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Hello everyone,
Recently, I've had a lesson with InControl from team Eg and Gosucoaching. The lesson went fantastically well, and luckily, I recorded it! So it's beena while before I figured out that own3d.tv has a very generous file size limit for their uploads, as well as easy share. So I've uploaded the video to both of those websites. I have already posted the uploaded file in to Khaladas' great thread PvZ InControl Coaching, but I've put it on Own3d.tv for easier viewing, and I felt this might deserve its own thread for more people to see this.
The lesson focuses on PvT, expansion timings, unit composition,etc. Basically, I used to 4 gate in PvT (no other match-up), and I really didn't like that. If you want to know, I'm in High Platinum (So that's the skill level of the lesson). So basically this went over all the little intricacies of this PvT style, which is essentially a 2 gate robo expand in to 4 gate way robo stargate. Needless to say my win rate in PvT has shot up!
So without further ado, and here all the links:
own3d.tv VOD
Easy Share Link (Sorry, but this is theonly website with big enough file capacity)
Khaladas' Mediafire link (Thanks)
Replay Pack
Once again, thanks InControl for the help, and thanks for permission on letting me post this. It's a great service to the the community.
Mods: I didn't know what to label this, so I'll just label it as Discussion, as people will probably discuss the lesson in this thread.
EDIT: Adding that I'm in Platinum so people know the skill level of the lesson. Added Mediafire link.
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sweet thanks, I love these things. I always like taking these types of lessons and comparing the builds given to similar builds of other top players and seeing the stylistic differences. I've got my own builds but can always learn from shit like this.
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Dominican Republic913 Posts
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big thumbs up for sharing this, and kudos to InControl for giving his approval.
i found this to be pretty damn helpful, altough i think incontrol should have pointed out that your micro/positioning was pretty sloppy during the major engagements. you didnt use guardian sheild and most of your zealots where blocked behind your stalker concave. I noticed it mainly because this is a mistake i make too often myself wich sometimes results in me losing a battle that i could and should have won with some better micro/positioning.
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thanks....PvT is getting iffy for me...needed this video
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Whenever i hear geoffs voice, i want to hug him. He such a humgle guy.
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thanks for sharing, much appreciated
and as always thanks to inc for allowing all these lessons to be released
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L1F3, you are a gentleman and a scholar.
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PvT is by far my most difficult matchup. I've only watched the first half hour so far, and I already feel l've gotten a lot out of it. Thanks so much for sharing your lesson with us, and thanks to InControl for being such an outstanding member of the community and supporting the sharing of his lessons!
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InControl is making P imba. He needs to be nerfed.
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"With my cold black eyes."
So glad I caught that SotG reference.
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Sorry bout that, the other Khaladas one's are in Strategy so I thought these would be placed here as well. Anyway, I uploaded a replay pack, so that people can see the gam'e being played out if they want to.
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Braavos36374 Posts
We must have missed them. As these become more frequent they cannot all be in the Strategy section without some sort of organizational thread.
We'll get back to you about how these will be handled, for now it can stay in Strategy.
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Oh well, more people will be able to see it in Strategy I think.
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Thanks for these! My PvT has taken a bit of a nosedive, so any tips are appreciated.
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Good lesson from inControl but I prefered his strategy vs zerg, I prefer dt harass into ht for pvt
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a sticky thread of coaching sessions would be a good idea imo
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Canada13389 Posts
always nice to see incontrol coaching sessions sice they are always very informative and helpful.
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Thank you so much for this. The only matchup anyone is ever talking about right now is PvZ and it is seriously pissing me off as PvT is way cooler 
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These are very nice, thank you for your thoughtfulness
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Helpful stuff. Thanks to you and InControl for sharing this!
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Thank you so much for sharing this! PvT is my absolute worst matchup, and I love seeing these inControl videos 
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inControl>>>>best protoss coach out there.
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well what for me lacks in this video is the use of drop harass by terran,
i mean sure if protoss can macro up without any immediate threat and expo pressure he is gonna come out on top with the proper unit composition.
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ive got a question if any1 can answer:
How would you guys advise to play 2 gate robo vs that 50 food stim/combat shield 3 rax timing? I cant hold that thing off ever =(((
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u have to cut him in half with ff so zealots can actually deal dmg.
dont rush for collosus, because imortals are very important
may u have to pull some probes
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one question to incontrol, if hes reading
i do the same build, but i add 2 stargate for fenix. do think its more effective or just do more gates?
