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On March 16 2012 07:41 Za7oX wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 06:53 RibsNGibs wrote:
Hi, stupid question here; was wondering if anybody had any mental tricks or anything to help with this.
I keep usually keep my forward lings on hotkey 1, and all my injecting queens on 6.
I often "66" and inject all my larva, then "11" and move my lings somewhere.
Every once in awhile it'll turn out all my forward lings died, so my 1 hotkey didn't select anything, so all my queens were still selected, and then 30 seconds later, I'll notice all my queens are walking across the middle of the map.
Does this happen to other people? Is it just something I have to deal with, or does anybody have any tricks for preventing it?
Thanks,
It's just practice man. When i started playing SC2 i had to look at the keys half the time >.>. Now i can use 1 -7 without thinking about it. A trick might be to just look at your ctrl groups and see if you do have the right things hotkeyd.
It's actually not a case of screwing up my hotkeys (I used to do that, but I almost never, never mistakenly hotkey anything anymore). It's that all the units in my 1 hotkey died, so hitting "1" doesn't actually select anything, so when I try to move my lings around, what I'm really doing is moving whatever I had selected before around (which is sometimes queens, since I often have just finished injecting before trying to move my hotkey-1-army around).
I've done this sort of as terran/protoss before, too, where I'll select all my CC's, make SCVs, then hit "1"-rightclick, and, whoops, my army was actually dead and had no units in "1", so what I just did was rally all my CCs to the center of the map.
In any case, I'm sure you're right; it's just something that happens sometimes and I just have to deal with it.
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On March 16 2012 08:26 RibsNGibs wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 07:41 Za7oX wrote:On March 16 2012 06:53 RibsNGibs wrote:
Hi, stupid question here; was wondering if anybody had any mental tricks or anything to help with this.
I keep usually keep my forward lings on hotkey 1, and all my injecting queens on 6.
I often "66" and inject all my larva, then "11" and move my lings somewhere.
Every once in awhile it'll turn out all my forward lings died, so my 1 hotkey didn't select anything, so all my queens were still selected, and then 30 seconds later, I'll notice all my queens are walking across the middle of the map.
Does this happen to other people? Is it just something I have to deal with, or does anybody have any tricks for preventing it?
Thanks,
It's just practice man. When i started playing SC2 i had to look at the keys half the time >.>. Now i can use 1 -7 without thinking about it. A trick might be to just look at your ctrl groups and see if you do have the right things hotkeyd. It's actually not a case of screwing up my hotkeys (I used to do that, but I almost never, never mistakenly hotkey anything anymore). It's that all the units in my 1 hotkey died, so hitting "1" doesn't actually select anything, so when I try to move my lings around, what I'm really doing is moving whatever I had selected before around (which is sometimes queens, since I often have just finished injecting before trying to move my hotkey-1-army around). I've done this sort of as terran/protoss before, too, where I'll select all my CC's, make SCVs, then hit "1"-rightclick, and, whoops, my army was actually dead and had no units in "1", so what I just did was rally all my CCs to the center of the map. In any case, I'm sure you're right; it's just something that happens sometimes and I just have to deal with it.
Have you tried the hotkeying eggs method that stephano uses?
That's one way to always have something in your unit control group.
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Not sure exactly what stephano's method is, but yeah, I'm pretty sure I do - 3szzzzzzzzz, control click the eggs, shift-1. That thing?
Maybe I should switch my "loop" from
make units
inject larva/spread creep
micro army (which is where the problem happens if my army died, and I end up microing the queens instead)
to
iinject larva/spread creep
make units
micro army (so if my entire army died in the meantime, I'll still be rallying my unhatched eggs around).
Hrm.
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I've been trying to use Stephano's way of ZvP by getting a fast 2nd and 3rd expo, droning to 44, double gas, then taking lair/evo/roach/speedlings. then dropping another 2 gas at 60 drones and pumping out roaches for the protoss push. Every single time, it seems to me that even if I outmacro him and outnumber the protoss army, they usually have blink by the time it hits the 10 minute push and they dont lose a single stalker. When I know im not going to win i run back with my roaches but blink stalkers usually pick up a lot of kills and not to even mention the sentries that can ALWAYS no matter what cut your army in half whether you're running away or engaging. The protoss community has been complaining that this build is too strong but I cant even pull of any wins in my recent ZvPs. Im a top 8 platinum player but I tend to only versus top 25-top50 diamond players. PLEASE HELP
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When you are on infestor with brood lords morphing in ZvT, how am i supposed to deal cost efficiently with strong pushes to my 4th/5th/6th. Or if my brood lords are there then my other 3 bases? I dont really have the ling count because of broodlords. good terrans seem to avoid my brood lords altogether and force me to go all in. you cant deny 3 drops on the corners of your bases when you have broodlords in the middle of your side of the map. should i always be making lings? I have trouble finding the supply to get brood lords while defending strong pushes where my brood lords arent... TT
mid master
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On March 16 2012 12:37 mooseman1710 wrote:
When you are on infestor with brood lords morphing in ZvT, how am i supposed to deal cost efficiently with strong pushes to my 4th/5th/6th. Or if my brood lords are there then my other 3 bases? I dont really have the ling count because of broodlords. good terrans seem to avoid my brood lords altogether and force me to go all in. you cant deny 3 drops on the corners of your bases when you have broodlords in the middle of your side of the map. should i always be making lings? I have trouble finding the supply to get brood lords while defending strong pushes where my brood lords arent... TT
mid master
With BL/infestor you have to be prepared to lose some of your bases. It helps to have a shit tone of static defenses and one or two infestors at every expo but losing bases is inevitable when you have a large BL army against a terran that plays the counter attacking drop style.
