What makes it even funnier is that you were trash talking him as he was teching up for a very solid counter. And then you let him bait your marines away from the thors into waiting Infestors, Lings and Blings so his Mutas could magicbox in peace. A few Vikings would have done the trick but you weren't even aware he was teching BLs at that point.

Also, you went 2 tech factories, pumped out Hellions afterwards and didn't start IP or SM during that time.

Still... better than I can play, lol.

falcoiii

Canada43 Posts

February 14 2011 09:18 GMT

#685

Finally tried this build after a string of losses to Z - went 2rax pressure no gas to FE into 3OC.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/139346-1v1-terran-zerg-metalopolis

I was up on harvesters for most/all of the game and could rebuild an army faster than zerg! It is amazing how terran can build out of a gajillion barracks, lose the whole army to ling/bling and have a replacement army waiting to attack the remaining lings.

Any pointers would be appreciated. I know that my money got hight due to the 3OC and I really should learn to transition out of MMM with a smatter of tank/viking.

Thrombozyt

Germany1269 Posts

February 14 2011 13:10 GMT

#686

I usually run into the following scenario:
5 marine pressure is quite successful in forcing a ton of lings and sniping lings and an ovi or queen or drone. Speed hits and the zerg has now a rather weak eco, but ~20 speedlings. He is now camping at my natural preventing my expansion while getting a baneling nest to morph in blings the second I try to move out. By the time I have stim and shields and can move out, I face the following problems:
1) Zerg has drones up
2) Zerg has established a 3rd or has high muta count already
3) Extensive creep spread.

Any suggestions?

Conrose

437 Posts

March 06 2011 03:41 GMT

#687

In 3v3s, I've been experimenting with a 7 SD, 10 Rax, 13 OC into 3OC 3v3 Shared Base maps.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/146884-3v3-terran-protoss-zerg-arakan-citadel

By going with such an early Rax, I can usually complete the wall off before anything but a 6 pool on Arakan Citadel, while on Typhon, it won't beat the 6 Pool, but it will beat a 2 Proxy Gate by about 20 seconds if I go with the 13 OC Into 4 Rax and wall off that whole ramp solo.

gottypro

Russian Federation115 Posts

March 12 2011 18:55 GMT

#688

I wanna say that adding more OCs is really a great idea, i'd say it can be quite game-breaking. I don't really know why noone still uses that. Guess in the pro levels 550 minerals, which pay for themselves only after a few mins, can make you lose a game (less marines or tanks done on a certain timing), but overall still really a great idea. And the thing is that it can have multiple uses.
The advantage is not only mules, but you can also fly 2 CC's (the main one and the second in-base one) to other bases. Obv, you can't defend an OC too much vs zerg in the late-game but 3OCs can still give you lots of mules and even if the base stays for a short period of time, you will get lots of minerals (this is really helpful if your other bases are close to be mined out and you don't need to spam mules on them and the energy gets pooled). That can get a zerg really surprised if he doesn't deny the floated CC like instantly.
Actually that won me quite a few games. When the zerg sees that im close to being mined out and soon i won't be able to refill my tank/marine numbers, so he thinks that we're on even ground, but then an OC comes to some base, mules get called down, and there you go, you can still pump reinforcements. Almost seems like cheating, lol. Anyways, hope this idea of additional OCs get more common in time. Thanks for this.

xplodngKeys

Canada4 Posts

March 15 2011 02:40 GMT

#689

I've been doing something like this for awhile, no set BO for throwing down the CCs I just make them when it makes sense to do so as a substitute for supply depots.

So lets say you have 2rax going, 1fact, 1port and you've just crossed the 6min line. You wont be able to sustain production if you add a 3rd rax or 2nd fact/port and you need more supply. You have 50 energy on your OC so what do you do? Throw down a supply upgrade from the OC and use your excess minerals to throw up another CC.

Generally I sacrifice my natural early on and let the CC that would have gone there just sit in the base allowing for extra mules. If you play with the idea that Gas is really the limiting factor and mules are much much better for resource gathering than SCVs it helps to make more sense.

