Ive been using this build in all of my ZvT games and it totally rocks! I usually have the infestor energy upgrade going around 9 minutes then +3+5 ultras around 14-15 minutes Ultras with upgraded cracklings/Baneling/Infestors w/NP own any terran ground army as long as you engage correctly. By the time I have my maxed army I can throw down a spire for the hell of it and pump mutas after ive cleared out some supply to deal with any banshees/drops the terran might try using. But in most games my mid game maxed army wins the game with cracklings streaming in for reinforcements.

lifecanwait

96 Posts

February 16 2011 21:05 GMT

#142

Nothing new imho. I guess TLO was the first who has shown this style of play a long time ago.

As Terrans are evolving nowadays a lot ( overall better mix of units/ more mech), you won't meet a lot of BIO only-builds in the near future anyway - that's at least what I expect.

AlgoFlash

Canada96 Posts

February 16 2011 21:06 GMT

#143

Ive tried it last week end and got crushed by mass hellions/banshees. My macro wasn't perfect though. It's definitely very entertaining to play, and refreshing not to spawn those mutas in ZvTs.

sixghost

United States2096 Posts

February 16 2011 21:45 GMT

#144

On February 15 2011 17:28 Whitewing wrote:
Zerg shouldn't have a lot of trouble with drops if you're playing well, spread those overlords out, and lots of creep. You should have vision everywhere as a zerg player, and should see drops coming a mile away.

I love theorycraft

Chinesewonder

Canada354 Posts

February 16 2011 21:57 GMT

#145

Thanks Mr.Bitter,

Just tried this and was getting used to it, still won every game so far. It feels great. I dont feel like if I dont harass my mutas are useless. I love the cushion that lings provide, b/c they are so cheap. Just wondering what you do when they get lots of hellions. Was thinking of mixing in banelings since they do alot of damage to them. Blings + fungal growth should deal with it?

KiaL.Kiwi

Germany210 Posts

February 16 2011 22:36 GMT

#146

Really like the idea behind the build and tested it today - had a lot of fun playing it as it feels a lot less stressful then making Muta/Ling/Bling work. Being able to rush in and crush small and middle sized armys instead of having to dance with your Mutalisk like a madmen sure is very satisfying.

I'd like to test it more against mech/hellion play, since including Ventril Sacks somewhere along T2 and just dropping Ultras into the Tanks could work out quite well. Sadly most Terrans on Europe play Marine/Tank/Medivac only.

Enyalus

United States135 Posts

February 16 2011 22:37 GMT

#147

This looks very cool, Mr. Bitter. ZvT is my worst matchup by far.

I haven't tried this out yet, but I'd like to know when you can take a third with this build? In the typical ling/bling/muta, it's right when your first mutas pop. So when do you feel safe enough to grab a third with this style? Do you just play it by the ear? Scout a ton with lings?

deathserv

United States228 Posts

February 16 2011 22:50 GMT

#148

I've been watching your stream a lot lately when I am on break from classes, and I have really been enjoying watching this new style develop. I am not confident enough to rely on it myself yet, but I think I will start practicing it more. My attempts so far have had me dominating the midgame but then losing to MASS Medivacs later on. I need to transition to Ultra/Bane sooner, it seems. But I definitely realized the power of this style from how well I was controlling the midgame.

Thanks for your contribution, and keep up the good work on your stream.

Dice17

United States520 Posts

February 16 2011 23:04 GMT

#149

Well hats off to this gentleman for refining and making a variation of TLOs original build. Lots of ppl have been playing with since it was represented. I myself have my own variation of this build and it definantly works but to those of you who havent seen this yet you now have an active streaming using his variation of TLOs build

MrBitter

United States2940 Posts

February 16 2011 23:15 GMT

#150

On February 17 2011 07:37 Enyalus wrote:
This looks very cool, Mr. Bitter. ZvT is my worst matchup by far.

I haven't tried this out yet, but I'd like to know when you can take a third with this build? In the typical ling/bling/muta, it's right when your first mutas pop. So when do you feel safe enough to grab a third with this style? Do you just play it by the ear? Scout a ton with lings?

Same timing basically. You get map control back when your infestors pop. That's a pretty good time to expand.

Yagulare

Poland42 Posts

February 16 2011 23:42 GMT

#151

I can try to answer you Chinese. Since festors and ultras are out hellions aren't worth much cause of fungal and large ultra model, you can also fungal em to death but if you feel uncomfortable there is no reason not to make some roach/blings as you have plenty of gas most of the time

mothergoose729

United States666 Posts

February 17 2011 00:19 GMT

#152

I agree with this completely. In my games, I like to get a 3-5 mutas to start with for scouting purposes, and to force terran to build turrets. I have started to move a lot more heavily to an infestor/mass ling bling style in the late game with lots of success. I think another thing that has not been explored enough is roaches in the mid and late game to take on the role of meat sheilds and tank nullifiers. Many terrans go marine/tank/thor heavy, and a 200/200 food roach army deals with all those units quite well.

I appreciate your contribution Mr.bitter. A big fan of your stream and these are great guidlines for an infestor build.

Whitewing

United States7483 Posts

February 17 2011 00:24 GMT

#153

On February 17 2011 06:45 sixghost wrote:

Show nested quote +

I love theorycraft

Here's the thing though: when you theorycraft, you need to do it for the highest calibur of play. This means you should be able to remember, as a zerg, to spread that creep and spread out your overlords to get vision everywhere, and watch your mini-map. Unless he's going around picking off overlords the whole match (something that is annoying, possible, but leaves him open to various timing windows and slows his build down etc.), you should see drops coming.

vaLentine88

United States61 Posts

February 17 2011 00:50 GMT

#154

Played this way a few games today and had a lot of fun!

Keys to remember are definitely the ling upgrades and hive timing. I also like getting 5-6 infestors rather than just 4.

zylog

Canada943 Posts

February 17 2011 01:25 GMT

#155

It will be interesting to see what Idra thinks about this type of strategy when you go over ZvT with him. I find it interesting to see so little infestor play in the GSL tournaments especially with mass marine play being so prevalent. Fruitdealer used them in S1, no one used them in S2, I think Leenock tried them vs MKP in S3 (but lost); it makes me wonder if there's some kind of timing this tech choice is vulnerable to that the Korean zergs are afraid to go for it.

It would also be interesting to see what kind of early game actions would favour mutas vs infestor midgame builds. For instance, more marine heavy play would favour infestors, but maybe hellion into banshee would be better with mutas. Of course, once you do go mutas, you have to decide whether you want the fast +1 attack and continue massing them, or if you want to just force some turrets, stop drops and then transition into infestor/hive play.

nick1689

Australia494 Posts

February 17 2011 01:38 GMT

#156

I used this playstyle for a bit yesterday. Ive been combining it with alot of nydusing and baneling drops, and its been quite effective

MrBitter

United States2940 Posts

February 17 2011 09:25 GMT

#157

By popular demand, IdrA playing my build against LZGamer:
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/140681-1v1-terran-zerg-xelnaga-caverns

FinestHour

United States18466 Posts

February 17 2011 09:27 GMT

#158

Fought this build the other day. It pretty much shut down any kind of harass I tried to do against the zerg and the longer the game went I just got more and more behind. You would think that you could harass easier with no mutalisks giving the zerg such mobility but you'd be wrong...