[G] Very effective TvX "4 Gate" push equivalent - Page 2
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Metalfire
United States8 Posts
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fadestep
United States605 Posts
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Yttrasil
Sweden651 Posts
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AnAngryDingo
United States223 Posts
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Zecias
United States116 Posts
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Mrbustanut
121 Posts
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KiLL_ORdeR
United States1518 Posts
You're always going to have problems against tosses and zergs who scout well and see the push coming. I used to use this build a lot, but found that zergs can counter with Spine Crawlers and queens, then tech to Mutas and totally rape your face with muta-ling-baneling. It's challenging for toss to stop, but Tosses are getting better and better as this strat is becoming more and more popular, and if they manage to vlock your push will expanding, you're essentially dead. IMO, effective at lower levels, gets decreasingly more difficult the higher you go until it becomes unusable. | ||
Darpa
Canada4413 Posts
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PhilipJWitow
29 Posts
To those saying it's just a 3-rax push. Uhh it's 4-rax, so no. It's obviously a variation of the 3-rax, and thus it's a different strategy. A 1-gate robo is different to a 2-gate robo, just like this is NOT a 3-rax push. To others saying you can stop it with XXX or it doesn't work against XXX. Stop theorycrafting. Check out the replays, maybe try it out and then let the OP know how it goes. I can say to any strategy that "A good player will just counter this strategy and beat it" but I'm not aiding the discussion at all. Also, just a small point but 1 sentry defending this push? For what, like 1 minute? Anyways, thanks Yttrasil for providing another interesting strategy for Terrans to try out. I myself would hate to post a strategy on here as people seem to always complain and criticize it no matter what it is. >.> | ||
G_Wen
Canada525 Posts
Edit: It looks like there's more difference in our builds than I thought: OC Opening (12 rax, 13 refinery, 15 oc) 2nd Rax before supply if there is a late scout otherwise wall off before second rax. Reactor on second rax. Stim on tech lab rax. SCV / Supply / MARINE Only throughout 3rd Rax @ 150 minerals Tech lab on 3rd rax When the second tech lab is done you should have just enough gas to start combat shields right away. Build marauders from tech labs from now on. Your push should have 3 marauders. | ||
Zecias
United States116 Posts
On September 29 2010 09:02 PhilipJWitow wrote: Do you guys even read Yttrasil's post? To those saying it's just a 3-rax push. Uhh it's 4-rax, so no. It's obviously a variation of the 3-rax, and thus it's a different strategy. A 1-gate robo is different to a 2-gate robo, just like this is NOT a 3-rax push. To others saying you can stop it with XXX or it doesn't work against XXX. Stop theorycrafting. Check out the replays, maybe try it out and then let the OP know how it goes. I can say to any strategy that "A good player will just counter this strategy and beat it" but I'm not aiding the discussion at all. Also, just a small point but 1 sentry defending this push? For what, like 1 minute? Anyways, thanks Yttrasil for providing another interesting strategy for Terrans to try out. I myself would hate to post a strategy on here as people seem to always complain and criticize it no matter what it is. >.> it is a modified 3 rax build. a build is determined by how u start the build. what yttrasil is doing is starting out with the 3 rax build and adding another rax to reinforce the push, just a slight modification with no significant changes to the build order. his build order is exactly the same as a standard 3 rax but adds another rax later on, he just delays his push until he has all upgrades. but thats just my opinion. | ||
KiLL_ORdeR
United States1518 Posts
On September 29 2010 09:24 Zecias wrote: it is a modified 3 rax build. a build is determined by how u start the build. what yttrasil is doing is starting out with the 3 rax build and adding another rax to reinforce the push, just a slight modification with no significant changes to the build order. his build order is exactly the same as a standard 3 rax but adds another rax later on, he just delays his push until he has all upgrades. but thats just my opinion. exactly, he's adding an extra rax and ups to give the push more muscle, however it comes out later whic gives the opponent more time to counter. IMO his variation seems to rely on the fact that the opponent either a) assumes it's a 3-rax, and doesn't build enough stuff to counter it to get a better economy, or b) just straight up doesn't know how to counter it. The actual push can be countered the same way one stops a 3-rax, it's obviously just later and bigger. | ||
Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On September 29 2010 10:02 KiLL_ORdeR wrote: exactly, he's adding an extra rax and ups to give the push more muscle, however it comes out later whic gives the opponent more time to counter. IMO his variation seems to rely on the fact that the opponent either a) assumes it's a 3-rax, and doesn't build enough stuff to counter it to get a better economy, or b) just straight up doesn't know how to counter it. The actual push can be countered the same way one stops a 3-rax, it's obviously just later and bigger. You can't support all 4 rax at once so in reality it is 200min 25gas weaker than the standard 3rax is. | ||
TibblesEvilCat
United Kingdom766 Posts
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Vexx
United States462 Posts
On September 29 2010 09:02 PhilipJWitow wrote: Do you guys even read Yttrasil's post? To those saying it's just a 3-rax push. Uhh it's 4-rax, so no. It's obviously a variation of the 3-rax, and thus it's a different strategy. A 1-gate robo is different to a 2-gate robo, just like this is NOT a 3-rax push. To others saying you can stop it with XXX or it doesn't work against XXX. Stop theorycrafting. Check out the replays, maybe try it out and then let the OP know how it goes. I can say to any strategy that "A good player will just counter this strategy and beat it" but I'm not aiding the discussion at all. Also, just a small point but 1 sentry defending this push? For what, like 1 minute? Anyways, thanks Yttrasil for providing another interesting strategy for Terrans to try out. I myself would hate to post a strategy on here as people seem to always complain and criticize it no matter what it is. >.> Thanks for your deep insight on the game. I'll keep this short for ya: - It's not a different strategy. It's just stupid. You can't produce off 4 raxes on one base so really it's more of a variation of 3 rax with an emphasis on wasting resources. - The sentry doesn't block the army. It places a FF on the ramp as your army is moving in so that half your forces are getting rocked and the other half can't do anything. Don't worry about the issues with posting a strategy on these boards. I don't think you'll be in that situation for a long time. | ||
KiLL_ORdeR
United States1518 Posts
On September 29 2010 10:23 Shikyo wrote: You can't support all 4 rax at once so in reality it is 200min 25gas weaker than the standard 3rax is. you can if you have garbage macro... | ||
Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
On September 29 2010 04:27 Masq wrote: instead of all-in every game, you could, you know, actually learn how to play the game. I think this advice applies to 99% of players in diamond even. I think at least 90% of my games are vs an allin of some kind at high diamond. It makes laddering to practice a total joke. | ||
Yttrasil
Sweden651 Posts
Decided to edit my first one instead of making a new, as the concept is almost the same but the result is staggeringly different. Any criticism is good and I suppose the biggest would come from that of me not scouting. Anyway it is the concept that is important not the details and if you want to scout, fine with me mke =) Will probably only end up with 1 less marine or so. Cheers and I hope you will like it and give it a try. | ||
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