes maxed with +3 attack, 3 collossi, and a crapload of blink stalkers. I've had a ton of success with a similar build to yours when I go for that timing, it generally hits right as zergs are trying to transition to broodlord infestor and they generally don't have the perfect deathball up yet or enough spine crawlers. | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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Toastie
Netherlands104 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
On April 27 2012 22:26 Salivanth wrote: How do you take a third against muta-ling? It seems that my opponent always manages to deny my third, and I never get one up, and then die. I'd post a replay, but I don't have any saved: Any general tips would be great, and I'll post a replay or two if those don't work. It's important to know the difference between 2base muta and 3base muta. If he's teching to mutas on 2 bases skipping roaches AND he doesn't have spine crawlers up, take a third and play the macro game like in that thread. A lot of the time on the other hand (ladder, bad) players do these completely random 3base muta builds with basically no defense even when they see protoss is still on 2base, so if you aren't really, really far behind (ie you did 4gate zealot pressure and it got completely denied, you went stargate and lost all your stuff while doing next to no damage etc etc) you can easily just go fucking kill him. An example of a pro game of that happening is off the top of my head idra vs avenge on daybreak in code a. Also, since the buff phoenixes are more reliable anti muta defense. If you see it coming (scout the spire fast) and already have a few phoenixes around, throw down a fleet beacon, get range and like 8ish phoenixes with potentially +1 and bam, any amount of mutas he makes is useless. See Hero's game in this season's ro 32 in gsl code s on Metropolis (i don't remember against who). @poster above me: there's a goddamn sticky -.- | ||
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phyren
United States1067 Posts
On April 25 2012 14:10 elctrc_wzrd wrote: Is there something I have to do to get my posts answered in this thread? I have post about 5 things now all with replays and have never once received a reply. What am I doing wrong? I'll try to answer this one: On April 24 2012 10:47 elctrc_wzrd wrote: Hello all, Diamond Toss here having difficulty winning PvZ I'm doing an ffe into air and getting my third around 10:30. I seem to do ok till about late mid game where im losing control of the game and basically getting controlled by zerg till i am broke any tips? Here are some replays. I feel as though I am playing to the best of my understanding of the matchup, but it just sirals out of control at mid late game even sooner if I'm not fully understanding what is happening. Is it my macro? My decisions? Should I use a build with some kind of pressure on his third base? By the way I got this build from the day9 newbie Tuesday PvZ build he last showed. Thanks! http://drop.sc/165816 http://drop.sc/165815 http://drop.sc/165814 You cut probes in both the games on day break. Actually, you cut probes in all 3 games, but you restart production in the antiga game and manage to get a good amount. This makes no sense, because you always cut before making your 3rd base. If your build is centered on getting a fast 3rd, then make enough probes to use it. The first game you cut around 50 and never actually had a 3 base economy. The second you cut around 60 and did a little better. The last game you actually got to full saturation, but it was still delayed a little. Your scouting past early game is basically nonexistant. You go for void rays for the third and then immediately tech to collosus. This puts no pressure on your opponent (which wouldn't be as big an issue if you actually had the economy to match him instead of cutting probes), but it also leaves you with next to no answer against mutalisks. The third game was the only one where your opponent actually opened muta, and this is also why it is the shortest game. In each case, you don't seem aware that mutas are coming until they are in your base. You don't seem to have any reactive trigger behind when you get a mothership. It seems to be a standardized timing, but it isn't really helping you. You don't need the mothership before your opponent gets hive tech. If you had the extra resources to play around with, then maybe getting mothership before zerg has hive could be good as it is a strong unit against lair compositions also. However, I don't think you actually hit maxxed in any of those games, and your army had a mothership long before it had good upgrades or zerg had hive. In the mid game, you are usually better off with more units or more upgrades rather than a mothership. This comes back to your probe cutting and lack of scouting. With a better economy you might afford getting the mothership, or with scouting his main you might know when you will need it. For both of the previous points I would recommend getting a phoenix or 2. You already have the stargate, they help a great deal with allowing your void rays to harass against queens, they give you a small amount of buffer against a muta switch and make transitioning to more phoenix or blink stalkers easier, and most importantly THEY CAN SCOUT. Those were probably the biggest issues. Other than that you also had the wrong number of workers in gas several times and allowed your army to be positioned poorly in a couple fights,but these are issues that are more game specific than strategy. Personally, I don't feel that this build is optimal, but it isn't seriously handicapping you either, and it will make you practice macro and late game play. Your timings seem slightly off. You aren't always able to start the stargate immediately upon finishing the core, and I think you could be starting the 3rd earlier. If he commits to killing your third before you have units to defend it, then he is also committing to lots of slow roaches and lings that your voids will eventually kill off. | ||
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monk
United States8476 Posts
On April 25 2012 14:10 elctrc_wzrd wrote: Is there something I have to do to get my posts answered in this thread? I have post about 5 things now all with replays and have never once received a reply. What am I doing wrong? It's mostly random when people respond based on the time they look at the thread. For posts revolving replays, I recommend opening a new thread with just 1 replay and posting a longer analysis to get more/better responses. | ||
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