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On April 15 2011 23:16 Fishermang wrote:
When you expand as zerg, at what amount of minerals should your drone leave your base to reach the natural exp to have an extant amount of 300 minerals to plant a new hatchery?
Depends on map and when you're expanding? Seriously this is a dumb question and the result is pretty trivial anyway.
On April 15 2011 14:14 Awesomeness wrote:
How to stop a tank/marine/banshee/scv-allin with protoss after expandig early?
Not a simple question. There are tons of threads out there for this.
On April 15 2011 17:31 Greenworld wrote:
If you warp in units and the pylon is killed , you get the minerals back and the cd on your warpgates ?!!!!!!
Yes.
On April 15 2011 23:57 Zemik wrote:
Ok I have a relitively simple question.
In what league is it a good idea to start considering Micro?
To expand on that I am in Bronze and focusing on macro, if I lose a game it was because I didnt have enough stuff or I did something dumb like charge a siege line, not because I failed to move my stalkers when they were on low hp.
So what league skill level is it when your macro is solid, you dont do dumb shit anymore and to win a game requires unit placement and control?
Macro is in general more important than micro, and this remains true across all leagues.
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Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game.
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If I'm going roach/baneling/infestor in ZvP (vs typical Toss death ball) , is it generally more efficient to upgrade ranged attack or melee attack? Are there any recent threads which discuss this? I did search but nothing obvious turned up...
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On April 16 2011 00:35 Fishermang wrote:
Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game.
Sorry for being mean. But timing your drone to arrive at your natural exactly when you have 300 minerals should be the least of your concerns.
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On April 16 2011 00:44 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 00:35 Fishermang wrote:
Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game. Sorry for being mean. But timing your drone to arrive at your natural exactly when you have 300 minerals should be the least of your concerns.
Actually it is pretty important towards training build-order, APM, and generally being able to do stuff automatically in my case. Knowing when to do what precisely frees up some time which I can then spend on scouting opponent's base with my drone, instead of spending half of my brain to try to remember when I should build an expantion.
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On April 16 2011 00:35 Fishermang wrote:
Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game.
Maybe try sending the drone out 1 supply before you put the hatch down and if your drone gets there and you have more than 300 minerals try 2 supply before. It's far better to have your drone get there early than it is for it to get there late.
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
On April 16 2011 00:51 Fishermang wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 00:44 Anihc wrote:On April 16 2011 00:35 Fishermang wrote:
Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game. Sorry for being mean. But timing your drone to arrive at your natural exactly when you have 300 minerals should be the least of your concerns. Actually it is pretty important towards training build-order, APM, and generally being able to do stuff automatically in my case. Knowing when to do what precisely frees up some time which I can then spend on scouting opponent's base with my drone, instead of spending half of my brain to try to remember when I should build an expantion.
The simple answer is that its map dependent. Its not that hard to test for each position for each map but its not worth all the time imo. I do it by feel and I get it right most of the time.
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On April 16 2011 00:51 Fishermang wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 00:44 Anihc wrote:On April 16 2011 00:35 Fishermang wrote:
Didn't know it would matter when you are expanding, but I forgot to specify it was a fast expand, so say at 15 supply? Say it is Metalopolis? I see people on GSL arrive with their drone at the natural exactly when they tick 300 minerals. Thank you for your welcoming words to someone who is trying to learn the game. Sorry for being mean. But timing your drone to arrive at your natural exactly when you have 300 minerals should be the least of your concerns. Actually it is pretty important towards training build-order, APM, and generally being able to do stuff automatically in my case. Knowing when to do what precisely frees up some time which I can then spend on scouting opponent's base with my drone, instead of spending half of my brain to try to remember when I should build an expantion.
considering this is something that changes with almost every map, it's not really a simple answer. Just for reference, as  I usually send an scv to build my 1st supply depot at ramp at about 40-60 minerals (usually arrives right between 90-110 minerals). Try it out on different maps. If you send a drone at 230 and it arrives at 290, send it at 240 on that map, that position.