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so how can i possibly win if i lose my bases while my slo wbroodlords push across the map?
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On March 16 2012 14:30 mooseman1710 wrote:
so how can i possibly win if i lose my bases while my slo wbroodlords push across the map?
When making a brood lord switch it's imperative that you have static defense at expansions, or you will lose them to drops with your horribly slow army.
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Belial, thank you for your continuing support. Maybe your advise would not be perfect for a master league player, but for me in silver your input does make a lot of sense. I have now something to work with. I still lack the drone count in the mid/late game, but I feel more confident – and more successful – in the early game. If I now manage to drone up at the right time, I should get my ZvZ on par with my other match ups.
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On March 16 2012 10:12 RibsNGibs wrote:
Not sure exactly what stephano's method is, but yeah, I'm pretty sure I do - 3szzzzzzzzz, control click the eggs, shift-1. That thing?
Maybe I should switch my "loop" from
make units
inject larva/spread creep
micro army (which is where the problem happens if my army died, and I end up microing the queens instead)
to
iinject larva/spread creep
make units
micro army (so if my entire army died in the meantime, I'll still be rallying my unhatched eggs around).
Hrm.
i do the second loop. (its better for macro if you dont need units immediatly)
I think there are some underlying reasons why you have that problem:
1. dont mindlessly send your lings around just to increase apm and because it´s in your loop. you always should have a reason for it. dont spam too fast and mindless, you should be aware if you marked the lings or not.
2. you really should be aware of your lings dying. it should not happen that you didnt realize they were all dead
3. easy solution to your problem: press 1 two times to center the view on your army before moving it, this way you will always realize if they are all dead
@KevJeong:
either you dont have enough roaches, or you are too much on the attacking side. stay defensive, you dont want to kill his army, you want to defend your bases and army. against mass blink stalker without much sentry (->ff) support you definetly want to defend in your choke. you should be able to defend your base against the push (not reattack them), just stay at your base and add some hydras (or infestors) than you can add some drones to saturate your 3 bases too.
to check if you have enough roaches: you should have at least the same amount of minerals in your army the moment he attacks (check in replay - army tab)
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Hey,
I have problems in ZvP transitioning into lategame. My Early and Midgame is quite good and as most of the games don't go longer then 15 minuts I have a winratio of 70% in ZvP right now. But the problem is the lategame.
I'm Top Platin and I always miss the timing when I should put down the Infestation Pit, when to start Lair, Hive and Spire.
So it's pretty much like I stay on my Zergling Roach Army as long as possible and then I get crushed when my opponent manages to get into lategame with Mass Stalker and 4-5 Colossi.
So could somebody give me the rough timings for Lair, Infestation Pit, Hive and Spire?
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On March 16 2012 21:09 roym899 wrote:
Hey,
I have problems in ZvP transitioning into lategame. My Early and Midgame is quite good and as most of the games don't go longer then 15 minuts I have a winratio of 70% in ZvP right now. But the problem is the lategame.
I'm Top Platin and I always miss the timing when I should put down the Infestation Pit, when to start Lair, Hive and Spire.
So it's pretty much like I stay on my Zergling Roach Army as long as possible and then I get crushed when my opponent manages to get into lategame with Mass Stalker and 4-5 Colossi.
So could somebody give me the rough timings for Lair, Infestation Pit, Hive and Spire?
it depends.
Since you said you lose more if the game last longer than 15 mins, I assume you win because you prepare for 2 base all-in and you lose because you didn't prepare for a 3rd from toss.
The ZvP build nowadays tend to be: quick 3 hatch-> 44 ish supply drop 2 gas, 1 evo and a roache warren and lair.
Then you go mass roache at around 50ish drones, defend the all-in
If he didn't do any all-in, apply pressure and drone and tech to infestors and hive
Not sure about the exact supply numbers but just make sure you don't get supply blocked too hard, you drone hard enough, don't make overlords too early.
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No. I'm playing just as u said until roach warren. Then I don't really know what to do. Most times I get Lair + 4th Macro Hatch.
But I think I got it know. I always waited if my opponent attacks me and if not i attacked him and ended the game most of the times, but I should tech while doing this right? I just remaxed behind it and continued attacking.
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On March 16 2012 18:28 Werezerg wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 10:12 RibsNGibs wrote:
Not sure exactly what stephano's method is, but yeah, I'm pretty sure I do - 3szzzzzzzzz, control click the eggs, shift-1. That thing?