If you need to gather more minerals somewhere you can fly an OC over to a spot and your total investment is only 550minerals, if it gets harassed by mutas... who cares! you only lost a few mules and the OC.

the nice thing is you can easily pump out thors/tanks/vikings/banshees from 2rax/2port constantly by controlling 4 gas points and 2 mineral patches... all with a grand investment of 26scvs who are being supplemented by 4-6 OCs. Then when the mules start giving you too much minerals hold back and build a few more OCs. This way you do not need to worry about the minerals and you just need to manage the gas income & spending as thats whats driving your economy.

Conrose

437 Posts

March 16 2011 03:12 GMT

#690

So... quick question,. how does this opening fair on the new GSL Maps?

gottypro

Russian Federation115 Posts

March 22 2011 21:05 GMT

#691

Lol, watched GSTL today and oGsTop actually used a variation of 3OC vs zerg, was pretty awesome to see. That game actually looked very alike to that i get using 3OC.

Afterstar

67 Posts

April 09 2011 14:52 GMT

#692

I love this build, makes large maps bearable against Zerg,but it is very vurnerable to baneling all-in a la ST_July style.Do you think a total of 3Rax before the additional 3 or 4 CCs/OCs would be better,allowing you to defend early pushes?

@Thrombozyt
If you get contained like that i think going for fast siege tanks or banshees and delaying stim/shields,will allow you to break out of that and then you can safely expand.Keep the CC energy,don't use many mules,so that you can immediately use it on your natural and catch up on economy without your main being mined out.

Antisocialmunky

United States5913 Posts

April 09 2011 17:13 GMT

#693

Hey Griff, check your inbox, I have a 3 CC build, I want to talk to you about.

Conrose

437 Posts

April 23 2011 03:46 GMT

#694

Griffith, I just popped this build on a 3v3 for Frontier, TTZ v TTP (My side TTP). I was able to repel a PF rush, and tank a 7 SCV + Thor Rush plus a 7 RR from 8:00-10:00 long enough for my allies to arrive and clean it up the rest with me. I lost only one SCV that I sacced to try to get his last SCV on the Thor and my macro was damaged none.

http://replayfu.com/r/MBKHfq

I love this build for 3v3s.

HalbyStarcraft

United States5 Posts

May 05 2011 14:55 GMT

#695

Deltablazy

Canada580 Posts

May 05 2011 15:07 GMT

#696

Mind explaining the graph? I don't see what you're willing to say.

Synystyr

United States1446 Posts

May 05 2011 15:23 GMT

#697

I think it's showing how easily exploitable this build is against an economic Baneling bust. You don't reap the benefits of this build until past the 13 minute mark where your army would surpass that of a standard build. Econ baneling bust spikes way sooner and with about 3 times the army size of what you have at the time.

Deltablazy

Canada580 Posts

May 09 2011 15:18 GMT

#698

Would anyone be kind enough to post replays doing 3OC/4OC (in 1v1). I could really use some.

User was warned for this post

Exley

United States239 Posts

May 09 2011 15:23 GMT

#699

On May 10 2011 00:18 Deltablazy wrote:
Would anyone be kind enough to post replays doing 3OC/4OC (in 1v1). I could really use some.

There are plenty of replays of this build... little hint: check the clearly marked "replays" section of the OP.

Afterstar

67 Posts

May 12 2011 03:57 GMT

#700

Hey Griffith,
I was wondering how well does your 3OC build do now against the new Spanishiwa style zergs do and 2base eco baneling busts.

Eco baneling busts usually come around the 7-10minute mark and are very hard to stop even with a lot of bunkers around.A smart zerg can just bust the building that is nearest to the bottom of your ramp,then a structure at the top of the ramp and run by all the zerglings in,demolishing everything.

Spanishiwa style gets tech very fast,meaning you could have broodlords/ultralisks and infestors at 12-14minutes.The 3OC build delays gas gathering and tech greatly meaning almost no vikings or ghosts at that stage of the game.

How do you deal with those situations? Can you provide replays were you had to face such zerg styles in master league.