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Canada13389 Posts
On January 29 2011 22:02 TomTomTom.965 wrote:one question to incontrol, if hes reading i do the same build, but i add 2 stargate for fenix. do think its more effective or just do more gates?
I'm not incontrol but I also use 2 stargates when I do a similar build. However for me, I like to tech to carriers as well once I get a lot of pheonix. Just 2 carriers do amazingy as support units.
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On January 29 2011 21:55 TomTomTom.965 wrote:
u have to cut him in half with ff so zealots can actually deal dmg.
dont rush for collosus, because imortals are very important
may u have to pull some probes
this makes no sense at all. if you want to optimize the efficiency of zealots against marine/marauder you should always make a cup behind their troops. if you cut them in half you will actually block your zealots from attacking the other half once the frontline is dead, while the ranged terran units can still shoot down your zealots.
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On January 29 2011 21:41 Reignyo wrote:
ive got a question if any1 can answer:
How would you guys advise to play 2 gate robo vs that 50 food stim/combat shield 3 rax timing? I cant hold that thing off ever =(((
Get a third gate and use forcefields. Depending on how well you hold it off you can either counter attack and just go fucking kill him, or expand and macro up.
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Yeah, he mentioned you don't want to expand against 1 base timing pushes like that 3 rax. And about drops, I find that minimap awareness with pylon spreads do very we against that thing early game. And no terran will want to drop once you have pheonixes. HuK does very good pylon spreads and xel naga tower usage in his pvts.
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As I've watched all Incontrol Lessons that have been uploaded so far I really appreciate this a lot. Huge thanks L1F3 and Incontrol for this.
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Just from watching, I'd say if you expand more aggressively and add the right amount of production buildings as the game goes on (it's okay to add "too many" gateways, especially if you're banking a lot), you'll be in masters in no time. I was actually surprised you were in platinum, since your early build is very clean even with micro-ing your scout (good multitasking early).
Unit control in battles and map scouting in the midgame could use some work too, but they're less important imo.
Thx for posting. Gl hitting masters soon!
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I was actually surprised you were in platinum
This!
I just finished watching and I gotta admit, I was thinking "oh, Plat, hm :\" beforehand because sometimes these sessions are taken by guys who in my opinion don't need Incontrol to teach them anything because they lack the very basic and fundamental stuff that's actually required to pull off such 3-4+ base macro wars. Now I don't wanna sound disrespectful, I myself started in Bronze 3 months ago, but now that I'm top Diamond I think I wouldn't get too much from such a session myself yet, because I still have to improve on stuff which is already pretty known and obvious to me but just not as rehearsed and intuitive for me.
That being said I also was surprised to see how good you were performing. Usually during those sessions I watch and think of all the mistakes and are like "damn it, do X, you know you gotta do it" but it doesn't happen and I just wait for Incontrol to tell you afterwards but almost always you did those things shortly after I thought of them. Also, you seemed to be very receptive of the new input he gave you as you quickly implemented lots of unfamiliar stuff, playing a kind of unfamiliar (to you) build and improved bit by bit every single game.
So, hats off to you. I guess there's no better advertisement for gosucoaching than such a session.
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Thanks! The honest truth is that I don't really get a lot of time to ladder. (I got the game on release and only have like 300 games). I mostly play with my friends (One of which a platinum Zerg, and a Diamond Terran, who used to be Protoss), when I do get the time. That said, I was in a recent LAN and took down a 2700 diamond! (I was so happy when I did this). One of these days, I'll grind the ladder and get to diamond!
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Hey L1F3, I think I played with you and one of your friends a yesterday on one of those Xel'Naga Obs games. I'm suprised that you're platnium, because your level of play seems to be higher than the ones I know, as shown in the video.
Along that note, thanks for uploading the coaching session, I'm watching it right now and I find it very educational, as I'm sure many others do. Mad props for being so selfless.
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On January 30 2011 06:40 DeltaBravo wrote:
Hey L1F3, I think I played with you and one of your friends a yesterday on one of those Xel'Naga Obs games. I'm suprised that you're platnium, because your level of play seems to be higher than the ones I know, as shown in the video.
