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On March 10 2012 08:46 Rednaxela_19 wrote:
I have a question in ZvZ. I am currently a diamond zerg who is having problems vs mutas. What should I do to stop them once i've scouted that coming? I don't really like building hydras because of how slow they are, but it seems weird to me to try to go muta vs muta. what should I do?
Well, there are (as usually) a few ways to handle muta's.
Going for them yourself can work, but I'd not do that as a respons. Yours will be later and you'll probably have less gass. So unless you were going muta's anyway I wouldn't get into them. If you were, you can beat his muta's by getting more armor upgrades, and getting units beneath your muta's when fighting to tank the bounce damage. Of course it tends to help when you pick fights above your own queens or spores.
Alternatively you can stick with ground units and go for either hydra or infestor. It kinda depends on the map what is best, but infestors take a lot longer to get out, because you need an upgrade first. If you do want to go infestors, you'll need a few more spores, say 2 per base.
Finally, no matter what you're going to do, just get 2 queens at every hatch and make sure to connect all of your bases with creep. More creep will be essential later on, because you won't have overlords for map vision and hydra's are damn slow off creep :p
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On March 10 2012 08:46 Rednaxela_19 wrote:
I have a question in ZvZ. I am currently a diamond zerg who is having problems vs mutas. What should I do to stop them once i've scouted that coming? I don't really like building hydras because of how slow they are, but it seems weird to me to try to go muta vs muta. what should I do?
How about it, if you never make a single hydra to counter his mutas, then you're very unlikely going to be master ? Infestors alone won't cut it (unless of course if he's always clumping his mutas). If you can make both it's always great as you'll be doing additionnal dps behind the roaches vs roaches fight. Sure hydras are slow but not as much as you might think !
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Hi i would like to analyze my last game on the ladder. hopefully someone can give a few pointers for what i'm doing right/wrong. and any ideas to help improve my game.
i feel like he made poor decisions and i got lucky in catching his units off guard + him not using them correctly. because this is a bronze match, if anyone can comment on speed and important things i might be missing in my game play it would be awesome. thanks and if anyone watches enjoy =]
replay
http://drop.sc/129203
im zerg
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On March 10 2012 09:35 RaiZ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2012 08:46 Rednaxela_19 wrote:
I have a question in ZvZ. I am currently a diamond zerg who is having problems vs mutas. What should I do to stop them once i've scouted that coming? I don't really like building hydras because of how slow they are, but it seems weird to me to try to go muta vs muta. what should I do? How about it, if you never make a single hydra to counter his mutas, then you're very unlikely going to be master ? Infestors alone won't cut it (unless of course if he's always clumping his mutas). If you can make both it's always great as you'll be doing additionnal dps behind the roaches vs roaches fight. Sure hydras are slow but not as much as you might think !
Grandmaster zerg here; I never go hydras against mutas. They're slow, of course, but the main issue is sheerly how vulnerable they are to banelings. It's best to go roach queen infestor vs muta.
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On March 10 2012 17:39 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2012 09:35 RaiZ wrote:On March 10 2012 08:46 Rednaxela_19 wrote:
I have a question in ZvZ. I am currently a diamond zerg who is having problems vs mutas. What should I do to stop them once i've scouted that coming? I don't really like building hydras because of how slow they are, but it seems weird to me to try to go muta vs muta. what should I do? How about it, if you never make a single hydra to counter his mutas, then you're very unlikely going to be master ? Infestors alone won't cut it (unless of course if he's always clumping his mutas). If you can make both it's always great as you'll be doing additionnal dps behind the roaches vs roaches fight. Sure hydras are slow but not as much as you might think ! Grandmaster zerg here; I never go hydras against mutas. They're slow, of course, but the main issue is sheerly how vulnerable they are to banelings. It's best to go roach queen infestor vs muta.
I'm no master here but you should assess the situation, if you have a better economy (eg. vs 1 base) and a spire go mutas you'll get many more up and win the game with that while in the meantime defend with queens and 1-2 spores, or if you have just the liar build an hydra den (very quick) and get just a few hydras out, wont hurt much  that;s why i always get creep no matter what.
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You have no need to invest in hydra den + hydras against muta unless you want to hit a timing with roach hydra 1/1. if u wait till 2/2, muta/ling bane will roll you. so thats the only thing i can see hydras vs mutas. if u want a longer game, go roach queen infestor and attack with 160 or so supply with 2/2 upgrades. if u transfuse properly, fungal properly, u should destroy whatever army he has.
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Not really help but i have a question about mutas.
Most of you should know that mutas stack when being grouped with an overlord in a different way then when you just spam the ground when not having an overlord in your control group. Mutas basicly stack the whole time when being grouped with an OL.
So i have messed around a bit and it seems like you can make the mutas attack in a similiar way as in BW, you shoot, fly back, shoot fly back, and this way it atleast looks like all my mutas attack when doing this.
I don't know about what other players have tried but wouldn't this be really useful in alot of situations, you could snipe stuff much easier, just slowly make an army crumble while not taking much/any damage(like you would when you would a-move) Maybe even muta vs muta battles? Isn't it much more cost effective? You could do alot with your mutas.
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On March 11 2012 00:05 Guamshin wrote:
Most of you should know that mutas stack when being grouped with an overlord in a different way then when you just spam the ground when not having an overlord in your control group. Mutas basicly stack the whole time when being grouped with an OL.
Are you sure? I thought that was just in BW?
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It works in sc2 aswell but... It's still nowhere like the bw's one.
