• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:35
CEST 00:35
KST 07:35
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 1 - Final Week6[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall12HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0
Community News
Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed5Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll2Team TLMC #5 - Submission extension2Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation17$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced7
StarCraft 2
General
Team TLMC #5 - Submission extension Who will win EWC 2025? Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) WardiTV Mondays Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome
Brood War
General
Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL Starcraft in widescreen BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues CSL Xiamen International Invitational [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China 2025 ACS Season 2 Qualifier
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Summer Games Done Quick 2025! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Men Take Risks, Women Win Ga…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 571 users

PvP, Collosus's Demise. New and Original Strategy. - Page 10

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 Next All
spacemonkeyy
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia477 Posts
May 11 2011 10:31 GMT
#181
I just had pretty good success with this tactic, can't find sc2replayed seems to be down atm though?
TheKRoc
Profile Joined February 2011
United States74 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-12 22:36:11
May 11 2011 11:15 GMT
#182
A lot of people in here misunderstand where the strength of this composition lies.

First, know that Charge is 75% of what makes this build good. You guys don't seem to understand how fucking good it is in PvP. If you haven't tried it, go and do it right now.

Here is how every fight goes vs. Colossus:

You have 4 Archons and 20 Zealots. He has 3 Colossus, 14 Zealots, and some stalkers (I think thats around even, but it doesn't really matter)

Chargelots basically always get more surface area on other Zealots straight up, (I.E. if I have 14 Chargelots and you have 14 Zealots, my Zealots will charge into a curve around yours) but to further skew the fight in your favor further you're going to have more zealots. This creates a little concave, and after a second or two Archons get to the bag guy's Zealots and rip the shit out of them (they do this anyways, but your Chargelots bundle A-moved Zealots nicely for splash). You will lose the vast majority of your Zealots here, but come away with maybe 5 or 6. Those plus three remaining Archons go up and kill the Colossus.

End of story. And forcefields don't really work, by the way.
Paekes
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany28 Posts
May 11 2011 11:28 GMT
#183
even if there are forcefileds wont the archons just stomp the ff's after the patch?
nihlon
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden5581 Posts
May 11 2011 11:29 GMT
#184
On May 11 2011 20:15 bonerificus wrote:
A lot of people in here misunderstand where the strength of this composition lies.

First, know that Charge is 75% of what makes this build good. You guys don't seem to understand how fucking good it is in PvP. If you haven't tried it, go and do it right now.

Here is how every fight goes vs. Colossus:

You have 4 Archons and 20 Zealots. He has 3 Colossus, 14 Zealots, and some stalkers (I think thats around even, but it doesn't really matter)

Chargelots basically always get more surface area on other Zealots straight up, (I.E. if I have 14 Chargelots and you have 14 Zealots, my Zealots will charge into a curve around yours) but to further skew the fight in your favor further you're going to have more zealots. This creates a little concave, and after a second or two Archons get to the bag guy's Zealots and rip the shit out of them (they do this anyways, but your Chargelots bundle A-moved Zealots nicely for splash). You will lose the vast majority of your Zealots here, but come away with maybe 5 or 6. Those plus three remaining Archons go up and kill the Zealots.

End of story. And forcefields don't really work, by the way.


How does the collosus play a part in this? I assume you mean collosi in the end there or?
Banelings are too cute to blow up
Murloc
Profile Joined May 2011
United States4 Posts
May 11 2011 11:48 GMT
#185
I am intrigued by people testing this. I hope Spek is still around to see what he has wrought!
Pwnographics
Profile Joined January 2011
New Zealand1097 Posts
May 11 2011 11:59 GMT
#186
On May 11 2011 20:15 bonerificus wrote:
A lot of people in here misunderstand where the strength of this composition lies.

First, know that Charge is 75% of what makes this build good. You guys don't seem to understand how fucking good it is in PvP. If you haven't tried it, go and do it right now.

Here is how every fight goes vs. Colossus:

You have 4 Archons and 20 Zealots. He has 3 Colossus, 14 Zealots, and some stalkers (I think thats around even, but it doesn't really matter)

Chargelots basically always get more surface area on other Zealots straight up, (I.E. if I have 14 Chargelots and you have 14 Zealots, my Zealots will charge into a curve around yours) but to further skew the fight in your favor further you're going to have more zealots. This creates a little concave, and after a second or two Archons get to the bag guy's Zealots and rip the shit out of them (they do this anyways, but your Chargelots bundle A-moved Zealots nicely for splash). You will lose the vast majority of your Zealots here, but come away with maybe 5 or 6. Those plus three remaining Archons go up and kill the Zealots.

End of story. And forcefields don't really work, by the way.


Yes, because when your zealots are forcefielded so they can't hit stalkers and collosi they are very effective.

