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On July 26 2010 23:25 Rhyme wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2010 23:16 General-Gouda wrote:
I can see this as a viable way to get a couple of spine crawlers up at a base's ramp entrance. Could this be a possible way to create a quick wall in for zerg?
Such as, throw down a hatch, cancel, put down a creep tumor, build an evolution chamber in a position similar to where you would place a gateway or pylon as Protoss, build a spine crawler (or 3) behind the evolution chamber then choke up the wall in with zerglings.
I've been toying with the idea of using a hatchery to block off a ramp partially but I think this would be more economical. this. omg this. i've been thinking about that too, and i think this has awesome potential for hiding baneling nests and roach warrens in addition to creating the first ever zerg wall off 
Hrmm...it would require a quick pool and a quick queen in order to accomplish properly but unless the map is blistering sands with a back door this could be a good way to keep rushes out of your main. However, since most zerg like to FE it wouldn't really protect the natural and would probably only serve to slow it down. However, for 1 base plays like 1 base muta it might work well and really help with defenses. Besides, getting a quick Evolution Chamber up is never a bad thing in my opinion.
PS: I forgot to say great OP earlier.
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Interesting idea... I'll try something out with this, thanks for brining the idea on the table! .
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When queens were faster off-creep, koreans used to abuse this by running a queen to the enemy base, place a creep tumor on thus created creep and spine-crawler push the oponent.
Thus the queen speed nerf.
Other than that, I doubt this is very useful to begin with tbh.
Perhaps in ZvZ it might be used to morph a spine crawler into a hidden part of their base, and then burrow it in their mineral line.
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On July 26 2010 23:36 fdsdfg wrote:
This is exactly why they nerfed the Queen's movement off creep - players would bring a couple drones and queen to the opponent's base, make this creep pile, plant a tumor, and build spine crawlers. Reinforce with an army, grow the tumor and push with the spine crawlers.
Now that the queen is an idiot, there's no viable way to get persistent creep down unless you proxy hatchery or tech to lair - and neither of those are fast enough really.
/thread.
This 'trick' is no longer viable because of queens off-creep speed.
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there has been videos of this before the queen speed nerf off creep, i remember somebody trying it against me in phase one before the nerf, that failed pretty hard althrought this tactic was a lot of fun i don't think we'll see it anymore 
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I just thought of another possible use for this.
Build a proxy hatch on the low ground below their base (at a ridge not a ramp), when it's done run drones up and do the cancel hatch in their base, the proxy hatch will maintain and spread the creep from below.
On desert oasis (and possibly other maps) this could be used to place spines in mineral line, while at the same time spamming zerglings from 2 hatches.
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On July 26 2010 23:58 shawabawa wrote:
Build a proxy hatch on the low ground below their base (at a ridge not a ramp), when it's done run drones up and do the cancel hatch in their base, the proxy hatch will maintain and spread the creep from below.
I like this idea, I still think the best thing for this though could be making baneling busts more viable again.
The most common response when someone asks about how to baneling bust a terran is "don't do it because they'll scout it and then build a more durable wall-in"
What if you make it in some obscure part of the map? Is delaying it worth the cost of 75 minerals and lost time? Also, can you fly an overlord over there as well and get a lair up in time so as to not lose the baneling nest.
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I play terran so this may or may not be viable but I would like to offer a cheese opportunity for ZvP. The timing for this probably wont work out since it requires a spawning pool first but who knows.
Is it possible for you to 6pool and have enough money to drop a hatch in their base before the gateway begins in a standard protoss opening? If so you could delay your zerglings by dropping the spine crawler right next to their pylon. Without a gateway finished yet you will have time for the crawler to finish and it can begin poking at the pylon while your zerglings show up shortly thereafter to harass probes.
Not to mention any 6pool could always benefit from a spine crawler too.
This should work if you can get the crawler down before or just after the gateway begins
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How about using it to hide a roach warren to throw your opponent off?
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On July 27 2010 00:23 Grend wrote:
How about using it to hide a roach warren to throw your opponent off?
that could work, but smart players will notice various clues:
-you are getting gas, but don't have lair or baneling nest
-not many lings
-no expansion
At the very least, your opponent will know you are preparing some kind of 1-base attack and will get more defense
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Does the creep stay there? If it doesn't the building will die. I tried this already testing a hidden spire with an overlord spawning creep then leaving. the spire died.
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Hidden proxy spire with creep tumor should be possible.
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On July 27 2010 00:57 Dinn wrote:
Does the creep stay there? If it doesn't the building will die. I tried this already testing a hidden spire with an overlord spawning creep then leaving. the spire died.
For the spire, use the overlord creeping vomit since you obviously have lair it's possible, just anticipate and send an overlord to the right spot.
This thing is already being used a lot and you don't have to waste 75 minerals for this.
Edit : if you're afraid of vikings sniping the overlord keeping the spire alive, you can put a creep tumor of course, but you don't need the hatchery cancelling trick.
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Not only can you hide things, I could see this being useful to block expos. Interesting creep harass ideas.
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i used this trick once or twice against zergs who fastexp, once their hatchery is up it will spread creep that will keep the spine crawler alive
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any chance of doing this to block the final building of a walloff long enough to rush lings in?
like where the tech lab would be placed in a depot/rax/addon walloff?
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On July 27 2010 00:23 Grend wrote:
How about using it to hide a roach warren to throw your opponent off?
Meh, this seems poor, as the Warren will start to bleed and die. Also, you'd have to be fast, because the creep will recede quickly. Much better to hide a Spire somewhere under a Lairtech ovie. Surprise mutas! :o
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Listen to what you described. A 7 pool at the speed of a 10 pool. That's basically like playing bad/afk enough so that your all-in has already lost its window of opportunity. A 7 pool doesn't rely on surprise as much as it does on a really fast attack that your opponent shouldn't be ready enough for, even if scouted (which of course isn't to say that scouting isn't the key to shutting this down).
Nice try, but I see next to zero potential with this aspect of the game.
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its really strong for hiding banelingnest in zvt
14 gas
14 pool
get metabolic
get 2 lings to kill svc
hide banelingnest, terran will scan your main for sure and if there is no baneling nest and no lair coming he feels save and think you got expo
there will be no bunker behind wall and no bigger buldings behind his depot
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This type of cheese sounds like suicide to me. You're delaying enough that Terran will be walled off already. Hell, you're delaying your 6 pool long enough that a normal scout time would see it. If I got to a Zergs base and saw 6 Drones and no buildings I'd immediately go mass Marine. Hell, by then I'd probably have enough SCVs to kill off your Zerglings.
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EPT
