EPT[G] Chinese PvZ - Page 2
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gejfsyd
Poland156 Posts
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oDieN[Siege]
United States2904 Posts
I feel it's going to be a pain dealing with mass zergling/infestors and banelings. | ||
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Synystyr
United States1446 Posts
I've been wondering now though...how would Shield upgrades play into this? A good Blink stalker player would poke in and take minimal damage to shields and pull back. With the fast recharge time, would it be better to take a little less damage via Shield upgrades and then pull back to recharge and repeat? Or are attack upgrades better for the sustained damage? | ||
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Jayrod
1820 Posts
If they are going anything else you want attack. Honestly double forge might end up appropriate if they are going heavy melee comps. I used to always get only attack up to +3 asap since blink stalkers are so recyclable, but I got some ideas from HuK this past weekend and prioritizing armor makes your stalkers last forever against lings... he even got shield upgrade before attack, right after armor, in the finals on TDA. Just some food for thought | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
On June 23 2011 00:58 Markwerf wrote: Not going colossi is still a waste imo against roach play. You want the robo for obs anyway and investing in some colo just gives you so much more push power. Against heavy ling strats this is awesome though as the only way for them to deal with it is infestors which come quite late letting toss expand faster then the zerg. It naturally transitions well into chargelot archon as well which deals with anything not using roaches. I don't like the opening though, why would you go hallucination especially when you are only getting 3 sentries anyway? doesn't make sense. Stargate into this is much more reliable, you get that little bit of early pressure and you often force them into a form of defense which is terrible against blink stalker play (slow ass hydra's, spore's or even corruptors). Phoenix are also quite useful for lifting infestors, critical if you want to escape. I do think the overall tendency in PvZ is to get a little less sentries, 6 or so usually is enough and leaves more gas for quick tech. Too many sentries is only a vulnerability against some strategies anyway and with good control 6 will do against roach play imo. I disagree. If you go colossi too fast you won't have enough blink stalkers to really threaten him and he will take an economy lead with ease. You cut probes so you have to pressure a lot to justify it. If you want to go 2base colossi, sentry expo transitions a lot better. Hallucination is only 100/100, I get those 3 sentries mostly for hallu scouting (which you really need later on to scout for tech, 4th/5th/Xth base and his tech to broodlord/ultra later on anyway) . You get a scout of all possible expos, his army comp, his tech, everything in return so it's well worth it imo. I don't get why you would want to go stargate into blink. Stargate is very expensive, will leave you vulnerable to hydra all-ins, delays your ht/colossi tech and is only good for harass. There's just no synergy between air and blink stalkers. 6 sentries is too few imo, you will inevitably lose sentries in a big battle and you better have some ff left for his reinforcements. You always need a lot of good forcefields in order to beat zerg, it's insane how fast your army dies without them. | ||
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moskonia
Israel1448 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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caradoc
Canada3022 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + been using a +2 timing off a FFE version of this for the past few weeks, its very strong. I dont want the metagame to start shifting to take it into account. Fast third is okay vs. this. Fast infestors is strong. | ||
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Kornholi0
Canada634 Posts
But yes generally blink stalker is easy to deal with when you get hydra roach (you just hug his army every time he blinks) | ||
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ComebackKid
Canada105 Posts
I've seen a lot of pros use this strat. My fav example is MC vs Idra MLG Columbus game for 4th, where MC goes pure blink stalker in the late game. At first i thought, "there is no way MC is guna pull this off". However, his attack upgrades were double Idras (if i remember correctly) and, with DT harass, he managed to take out Idra, even on a head on fight against hydra, roach with a few lings. Granted, Idra had a lot of supply invested in corruptors, but still his main army was very formidable and it was very interesting to see blink stalkers work so well against his composition. I think this strat works the best on larger maps, or cross spawn on smaller maps, like meta, temple etc... From my experiences, 1200 ranked master league protoss, Zerg will still roach rush a lot on close spawns and 2 player spawn maps. So the blink stalker limited sentry opening is vulnerable and easily thwarted. However, if it is a cross spawn or bigger map, the zerg will usually play a macro game, and it gives you the time needed to build up a nice army for a timing attack around 9-10 min. I have an average apm of about 170 throughout the entire game. I feel like, even with my apm that high, i need to increase my amp to pull off this build and still macro correctly/react to my opponents build. I feel like lower levelled players wouldn't be able to pull off this strat. And i think they might not appreciate a strat like this because of the high level of play it requires. | ||
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socommaster123
United States578 Posts
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Nemasyst.598
United States285 Posts
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CurLy[]
United States759 Posts
If you watch Idra replay posted here you can see that Idra had the right comp but played like shit. + Show Spoiler + He went ventral sacs but tried to A-move his banelings instead for some reason??? He got infestors but never used fungal??? More a-move ??? Dude needs to incorporate some tactics with that macro. | ||
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CrazyF1r3f0x
United States2120 Posts
Wouldn't Pylon then a forge be more efficient? personally I found 9 pylon 12 forge to be the safest because if you do scout early pool aggression you can build a pylon near your nexus and place a cannon in your mineral line. | ||
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BlindSC2
United Kingdom435 Posts
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Blasterion
China10272 Posts
Blinkers definitely have so much possibilities to be explored. The mobility is incredible. China Fighting. | ||
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rsvp
United States2266 Posts
My variation on this is slightly different though, but I think it helps with the 2 main weaknesses of this build: fast 3rd and mass ling followed by infestors. What I do is open with a FFE into really fast 6 gate +1 zealots. I still get all 4 gases though to start building up that gas supply. As soon as I warp in my first 6 zealots, I attack (or poke), while starting my TC back at home. A fast 3rd by the zerg gets into trouble by this, especially if all they have are lings. If they are able to fend it off easily with roach/ling, then it just means they haven't made enough drones to even make use out of their 3rd, and you're probably ahead on economy. When the TC goes up I chrono blink and switch to stalker production, unless they've stayed purely on lings. I don't get any sentries. With the saved up gas I also tech to HT. I feel that the early zealots are great because it forces more roaches (which is fine for you when you get blink stalker), and also it gives you more gas to get more HTs to combat infestors better. | ||
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windsupernova
Mexico5280 Posts
Blink stalkers have such an awesome mobility. When I encounter things like this when I play Zerg I think Ling Hydra does fine(not really a counter but it lets you survive) until you can get infestors. A DT followup may be useful too, many Zergs just don´t sweem to remember that either templar tech is a natural followup to this and since you have highish weapons DTs are much more effective | ||
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QTIP.
United States2113 Posts
On June 23 2011 00:00 marvellosity wrote: I'm only in Diamond and I've been using this build a while (the general 7 gate, blink, +2, obs). Does that mean I'm ahead of my time? :D It is very, very good. I've not lost with it yet in about 10 attempts. What I like is that it can be somewhat all-inish - never resume probe production, don't expand, CB gates, or you can expand behind it with blink, +2, and robo already up. infestors shut this down. ling infestor | ||
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pycho
Paraguay372 Posts
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Thorxes
United States119 Posts
You do however need the observers for burrowed roaches. If the Zerg scouted your blink stalkers, they're sure to get burrow for defensive purposes. Also, I like the idea of following up with DT's if things go well. Which lends itself to not going stargate since spore crawlers negate the DT harass. I like the strat and used to try it a lot. But that was when I was bad and didn't have very good control. I think they key point is to make sure you hit before infestors....follow up with dt's once you get a third, and just make sure your home bases are defended well if the zerg starts zergling runby's. I fear early game push strats though. Not sure how one would react to each accordingly as the guide doesn't really mention a response to any. | ||
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