Forcefields do work, and they rip apart chargelots when supported by collosi and stalkers.
Ineffability~
Profile Joined February 2011
84 Posts
May 11 2011 11:59 GMT
#187
Why don't they nerf the one imba unit to make another unit even more imba. Storm/zealot with archons after storms will rip PvT apart now

User was warned for this post
azn_dude1
Profile Joined October 2010
162 Posts
May 11 2011 12:07 GMT
#188
On May 11 2011 20:59 Pwnographics wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 11 2011 20:15 bonerificus wrote:
A lot of people in here misunderstand where the strength of this composition lies.

First, know that Charge is 75% of what makes this build good. You guys don't seem to understand how fucking good it is in PvP. If you haven't tried it, go and do it right now.

Here is how every fight goes vs. Colossus:

You have 4 Archons and 20 Zealots. He has 3 Colossus, 14 Zealots, and some stalkers (I think thats around even, but it doesn't really matter)

Chargelots basically always get more surface area on other Zealots straight up, (I.E. if I have 14 Chargelots and you have 14 Zealots, my Zealots will charge into a curve around yours) but to further skew the fight in your favor further you're going to have more zealots. This creates a little concave, and after a second or two Archons get to the bag guy's Zealots and rip the shit out of them (they do this anyways, but your Chargelots bundle A-moved Zealots nicely for splash). You will lose the vast majority of your Zealots here, but come away with maybe 5 or 6. Those plus three remaining Archons go up and kill the Zealots.

End of story. And forcefields don't really work, by the way.


Yes, because when your zealots are forcefielded so they can't hit stalkers and collosi they are very effective.

Forcefields do work, and they rip apart chargelots when supported by collosi and stalkers.

Archons stomp force fields. This build has been made a lot stronger by the new patch.
Cibron
Profile Joined March 2010
Sweden253 Posts
May 11 2011 12:11 GMT
#189
On May 11 2011 20:59 Ineffability~ wrote:
Why don't they nerf the one imba unit to make another unit even more imba. Storm/zealot with archons after storms will rip PvT apart now


Haha what? Dude massive archons dont affect **** in PvT. I'd worry more about 2gate pressure...
ZOMGY (¬O_o)¬ || BeastyQQ FTW!! ||
Barty
Profile Joined December 2010
France64 Posts
May 11 2011 12:13 GMT
#190
Shouldn't an archon be in the front line instead of zealots? I mean it could be used to 1) crush forcefields 2) tank colossus&stalkers fire for a while since it's so big and splash doesnt affect like 3 zealots at a time when archons are being focused. Sure they cost a lot of gas but it's your only way to spend it.
BTW it could be interesting to compare the upgrades-scaling of archons and zealots vs colos. and stalkers !
In God We Trush
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
May 11 2011 12:33 GMT
#191
On May 11 2011 21:13 Barty wrote:
Shouldn't an archon be in the front line instead of zealots? I mean it could be used to 1) crush forcefields 2) tank colossus&stalkers fire for a while since it's so big and splash doesnt affect like 3 zealots at a time when archons are being focused. Sure they cost a lot of gas but it's your only way to spend it.
BTW it could be interesting to compare the upgrades-scaling of archons and zealots vs colos. and stalkers !


In this build (chargelot/archon), a good idea is to keep only 1-2 archons in front to break forcefields and the rest in the back. This is because having too many archons in the front would prevent your zealots from attack, and also remember that archons now have 3 range, which helps them hit behind the zealots.

Zealot Scale > Stalker Scale

Stalkers only get like +1
Zealots get +2
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
Lobber
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada414 Posts
May 11 2011 14:58 GMT
#192
Zealot archon vs zealot colossus, colossus fucking rape.

User was warned for this post
You are not your APM, you are not you ladder ranking.
Argus92
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands93 Posts
May 11 2011 15:16 GMT
#193
Interesting build, you need to have good position though, zealots shouldnt be clumped up, like on a small ramp, you have Melee units with this build. Also, if they take out the Archon first, they can force field you all they want, which against Zealots, is quite pwn.

Funny how at the start I didn't get the 1 Archon only, but of course it's Massive now, didn't realize it before. haha
Sakarabu
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United Kingdom132 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-11 15:42:54
May 11 2011 15:41 GMT
#194
On May 12 2011 00:16 Argus92 wrote:
Interesting build, you need to have good position though, zealots shouldnt be clumped up, like on a small ramp, you have Melee units with this build. Also, if they take out the Archon first, they can force field you all they want, which against Zealots, is quite pwn.

Funny how at the start I didn't get the 1 Archon only, but of course it's Massive now, didn't realize it before. haha


You are underestimating the power of the archon and how many hits it can take. At the timing this attack hits your opponent is either expanding or teching to collosi, he won't HAVE collosi yet. He will have afew gateway units at most.

Saw kiwikaki doing this vs whitera yesterday on his stream, It did stomp whitera however I will add that it was Whiteras first game ever on the new patch so i'm not gonna say it's OMFGAMAZING.