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On XNC i'll send my hatch drone (14/15 supply) around 200 minerals.
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If I've pushed my army out to outside the enemy base with a proxy pylon there to continue warping in units, and the enemy attacks my base right as I'm about to attack their base, do I push out and attack their base and go all in or do I go and save my base?
This is assuming our armies are around the same size, or possibly mine is even bigger.
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On April 13 2011 01:50 closey wrote:
Question! Can overlord pick up burrowed units?
Question! Can vortex suck in infestor eggs?
Queston! If a infestor neural parasite a unit and vortex sucks it in 0.1 seconds afterwards will neural parasited unit (assume outside AoE of vortex) remain controlled by the zerg?
Question! Can broodlings / infested terrans be loaded into overlords?
Question! If broodlings infested terrans can be loaded into overlords, will they disappear inside overlord if kept too long?
Question! What will happen if you neural parasite an enemy broodlord cocoon?
Finally got home and on SC2 for the unit tester...
Answer! Overlords cannot pick up burrowed units! "Unit cannot handle that command"
Answer! Vortex cancels Neural Parasite if casted on the parasited or the parasiting unit.
Answer! A broodlings / infested terrans CANNOT be loaded into overlords. No reponse will be given.
Answer! Yes you can! The enemy broodlord cocoon will NOT die and belong to you until neural parasite wears off. Then it's your enemy's again.
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Question: Terran rush. When should my first marine be complete. Record time?
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On April 15 2011 22:16 michaelhasanalias wrote:
Guess I'll post again.
I remember seeing a great guide on the variations of 4-gate a while back on TL. Anyone remember the thread name? Searching for "4-gate" or "4 gate" just yields a hundred pages of closed threads.
Tried to find it because I was curious, too. Can't find it, but if anyone has better luck, at least two people would appreciate it. >_<
On April 15 2011 23:16 Fishermang wrote:
When you expand as zerg, at what amount of minerals should your drone leave your base to reach the natural exp to have an extant amount of 300 minerals to plant a new hatchery?
EDIT: folk nailed this one pretty well already. It is map and build dependent; send around the 150-200 mineral mark and adjust for each particular scenario.
On April 16 2011 00:17 Reithan wrote:
Played a ZvZlast night on Shattered where I went for the usual hatch first (14hatch, 15pool in this case), the opponent blind countered with a 10pool into lings & a spine in my base
Is there any hatch-first opening that's safe against this sort of counter?
Hatch first can defend against it, but it takes some micro, practice, etc.. This recent mini-guide summarizes the technique:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=207040
Key is to pull (almost) all drones, put 4 on each spine, and avoid getting caught in a choke that limits your drone's surface area versus the lings.
On April 16 2011 01:23 jtRok wrote:
If I've pushed my army out to outside the enemy base with a proxy pylon there to continue warping in units, and the enemy attacks my base right as I'm about to attack their base, do I push out and attack their base and go all in or do I go and save my base?
This is assuming our armies are around the same size, or possibly mine is even bigger.
In general, deciding when to base trade is not a simple question and is dependent on many factors and ultimately your comfortableness in a base race scenario. Your scenario is specific enough to say that it is (probably) not worth it to run your army back since they have time to do significant damage to your base (on most maps) and then escape without engaging your army. You should attempt to warp in a few sentries at your base to FF the ramp and generally try to slow down their progress so that you can continue producing units via your proxy than them and/or sneak out probes to rebuild.
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Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this?
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On April 16 2011 03:16 brum wrote:
Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this?
Manual scouting is an APM sink at a part of the game where there's nothing else to do. A patrolling scout is susceptible to getting ganked if you aren't watching it or exploited by placing tech outside of the patrol range. The point of scouting is to actively watch for tells (e.g., gases, nexus energy, army composition) and patrolling might put you out of position at a critical time. Old broodwar habits. Etc.
