EPT[G] Chinese PvZ - Page 7
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Skwid1g
United States953 Posts
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VeryAverage
United States424 Posts
It also feels less vulnerable because if you didn't do a ton of damage with the blink stalkers, you feel weak with the double robo colossus until you hit a good number. Also, storm drops are hilariously good. The only thing I'm worried about is mass, mass muta. Can't do anything with storm if they fly over your units. I've hit one spire player and I got lucky and blinked up into his main and sniped his spire before he could get a critical mass of mutas. | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
On June 25 2011 09:40 NB wrote: i dont really see how this build is any new... early 2 bases lings with good upgrades infestors crush this (aka destiny forever 2 bases style). This basicly a way trying to apply TvZ into PvZ using the DPS of well upgraded stalks and blink mobility which 2-2 lings +fugnal just destroy it. Any abusing mobility? u clearly hvnt seen blink stalkers +mothership on NA sever... Compare to that build, this one is just child play. Not trying to bash/troll but I strongly recommend people dont use it else you just gona hear more cry about infestor imbalance (which i think is ballanced as a high level NA Protoss) If you see he blindly went for ling/infestor with your 6gate push, you can go chargelot/archon which solves your problem. The 6gate opener is awesome because infestor/ling or a fast third aren't that good anymore. | ||
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IzieBoy
United States865 Posts
i use collosi due to love of the unit really, and build stalkers just as muta/corruptor counter these guys are just amazing... i wonder if i can beat them PvP | ||
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RockOut
Norway39 Posts
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IzieBoy
United States865 Posts
lol i happen to go infestors always unlike some zergs who still prefer mutas this build freaks me out though... when there are cliffs to abuse i can't possibly defend against such a mobile force of stalkers without having my faster lings fly away from my infestors. | ||
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panda_inc
Australia170 Posts
EDIT: by beat i mean KILL u | ||
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skyafterrain
Thailand22 Posts
On June 25 2011 19:17 panda_inc wrote: this build is excellent just need alot of apm to do it lolol. also mass burrowed roaches with ups and good micro from zerg can beat this. EDIT: by beat i mean KILL u Didn't this build provide you an observer. With equivalent micro, I believe Blink stalkers own Roaches. | ||
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panda_inc
Australia170 Posts
you forget zerg players can micro and do timing attacks too. the weakness of this build is the lack of sentries. you can blink all you like but when there is 40 roaches in your face wtf are you gonna do. if you do have a robotics it will actually reduce ur chances of successfully holding it because you have less units. You need very good micro a few sentries and good cannon placement to beat the roach push. EDIT: its a really good build, what I meant by apm earlier was that you have to be very active and careful and tactical with your stalkers. personally I prefer other easier to execute strategies because I feel this strategy can be too risky if you're not careful; and I don't recommend this build at all to players below diamond. Even diamond players will prolly struggle to macro properly while doing this build. | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
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Darclite
United States1021 Posts
I may be wrong, as we don't know all that much about play on the Season 3 maps, but this seems likely in my opinion. | ||
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MassIncestor
743 Posts
On June 24 2011 18:32 sleepingdog wrote: On the problem of forge FE: personally, I'm currently playing around a lot with one gate FE in single player...if you've seen socke destroy ret on shakuras with a one gate FE into blink rush, then you'll know that this can be extremely strong. This does NOT mean that forge FE is inferiour, it's an alternative approach that serves two distinct purposes: a) Make fast 6 gate blink viable on maps that aren't good for forge FE b) Hide your tech as well as possible: one gate FE is inferior economicly but should - in theory - force zerg into a more defensive opening since a one gate FE opening build does NOT exclude a one base all-in, while forge FE does. Your post might be blue, but that's not how Zerg early game works. 1gate FE goes down at 5:10, up until that point there is exactly _0_ deviation in what a Zerg does between FE and fast Cyber. Putting a Nexus down that early DOES exclude a 1-base-allin. And please don't argue with Nexus-cancel-4gate. You don't take a 3rd before that against Forge/Nexus FE anyways because you want more drones before spending 300 minerals on a new hatchery. On maps that favor Forge FE there is absolutely no reason not to do it, if you chrono your probes you can keep up with Zerg worker production without a problem, it's quite hilarious actually, to see a Zerg pumping pure drones off 4 Zerglings, and MC being able to keep up with that into the early 50's of the harvester-count. | ||