Along that note, thanks for uploading the coaching session, I'm watching it right now and I find it very educational, as I'm sure many others do. Mad props for being so selfless.
Yeah I remember playing you. I was getting tired of playing so I was like "Screw it! 4 Gate!". Cause I had played basically bad people up until then. It was a GG for sure!
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I'm downloading now, i'll put it up on Mediafire for everyone as well, thanks so much for sharing!
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On January 30 2011 06:52 Khaladas wrote:
I'm downloading now, i'll put it up on Mediafire for everyone as well, thanks so much for sharing!
Thanks! I don't have the money to pay for an account there . When you put it up I'll update the post with it.
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I really wanted to watch this, but own3d.tv isn't working for me. I cancelled the super slow download from that website you linked, and now they want me to wait 20 minutes before I try and dl it again haha.
I guess I'll wait for the mediafire link.
Thanks for uploading this though, the PvZ session inControl did really helped me out.
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i wish there were terrans who do this
toss are always the ones discussing strats and whatnot
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Woot woot appreciate this, been waiting for an iNcontrol PvT lesson
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As usual, some great stuff from Incontrol! Thanks for posting.
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This was awesome, thanks for posting!
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Nice will be watching this now
Its true, I don't think there are a lot of Terrans doing this
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incont has indeed provided an immense service to the community, and from watching his previous recorded lessons too I agree that they contain extremely useful advice for players of all levels, ( I certainly learnt alot from his PVZ one ) thanks for allowing them to be public, and thank you OP for posting them
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Very nice! Same skill level, and same problems. Thanks for sharing!
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Thanks for posting this, very helpful.
It looks like you don't hotkey your army. I notice you spend awhile in the 3rd game at the gold base trying to select your army and move it without selecting probes.
Using 1 or 2 for your army would probably help you a lot.
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I learned a lot, but PvT still seems very dim to me. His PvZ lesson with khaladas was much more in-depth imo. Again, I learned a lot, so many thanks to incontrol, I just can't stand getting matched up with terrans in ladder :p (2800 diamond toss)
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I've lost over 10 PvTs in a row. This will really help. Props to you for recording and incontrol for permitting it.
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Always a pleasure to see more iNcontrol coaching.
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Thank you for posting this!
I'm now able to get my PvT win percentage up quite a bit by learning from your lesson with iNcontrol with a solid build plan and the ideas behind doing what needs to be done to counter Terran's build effectively.
I was doing average versus Terran before watching the lesson, and now I think I'm winning about 60 percent of my PvT matchups, if not better than that.
Big props, this makes me want to get a private coaching session for myself!
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InControl is so awesome
Really liking the GCPL too.
Right now I'm still identifying and fixing plenty of mistakes in my own game, but when I reach the point where I feel I'm stuck, I'm seriously gonna consider buying some coaching time from one of those Brotosses.
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GigyaS, I uploaded the file to MediaFire like we talked about. Here is the download link, maybe you could update the original post. I think MediaFire works better in other countries is the main thing, but also there are no ads, you just click and it downloads.
http://www.mediafire.com/?f5sila7ec3gdvn5
Thanks again for sharing, this was very helpful!
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Updated. Thank you very much for that.
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Thanks a lot for posting this!
I really don't get how you play without hotkeying your army. :D
Incontroll is awesome, if I were serious about SC2 he's the coach i'd pick aswell.
One note on your games, I am pretty sure you can micro the early stalker against early marines when there is no maraudor with concussive shells or stim and take 3-4 of them out with one stalker.
gl gg
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On January 31 2011 01:30 HaRuHi wrote:
Thanks a lot for posting this!
I really don't get how you play without hotkeying your army. :D
Incontroll is awesome, if I were serious about SC2 he's the coach i'd pick aswell.
One note on your games, I am pretty sure you can micro the early stalker against early marines when there is no maraudor with concussive shells or stim and take 3-4 of them out with one stalker.
gl gg
Well I wasn't paying attention to the stalker.
About hotkeying my army, yeah, it's something I want to do, but have never gotten around to. Guess I should do that...
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Great, thank you, every session given by iNControl is alway of great use.
On a sidenote, what's iNControl $/hour rate?