However it did seem very strong, definitely crushes a blink stalker build (stalkers just don't have the dps to kill mass speedlots effectively without forcefields), crushes a 4 gate (you need to get afew fast sentries though) and also crushes a fast tech to collosi and those are the majority of popular strats used.

All in all, we'll have to wait and see the true potential of this as people learn how to counter it etc but it's a fun build nonetheless.
chikhan
Profile Joined May 2011
Malaysia35 Posts
May 12 2011 19:49 GMT
#195
This build is totally made for patch 1.3.3! Archons as massive units totally ROLFSTOMP FF's and early Collo's
SC2 ain't SimCity2!
Yamulo
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States2096 Posts
May 12 2011 19:52 GMT
#196
Might want to add this to the OP but phoenixes cannot lift archons, i.e massive unit. However i really do think that zealot archon could be fairly good on some maps (like tyler was talking about on sotg).
~~~Liquid Fighting (SC2)~~~
I)etox
Profile Joined April 2011
1240 Posts
May 12 2011 20:11 GMT
#197
On May 11 2011 23:58 Lobber wrote:
Zealot archon vs zealot colossus, colossus fucking rape.


Actually, since archons cost the same minerals as a zealot does (100) while collosus cost 3x that amount (300), zealot/archon will have more zealots than zealot/collosus. Add to the fact that zealot/archon will have chargelots so they can get a better surround/not be kited by collosus and that archons do bonus damage vs. zealots, zealot/archons is looking to be a very viable build vs. zealot/collosus right now.
darmousseh
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3437 Posts
May 12 2011 21:39 GMT
#198
On May 13 2011 05:11 I)etox wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 11 2011 23:58 Lobber wrote:
Zealot archon vs zealot colossus, colossus fucking rape.


Actually, since archons cost the same minerals as a zealot does (100) while collosus cost 3x that amount (300), zealot/archon will have more zealots than zealot/collosus. Add to the fact that zealot/archon will have chargelots so they can get a better surround/not be kited by collosus and that archons do bonus damage vs. zealots, zealot/archons is looking to be a very viable build vs. zealot/collosus right now.



I was doing some theorycrafting in my head and I'm thinking that stalker(with blink) collosus would win this battle if microed correctly. The collosus stay near a cliff and then you blink away with stalkers after shooting a round essentially kiting the zealot/archon ball. Engaging in an open area would be like automatic win for the zealot archon ball.

I think this build makes pvp have an interesting dynamic in the mid game. and We could actually see long drawn out pvp games. This could also cause pvp to always start off with a gas steal. Looking forward to the future of pvp
Developer for http://mtgfiddle.com
Lobber
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada414 Posts
May 12 2011 22:06 GMT
#199
On May 11 2011 23:58 Lobber wrote:
Zealot archon vs zealot colossus, colossus fucking rape.

User was warned for this post

As per request by the mod pm and warning here's a recent replay where I ended up with gateway colossus vs gateway archon and traded ridiculously well. Granted the game was not great for me and I did lose overall, he was a gm, much higher than me, I almost managed to take it despite being so far behind due to the near hard-counter of colossus vs archon.

Also granted it's not pure zealot archon vs zealot colossus but stalker zealot for both...

replay
You are not your APM, you are not you ladder ranking.
r3tsa
Profile Joined April 2011
Poland94 Posts
May 12 2011 22:19 GMT
#200
Dunno guys if u realize that, but Void Rays are the only unit now with bonus dmg vs archons.
No pain, no gain.
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 25m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ZombieGrub175
Nathanias 150
Livibee 133
UpATreeSC 111
JuggernautJason76
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 433
firebathero 250
Dota 2
syndereN717
monkeys_forever218
NeuroSwarm86
League of Legends
Grubby4800
Counter-Strike
fl0m1443
Foxcn315
Fnx 42
Super Smash Bros
PPMD95
Liquid`Ken51
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu478
Trikslyr67
Other Games
summit1g10922
shahzam921
C9.Mang0209
Pyrionflax89
Mew2King56
Maynarde56
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick5067
BasetradeTV26
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 34
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22567
League of Legends
• Doublelift3734
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur294
Other Games
• imaqtpie2054
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
1h 25m
Replay Cast
11h 25m
WardiTV European League
17h 25m
ShoWTimE vs sebesdes
Percival vs NightPhoenix
Shameless vs Nicoract
Krystianer vs Scarlett
ByuN vs uThermal
Harstem vs HeRoMaRinE
PiGosaur Monday
1d 1h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 17h
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Epic.LAN
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
[ Show More ]
Epic.LAN
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Online Event
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Liquipedia Results

Completed

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Championship of Russia 2025
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters

Upcoming

CSL Xiamen Invitational
CSL Xiamen Invitational: ShowMatche
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
K-Championship
RSL Revival: Season 2
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Underdog Cup #2
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.