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Is it possible to play cloud kingdom without mutas in ZvT? Every time I try, I get drop harassed like crazy. He drops the bottom/cliff of my 4th, I lose tons of stuff. He drops outside range of my 3rd, kills stuff then drops at my main. Drops out of range for 5th, kills stuff there. I just cant figure out a way to play it without mutas.
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Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors?
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On March 11 2012 04:53 TheRabidDeer wrote:
Is it possible to play cloud kingdom without mutas in ZvT? Every time I try, I get drop harassed like crazy. He drops the bottom/cliff of my 4th, I lose tons of stuff. He drops outside range of my 3rd, kills stuff then drops at my main. Drops out of range for 5th, kills stuff there. I just cant figure out a way to play it without mutas.
Of course it's possible.
There is a lack of safe OL air locations on Cloud Kingdom, so you have to use lings as air scouts a lot of the time. I can draw you a paint map or something of where you should have your lings, around the edges. If the Terran starts getting wise to it and killing your lings, you need to start burrowing them. Which limits their vision, so you're going to need SICK mini map awareness. It's hard, but possible, especially at anything mid masters and below.
I prefer mutas though.
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On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors?
Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count.
Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods.
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On March 11 2012 05:44 Flonomenalz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors? Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count. Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods.
I know that I should get Broods but before Broods, what is the best composition I should get?
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On March 11 2012 06:02 beetlelisk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2012 05:44 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors? Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count. Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods. I know that I should get Broods but before Broods, what is the best composition I should get?
Roach/Ling/Infestor/Corruptor with as many spines as possible. Only engage with spines or with a very good surround. You're going to have to fungal stalkers, focus colossi with corruptors and contaminate them. I'd say 4 infestors is a good number, you don't want to make too many early. Once the major engagement is over, SAVE YOUR WEAK CORRUPTORS and morph them to broods.
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On March 11 2012 06:08 Flonomenalz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2012 06:02 beetlelisk wrote:On March 11 2012 05:44 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors? Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count. Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods. I know that I should get Broods but before Broods, what is the best composition I should get? Roach/Ling/Infestor/Corruptor with as many spines as possible. Only engage with spines or with a very good surround. You're going to have to fungal stalkers, focus colossi with corruptors and contaminate them. I'd say 4 infestors is a good number, you don't want to make too many early. Once the major engagement is over, SAVE YOUR WEAK CORRUPTORS and morph them to broods.
Are zerglings worth making? Don't they die to splash too fast? Isn't it better to make like 1 infestor or Corruptor less and for that gas more Roaches instead of lings?
Also are there any means to control number of Protoss bases? You are saying to make spines and wait until Broods but Protoss is free to do watever he wants then.
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Okay, i was doing 2 base muta on TDA vs. a toss that 1 gate FE'd, and i scouted him at 6:00 and saw basically nothing, and then when i had my mutas in his base i saw him doing an 8 gate +2 blink stalker all in. What exactly are you supposed to do to hold that off? Or is 2 base muta a BO loss vs. that?
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On March 11 2012 06:23 beetlelisk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2012 06:08 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 06:02 beetlelisk wrote:On March 11 2012 05:44 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors? Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count. Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods. I know that I should get Broods but before Broods, what is the best composition I should get? Roach/Ling/Infestor/Corruptor with as many spines as possible. Only engage with spines or with a very good surround. You're going to have to fungal stalkers, focus colossi with corruptors and contaminate them. I'd say 4 infestors is a good number, you don't want to make too many early. Once the major engagement is over, SAVE YOUR WEAK CORRUPTORS and morph them to broods. Are zerglings worth making? Don't they die to splash too fast? Isn't it better to make like 1 infestor or Corruptor less and for that gas more Roaches instead of lings? Also are there any means to control number of Protoss bases? You are saying to make spines and wait until Broods but Protoss is free to do watever he wants then.
Well it's dependent on map and stuff. Generally want you want to do is deny the 3rd base as long as possible with roach/ling. Once they get a large enough Colossus count to take their third, you should have 5 bases and teching to broods.
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On March 11 2012 06:58 Flonomenalz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2012 06:23 beetlelisk wrote:On March 11 2012 06:08 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 06:02 beetlelisk wrote:On March 11 2012 05:44 Flonomenalz wrote:On March 11 2012 05:23 beetlelisk wrote:
Assuming our upgrades match, what is the best composition zerg can do against Stalker Sentry Colossus?
Roaches Corruptors and Hydras or Infestors? Depends on the Protoss' Colossus count. Lower counts, you can go roach bane drop, or roach infestor. Higher Colossus counts require Corruptors or Broods. I know that I should get Broods but before Broods, what is the best composition I should get? Roach/Ling/Infestor/Corruptor with as many spines as possible. Only engage with spines or with a very good surround. You're going to have to fungal stalkers, focus colossi with corruptors and contaminate them. I'd say 4 infestors is a good number, you don't want to make too many early. Once the major engagement is over, SAVE YOUR WEAK CORRUPTORS and morph them to broods. Are zerglings worth making? Don't they die to splash too fast? Isn't it better to make like 1 infestor or Corruptor less and for that gas more Roaches instead of lings? Also are there any means to control number of Protoss bases? You are saying to make spines and wait until Broods but Protoss is free to do watever he wants then. Well it's dependent on map and stuff. Generally want you want to do is deny the 3rd base as long as possible with roach/ling. Once they get a large enough Colossus count to take their third, you should have 5 bases and teching to broods.
kk thanks
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EPT