Note that these aren't necessarily decisive reasons. Patrolling or not is fine as long as you gather the information you need when you drone scout.
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On April 16 2011 03:16 brum wrote:
Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this?
1) Some programers may not know about this, or know about it but just aren't used to doing it.
2) You should be manually controlling your scout for the most part anyway, or at least checking back on it every few seconds. Its rare that you would leave it alone on patrol/waypoints for an extended period of time.
3) By setting patrol waypoints, you don't actually run circles - once you reach the end of the waypoint, you start heading in reverse. This can be bad for example if you are being chased by a zealot, and if you're not watching you could easily lose your scout.
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On April 16 2011 03:27 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 03:16 brum wrote:
Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this? 1) Some programers may not know about this, or know about it but just aren't used to doing it. 2) You should be manually controlling your scout for the most part anyway, or at least checking back on it every few seconds. Its rare that you would leave it alone on patrol/waypoints for an extended period of time. 3) By setting patrol waypoints, you don't actually run circles - once you reach the end of the waypoint, you start heading in reverse. This can be bad for example if you are being chased by a zealot, and if you're not watching you could easily lose your scout.
As i have stated before it doesn't create a back and forth movement. It will go in an infinite circle without making 180 degree turns. just try it. end the patrol route on the same cell where it starts. It automatically snaps together the two ends. I have found this method particularly useful in zvp, where you can keep your scout in the enemy base for a long time. You can be well around 20 supply and you still dont have to pay attention to ordering new movement commands. Ofcourse you still have to look at it from time to time for scouting, but you dont have to waste and actions on the movement.
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On April 16 2011 03:27 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 03:16 brum wrote:
Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this? 1) Some programers may not know about this, or know about it but just aren't used to doing it. 2) You should be manually controlling your scout for the most part anyway, or at least checking back on it every few seconds. Its rare that you would leave it alone on patrol/waypoints for an extended period of time. 3) By setting patrol waypoints, you don't actually run circles - once you reach the end of the waypoint, you start heading in reverse. This can be bad for example if you are being chased by a zealot, and if you're not watching you could easily lose your scout.
I'm not sure if you understood what the original poster meant. Your point one seems to agree and say "some people may not know". Your point three seems to disagree and say "this isn't right".
A quick run into a game and making a square patrol route, connecting the last point you make to the first you made demonstrates that yes, you do actually run in circles and do not go in reverse when you reach the end.
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On April 16 2011 03:55 brum wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2011 03:27 Anihc wrote:On April 16 2011 03:16 brum wrote:
Do progamers know that shift queueing a patrol command's start to it's end (eg. in a circle around the enemy's base) creates an infinite loop instead of a back and forth route? This makes scouting way less bothersome. How come i don't see progamers do this? 1) Some programers may not know about this, or know about it but just aren't used to doing it. 2) You should be manually controlling your scout for the most part anyway, or at least checking back on it every few seconds. Its rare that you would leave it alone on patrol/waypoints for an extended period of time. 3) By setting patrol waypoints, you don't actually run circles - once you reach the end of the waypoint, you start heading in reverse. This can be bad for example if you are being chased by a zealot, and if you're not watching you could easily lose your scout. As i have stated before it doesn't create a back and forth movement. It will go in an infinite circle without making 180 degree turns. just try it. end the patrol route on the same cell where it starts. It automatically snaps together the two ends. I have found this method particularly useful in zvp, where you can keep your scout in the enemy base for a long time. You can be well around 20 supply and you still dont have to pay attention to ordering new movement commands. Ofcourse you still have to look at it from time to time for scouting, but you dont have to waste and actions on the movement.
Woah, I did not know that. I bet actually a lot of progamers do not know about this either. Thanks, I learned something :p
Although pros probably still prefer to manually control their scout, I can see this being a pretty useful trick.
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EPT