EDIT : A little bit of trolling on terran micro
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Incontrol is the man! And you of course
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This was great! Incontrol on PvZ helped me a ton, this was much needed. Thank you!
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United Kingdom36160 Posts
Some really cool tips in this, thanks for sharing. Even picked up some pointers on general gameplay which is always good. And PvT is definitely my hardest matchup.
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I love how InControl hits everything from the very specific, to the broadest idea.
He gives the general game plan as day[9] would say, he also game a ton of specifics on how to make that broad game plan happen in the game.
My favorite thing i learned there was go to the bathroom before your game play lol jk jk.
I've never use pheniox before in PvT, but now i most def. will be making more phenioxes,
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Props to Incontrol for allowing this to be shared and also thanks to the OP. Very helpful tips all the way through Thanks
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Sorry if this is a silly question, but how does this work? I downloaded from the mediafire link, but all I have are some replays, should there be something else involving the coaching? Thanks!
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The replay pack is superb, thanks for sharing.
How do you get in contact with him for a lesson?
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Nice session ,Thx for sharing guys !
Also, i got one question @ InControl : what would you do if you scout 2rax + sp médivac ? (no expo yet). I Feel that making expo is quite risky, but a delayed b2 is quite bad too because vikings will come fast.
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omg, this was insanely helpful! I just recently swapped to protos from terran, so still exploring what type of player i want to be and what buildorders match it, but this seems like a really nice buildorder, definatly more fun than 4gate.
iNcontroL is the man!
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Awesome stuff. PvT was easily my worst matchup, it'll be good to watch this when i get home. The previous iNControL thread focusing on PvZ was excellent.
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This is brilliant! I watched InControls PvZ coaching session and it turned PvZ from my worst match up in to my best, by FAR, hopefully this will have a similar effect. His way of explaining not just the build but everything that you should be doing and reacting to and looking out for in relation to the build is just fantastic. I wish i could afford a lesson from him, these videos are just so helpful!
HUGE thanks for sharing this!
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cool, thanks for sharing with the community.
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Wow, great video. Props to the OP for sharing. You were great throughout those sessions at implementing what he was telling you to work on.
InControl is a great coach. Obviously he knows the game well but the dude just seems born to be a teacher and leader.
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Thanks for sharing! helps a lot
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Great advertising for Incontrol here. He does a really remarkable lesson and then lets it be shared so that it helps people out and encourages them to go get lessons from him.
Helps the community, and helps Incontrol in the end.
Great stuff.
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I can see why Incontrol is one the most popular coaches around. Not only is he a great player, he's also a great teacher. I've met many people who are great at something, but lack the communication skills to teach the subject to someone else.
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Don't leave with your scouting probe as early as incontrol suggested in the video. Hang around the barracks until the marine finishes to you can see what it does next. You can still escape with your probe and you get valuable scouting information. A lot of times, you'll see a tech lab or a reactor. And if you see a second marine, that tells you that no tech lab or reactor is coming right away. It might sound small, but there's a lot you can do with this information.
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kcdc -
Lately i've been stealing gas from the terran so I can see what he's making out of the rax, and not risking my probe at all.
Seems to work.
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On February 26 2011 06:06 Horst wrote:
kcdc -
Lately i've been stealing gas from the terran so I can see what he's making out of the rax, and not risking my probe at all.
Seems to work.
Gas steal is something different. I'm talking about leaving the probe between the rax and the exit so that you can see what happens with the rax after the marine pops out, but still get your probe out 100% of the time. This is free information. There's no reason not to take it.
A gas steal will probably give you some additional information, particularly if the barracks is in sight range, but it costs 75 minerals.
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On February 26 2011 06:45 kcdc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 06:06 Horst wrote:
kcdc -
Lately i've been stealing gas from the terran so I can see what he's making out of the rax, and not risking my probe at all.
Seems to work. Gas steal is something different. I'm talking about leaving the probe between the rax and the exit so that you can see what happens with the rax after the marine pops out, but still get your probe out 100% of the time. This is free information. There's no reason not to take it. A gas steal will probably give you some additional information, particularly if the barracks is in sight range, but it costs 75 minerals.
it also slows down any sort of quick tech though, so I'd say 75 minerals is worth the cost of slowing down cloaked banshees or early tanks/rine push.
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EPT