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ItsMartyz
Netherlands17 Posts
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vOdToasT
Sweden2870 Posts
I gotta deal with this shit too? I+ Show Spoiler + t's a good strategy, and a good guide too. | ||
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ItsMartyz
Netherlands17 Posts
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
On June 25 2011 17:35 Arcanefrost wrote: If you see he blindly went for ling/infestor with your 6gate push, you can go chargelot/archon which solves your problem. The 6gate opener is awesome because infestor/ling or a fast third aren't that good anymore. "SEE" is an interesting concept here where u committing to a 2 bases timing attack and ignore scouting tech. As the OP said, 3rd bases is almost never an option in this kinda strategy. How does chargelots archon is good when an infestor just fugnal a ball of zealot and they cant do anything? everyone should know by now that with the infestor ling strat, by the normal time P push out with +1, lings already half way to +2+2 with at least 5 spine crawler. Again, Infestor is the hard counter to any sort of stupid 2 bases rush that Protoss bring on the table. Go watch destiny and you will understand. strat like (im not taking my 3rd base etc) should never be taken seriously the better you get. | ||
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Xaeldaren
Ireland588 Posts
I'm ashamed to admit it but I'm in Silver league and no one plays for a macro game, I'm getting hammered constantly by early Zerglings/Roaches. | ||
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darkscream
Canada2310 Posts
Ling/Roach is our way of saying, "Bet you can't macro that well under pressure" to a fast expanding protoss. We're usually right, in my experience. I hate blink stalkers. They're the most cost effective thing in the game if you get them before I get infestors. You can kill infinite amounts of certain zerg units with proper micro and the micro is very easy for you. If I get a whiff of this build when I scout you, you're getting a roach/ling all-in, because I'd rather just kill you than deal with that shit So, that means this build is really effective, and you should be very wary for early zerg all-ins because we hate blink stalkers. So much. I would like to know what Protoss are afraid of seeing against this build, as if I let it happen, I pretty much lose every time. There doesn't seem to be a zerg "macro oriented" solution to these blink stalker builds. | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
On June 26 2011 06:53 NB wrote: "SEE" is an interesting concept here where u committing to a 2 bases timing attack and ignore scouting tech. As the OP said, 3rd bases is almost never an option in this kinda strategy. How does chargelots archon is good when an infestor just fugnal a ball of zealot and they cant do anything? everyone should know by now that with the infestor ling strat, by the normal time P push out with +1, lings already half way to +2+2 with at least 5 spine crawler. Again, Infestor is the hard counter to any sort of stupid 2 bases rush that Protoss bring on the table. Go watch destiny and you will understand. strat like (im not taking my 3rd base etc) should never be taken seriously the better you get. I am not by any means commiting to a 2base push. The 6gate zealot +1 is to put pressure on him and give him trouble if he has a fast third. I use my push to scout what composition he has and get hallu to scout later on. Also how can the zerg possibly have 2/2 by the 9min mark. And 5spine crawlers is quite the exaggeration, if he really did get 5 of them he's way overreacting and you can just take your third. I thought people reached a consensus on chargelot/archon being one of the best unit compositions against doubleling infestors. I don't recall saying "third base is almost never an option", expo timing is between 10:30 and 12:00 in a standard game, although if you can do damage you can get it later like lovecd and lovett. And I'm not sure why you call this "a stupid 2base rush", the gameplan is to go into lategame with a lead created by constant midgame pressure. | ||
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Dhalphir
Australia1305 Posts
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