Maybe I should switch my "loop" from
make units
inject larva/spread creep
micro army (which is where the problem happens if my army died, and I end up microing the queens instead)
to
iinject larva/spread creep
make units
micro army (so if my entire army died in the meantime, I'll still be rallying my unhatched eggs around).
Hrm.
i do the second loop. (its better for macro if you dont need units immediatly) I think there are some underlying reasons why you have that problem: 1. dont mindlessly send your lings around just to increase apm and because it´s in your loop. you always should have a reason for it. dont spam too fast and mindless, you should be aware if you marked the lings or not. 2. you really should be aware of your lings dying. it should not happen that you didnt realize they were all dead 3. easy solution to your problem: press 1 two times to center the view on your army before moving it, this way you will always realize if they are all dead
Whatever he said, you're thinking way too much. Just practice. Because one day or another, especially when you'll be facing drops and the likes, all your timing will be fucked up (say you need your 2nd queen to come to ur main to deal with banshees for example, then you'd need to wait ur 2nd queen to rejoin the natural so that you can start injecting them all @ the same time... You don't want that right ? So just practice and forget about doing it with a precise order).
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I always inject before making units because as larva pops off you have ~1.5 seconds before they hit the ground. During that time you can be injecting. Then as larva fall you can spend them.
And microing your army shouldnt be part of your loop, thats something you do the rest of the time. What you should be doing is putting your army in a safe place when you are about to spawn larva. Or sacrificing your spawn larva temporarily for some important micro.
EDIT WITH QUESTION:
So i've got a question for highmaster+ zergs (as i am high master and i want very specific advice  )
What is the most optimal response to a terran who places a bunker the second their barracks finishes in one of those chokes in your natural next to minerals?
Its so early that maybe 2 drones is ideal? just poke away at it and risk 20% of the time the scv will be invulnerable cuz you got unlucky then deal with if after? ive pulled 4 drones before and its SO early its a huge deal, and once bunker dies they cant start mining right away cuz of how early the bunker is.
If the bunker is started a little later should i pull 5 drones, dps it down then go back to mining as the hatch finishes?
If the bunker is as the marine reaches my base, marine in a choke should i wait then make 4x lings then pull drones along with the lings?
Sorry its a really basic question but I always get behind when someone does this to me, and i never see pros have a problem with it
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Hi i just switched over to zerg, and im really liking it. especially because i dont have to TvT anymore lol.
i was looking for a good guide for double evo chamber mass zerglings/infestor into ultralisk and broodlords.
i think its stephano style.
thanks.
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I see a lot of Protoss players screaming bloody murder about the "new Stephano" ZvP style.
Does anyone know where I can find a BO of this? I've been out of the loop for a bit and have no idea what this style is.
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Has anyone experimented with the minimum amounts of units required to deal with a medivac drop of 8 marines?
I've noticed I can get away with ~8 lings and 4 banes or some (8-10) lings with an infestor.
I'm curious if 3 hydras and maybe one spine at each base could be better.
The theory craft behind this is that 3 hydras can kill a dropship in 4s. If you keep them patrolling on the ridge of a base you should be able to kill it before a) any marines get out, or b) all marines get out.
Cost-wise 8 lings and 4 banes is cheaper for one encounter, but you have to actively manage it and ensure that they are always alive. If you're dealing with several drops you might not have to replace hydras as frequently, making it a better cost alternative. In addition, you don't necessarily have to get the range upgrade right away so it's just a 100 gas investment to get some drop protection out.
It's just an idea. I am busy atm the moment but I will probably play around with this over the weekend. I'm just checking if the idea is a complete waste of time to test.
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Hi, zerg plat here looking for help with ZvT, I feel a bit off and dont know what to do (when to tech up, take gasses, when to expect timing...)
Here's a replay where I failed miserably against a terran:
http://sc2rep.com/replays/(T)Repeat_vs_(Z)ZorgGG/18784
Thanks for anyone who help.
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On March 17 2012 02:56 Muggs wrote:
Has anyone experimented with the minimum amounts of units required to deal with a medivac drop of 8 marines?
I've noticed I can get away with ~8 lings and 4 banes or some (8-10) lings with an infestor.
I'm curious if 3 hydras and maybe one spine at each base could be better.
The theory craft behind this is that 3 hydras can kill a dropship in 4s. If you keep them patrolling on the ridge of a base you should be able to kill it before a) any marines get out, or b) all marines get out.
Cost-wise 8 lings and 4 banes is cheaper for one encounter, but you have to actively manage it and ensure that they are always alive. If you're dealing with several drops you might not have to replace hydras as frequently, making it a better cost alternative. In addition, you don't necessarily have to get the range upgrade right away so it's just a 100 gas investment to get some drop protection out.
It's just an idea. I am busy atm the moment but I will probably play around with this over the weekend. I'm just checking if the idea is a complete waste of time to test.
2 spines and 1 spore at the typical drop location and a small control group of like 10-15 lings as your drop defenders.
you'd be surprised how often a spore kills the medivac haha. Also 1 spore and 1 fungal = dead medivac if he gets hit like 4 times.
A big part of defending drops imo is catching them before they unload, so keep ur response on standby if you arnt postured to attack your opponent.
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EPT
